? well it gives you an edge. I need all the help I can get...It is not easy playing against a Finn when they slip into using their native language. Tuomo would be muttering under his breath and CLAIMING to be counting Movement Factors, but was he really just calling my mama fat?
You can see me moving one squad halfway there on turn 2. In turn 3 I realize it is not going got happen and run away.As Martin, Dave, and others have said, 19X6 seems like a Fools Dream for the Russians. Not worth it - too hard to hold.
Yeah, I thought it would be fun to compare their performance as game progressed. It was good that our hosts noticed it about turn 3 giving me a great set-up for my mid game commentary.Loved that Tuomo named his tanks Dave and Martin
You got me there, the use of 10-2 was a nice move and I really did not see that one. When the KV named Dave did not manage to do anything in bounding fire about them I had no choice than to risk it. It worked, this time. One of the many "what if" moments of this match.I'm happy that my Fancy MMG Firelane Trick with the HIP 10-2 worked, but one will note that the Russians gleefully ran through said firelane on both turns 2 and 3 with nary a scratch. FRUSTRATING!
Well I was bothered by that- but I felt I did not have the resources. I needed to get the god damn buildings. and takin the two 2 hex buildings in the village was more that keeping the one hex building in the back.German 2 - Dave and Martin felt like there were too many Germans coming in on the east side of board 19. It was just 467/LMG and two HS, one of which had the MTR and really wasn't going to do much except sit in that woods line and throw meatballs toward bd17 all game. Sure, one could say this was an unnecessary dilution of the German reinforcements, but I like to pressure my opponent's flank because some people really don't like that. Didn't seem to bother Tuomo too much; he didn't divert much of anything to stop them and managed to break the 467 when it finally did make its dash to threaten 17I8, but I still feel like this was a good idea.
And to clarify - after the PzIV was stunned I decided to wait until final fire to get better DRM for the MA shot and claim acquisition for even better DRMs for the Prep fire shot. But Dave just HAD TO gack that one. Dave Dave Dave... After that malf it was about the buildings. If I had killed the Pz IV I'd probably hunted down the one in X3 and then on to the Immobilized dude.German 4 - Yes, it was Dave's MGs that Stunned my CE tank. Shouldn't have taken that risk; I went CE in order to get 1 more MP out of the turn by using Road Movement. Totally not worth it. Totally bailed out by the Dice Gods.
Ugh!Loved having my wounded 6+1 succeed in his Escape Attempt DR and create a Melee with his broken Guards. Helped block off that hex from Russians reinforcing P9.
It was a good idea to put on the pressure. But I think you went unit or two too far with that.Why were the Germans so aggressive in taking back P9? Shrug. The infantry reinforcements really weren't gonna jump off from the 17U9 woods line and make a push for the buildings on the west side of town. I thought P9 was the key to everything at that point, as it lets you push into the N9 woods and threaten all of the town, including I8. So I wanted to grab it while it was unoccupied. But yeah, I started getting into that "in for a penny, in for a pound" thing, where the first semi-aggressive move fails, so you just keep on reinforcing failure. Especially on turn 5's disastrous moves where I couldn't survive a 2-flat RFP shot to save my life.
There was precious little trouble available there for a KV-2....Yes, the TCA change for the immobilized tank in 19N7 was to cover the west side in case a KV-2 came looking for trouble.
Actually I tried twice- on turn 5 rally as that stun PzIV was still in my sights - I figured getting that out would have had long term value for me to justify the risk and the endgame proved it. And again in the last rally when I desperately needed everything. But Dave failed to deliver...Tuomo did the right thing by not trying to fix Dave's MA; the tank was better off as a mobile MG platform.
That CH took away some of the trouble I got in when Dave's MA malfunctioned. and hey, two TH rolls with an average of 7! Who can complain?Our game didn't turn into a "Benny Hill" scenario with KV2's chasing MkIVs, but I wouldn't have minded that. I'd think the MkIVs could win that race, being faster with lots of cover to duck behind. But tell that to the guy in X3 who found himself with few good options once Martin trundled up to X5. Somehow I thought there was more cover with all the Woods hexes to Bypass behind, but nope. Had Martin not scored with that Advancing Fire Critical Hit, that MkIV was actually going to start G5 by plowing into the building in W3, just to get out of Martin's LOS. The other KV2 (Dave) in V3 might have been a tad surprised (visions of the Kool Aid Man breaking through the building shouting OHHH YEAHHH!) but he didn't have a MA to object with.
