VC help

[Ric of The LBC]

Played RPT58 Sikh Defiance on Saturday at the SoCal Gameday.

Please provide your interpretation of the VC. This uses board w.

 

[Gordon]

Bonus points if your reply is in the form of an interpretive dance ...

 

[Ric of The LBC]

Bonus points if your reply is in the form of an interpretive dance ...

Duh!, I thought everybody knew that.

 

[Justiciar]

Left foot forward: strict approach...all 3 MMC must be in the same building (de facto the same hill hex)...
Left foot backstep: looser view 3 MMC can be in any number of buildings on any hill hexes.
Bow.

 

[Ric of The LBC]

Left foot forward: strict approach...all 3 MMC must be in the same building (de facto the same hill hex)...
Left foot backstep: looser view 3 MMC can be in any number of buildings on any hill hexes.
Bow.

Yes, but which one? It makes a big difference.

 

[WuWei]

As it stands: They must be in a (1, one, the same) building on a (1, one, the same) hill hex. But I find it somewhat likely that's not the intention of the author. Best ask him!

 

[Justiciar]

Yes, but which one? It makes a big difference.

Left foot forward.

However, in general the history of VC of this type tends to be Left foot back step.

 

[Justiciar]

As it stands: They must be in a (1, one, the same) building on a (1, one, the same) hill hex. But I find it somewhat likely that's not the intention of the author. Best ask him!

SP Enterprises has no errata website and rarely answers such questions here.

 

[Robin Reeve]

a building can also mean "any building"
a hill can also mean "any hill"

I would read the VC as allowing the 3+ MMC to be in same or different buildings on same or different hills.

 

[Justiciar]

And you know as one who studies texts...that "a" can indeed mean the singular and only the singular...esp when used as such twice in a row a building and a hill hex...

Now an analyses of such ASL texts does give credence to the wider more liberal interpretation you note and as I noted upstream...

But reading the letter of the law...it is all in 1 building....the spirit of the law is the 3 can by dispersed over 3 buildings on 3 different hills...

 

[Gordon]

And you know as one who studies texts...that "a" can indeed mean the singular and only the singular...esp when used as such twice in a row a building and a hill hex...

Now an analyses of such ASL texts does give credence to the wider more liberal interpretation you note and as I noted upstream...

But reading the letter of the law...it is all in 1 building....the spirit of the law is the 3 can by dispersed over 3 buildings on 3 different hills...

And I suppose that next you'll claim that they have to be on a board that's in play.

 

[fenyan]

I just noticed it says "The Indians win at game if..." instead of "The Indians win at game end if..."

When my game wrapped up, I went over and looked at Ric's game. I saw the Sikhs on different hills, and when I glanced at the VC I thought they could be in different buildings.

Reading the VC again, one can see the letter of the law interpretation.

 

[Gordon]

Indians got game.

 

[Vinnie]

Indians got game.

Not today, the Bangladeshis are kicking butt!

 

[kempenfelter]

As to the Mission(Sherry Enterprises' way of saying Victory Conditions)for Sikh Defiance perhaps someone who knows Hugh Downing can ask him. He designed it way back when. My personal viewpoint is that "a" does not necessarily mean "one". It can also mean "any". The notes--Advice to the British(Indian)player: if you spread out your defense, the German player must spread out his attack--also suggest any Good Order MMC in any building counts for the win.

Looking at the situation again I wonder if the Sikhs could prevail through deployment. It would take a few turns but it would give the Germans a lot to do, especially if some AFV crews survive.

 

[Justiciar]

As to the Mission(Sherry Enterprises' way of saying Victory Conditions)for Sikh Defiance perhaps someone who knows Hugh Downing can ask him. He designed it way back when. My personal viewpoint is that "a" does not necessarily mean "one". It can also mean "any". The notes--Advice to the British(Indian)player: if you spread out your defense, the German player must spread out his attack--also suggest any Good Order MMC in any building counts for the win.

Looking at the situation again I wonder if the Sikhs could prevail through deployment. It would take a few turns but it would give the Germans a lot to do, especially if some AFV crews survive.

The advice notes seem to support your interpretation and the "spirit of the law" view noted upstream.
Hope your posts helps Ric of LBC.

 

[djohannsen]

Left foot forward: strict approach...all 3 MMC must be in the same building (de facto the same hill hex)...
Left foot backstep: looser view 3 MMC can be in any number of buildings on any hill hexes.
Bow.

I would interpret as "left foot forward," otherwise the scenario designer would have worded the VC "...Good Order MMC in buildings on hill hexes."

Of course this is the interpretation of a noob, so feel free to disregard.

 

[Justiciar]

I would interpret as "left foot forward," otherwise the scenario designer would have worded the VC "...Good Order MMC in buildings on hill hexes."

Of course this is the interpretation of a noob, so feel free to disregard.

No, I think this is SP errata, which they don't cop to that often. Post 15 has key info that clues one into the fact that Left Foot Backward is the better interpretation.

 

[djohannsen]

No, I think this is SP errata, which they don't cop to that often. Post 15 has key info that clues one into the fact that Left Foot Backward is the better interpretation.

Ah, I see the excerpt from the designer's notes now (i.e., in Post 15). I stand corrected.

 

[jrv]

"The Indians win at game [sic] if they have ≥ 3 Good Order MMC(s) in a building on a hill hex."

Bonus question: how could the plural "(s)" be optional (as implied by putting the "s" in parentheses) if you have to have ≥ 3 of them? Can you win with one really big MMC?

JR