Yes - with hindsight you are right. U5 could have been dealt with Dave. But I was short on MPs after that glorious HS overrun.In retrospect, think how things would have been different if Martin had spent turn 6 moving back to the middle of town instead of cleaning up U5. Would have kept the German tanks from doing those fancy things during their turn 6. Funny how one little less-than-optimal move can have such huge impact.
Double funny- I did not think of it either. Pre game I kinda figured W3/W4 was the farthest I could realistically get into. So I did not see that building during the endgame at all. Tunnel vision kicked in.Russian 6 - funny, I didn't even think about the Russians continuing from W3/W4 to take the building in CC3. Would have helped the Russians.
I think you needed 3 points on the ESB roll. Making it even more gutsy move.German 7:
PzIV in O6 moves through KV's hex, into bypass of P4, tries his sD7 but fails. Loops around the western side of Q4, stops in R4, takes an 8+1 BFF MG shot at the 447/LMG in R5, who Pins. Goes CE, moves to T5, ESB's and asks for 2 more, succeeds, moves into bypass of U5-U6, ends in Motion. We thought this would help with VCs since that was still a German-controlled Building Hex at the time. We THOUGHT that in order to retake the building hex, the Russians would need to pass a PAATC in order to advance in to the hex. Hope that was right.
TRIPLE UGH!!!PzIV in P6 moves down into bypass of P4, tries his sD7 but fails, goes to O4, stops, nails KV2 with a BFF TH DR of 5, TK DR of 3 (final TK # was 4). KV-2 crew survives. tank continues to O3 and stops, facing P4
467/MMG in P6 assault move over the wall to Q6, get hit with a 6-down-1 shot from the Pinned 447/LMG in R5, K/2 result, surviving HS BH's, goes berserk, charges R5, survives SFF sho
HS in P9 cx's to S7, survives a 4-2 from the 9-0,447 in P4L1, boxcars. advances in to retake bldg.
The usual counter-argument, but It's a lot worse and you are 'truly pure' not to be playing that way and good for you. As I'm equally sure you are not in the least hesitant using VBM freeze and you shouldn't be, because it's a baked-in tactic that is ASL to the bone. Whether one thinks it should exist or not.Oh, I dunno. I've never done it myself but have been tempted. It is a bit at odds with the intent of the deploying rules but it's certainly no worse than how the VB Freeze sleaze can be used/abused (or the fact that it even exists).
It's overboard to take this personally. I was responding to Tuomo's point in his lengthy post and hadn't in the least paid attention to your activities, nor cited them. In fact I am in agreement with the idea that guards be allowed to deploy once -- that is, one time -- in order to handle prisoners. I'm obviously pointing to distorted play as a problem, not good play. cheersFor the record, I only deployed one squad at the moment I captured the wounded 6+1. I never transferred them for deployment purposes.
So I think it is a bit overboard to complain about this here at this leght....
Be that as it may it is one of the gaps in reality with the real world that exists in the game. I don't know where the idea came from but it is at odds with everything I learned as a soldier and the use of armour. Overruns and collapsing trenches is one thing, and is historically defensible. Parking a tank adjacent to stand of woods or a building and inviting everything from a flaming bottle of Calvados to grenades to a Bazooka round so an entire platoon can run up to said position unscathed is simply not (and would not have been) done, in Motion or otherwise.The usual counter-argument, but It's a lot worse and you are 'truly pure' not to be playing that way and good for you. As I'm equally sure you are not in the least hesitant using VBM freeze and you shouldn't be, because it's a baked-in tactic that is ASL to the bone. Whether one thinks it should exist or not.... <snip>...
With this I agree,.... but like VBM Freeze, it is allowed and we would have to deal with it, sleaze or not. I would note that passing prisoners around enough to deploy sufficient squads to matter would take time the Soviet player likely does not have....<snip>... It's absolutely the cheesiest of cheese to do this as VBM pales in comparison.
Thanks for the comment.Two comments
Against Tom's setup, there is no reason not to armoured assault & double time a platoon with a leader down the road. You can get 9 or 10 hexes forward on turn 1 in relative safety
Tom is absolutely right that Russian Turn 6 was the turning point. The 6+1 should have double timed for DMing duty and fire absorption. Then the 237 and 7-0 could have followed if required. The 236 should have gone to I7 and advanced into the building.
I'm of the camp that says if it's in the rules, it's not a sleaze. If either is an issue in a scenario, I wouldOh, I dunno. I've never done it myself but have been tempted. It is a bit at odds with the intent of the deploying rules but it's certainly no worse than how the VB Freeze sleaze can be used/abused (or the fact that it even exists).