Entrenchment

Tue

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Hi,

When digging in a unit is there a formula behind which entrenchment level it reaches? And does it increase over time or do I have to order it to dig in every turn to reach fortified status?

Thanks,
Tue
 

JAMiAM

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Tue said:
When digging in a unit is there a formula behind which entrenchment level it reaches?
Yes, but only Norm knows for sure what the exact parameters and ranges are.

Some guidelines though, based on a few games and casual observations... ;)

When initially digging in from any of the mobile, or reserve deployment modes, you will go at least to defending mode. Your unit will be more likely to go directly to entrenched mode, from mobile (or directly from defending to fortified) given an already high entrenchment level for the hex, and/or the presence of equipment in the hex which have engineering capability.

I believe that the base probability of being able to make these two state jumps is directly proportional to the entrenchment level of the hex, but there seem to be some modifications to this. Positive mods seem to be total engineering assets in the hex. Negative mods seem to be size of the unit, based on the scale of the hex. I cannot accurately quantify either, though... :cry:

Unit proficiency may also play a role, but I haven't seen enough evidence to support that view.

Tue said:
And does it increase over time or do I have to order it to dig in every turn to reach fortified status?
You'll have to order it to dig in each turn.
 
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LaPalice

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I thought that as soon as a unit is in a fortified mode, it automatically increases each turn, but not as many as if you give the order to dig in.

LaPalice.
 

Kraut

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Something I've always pondered: Is there a difference between a fortified unit in a 1% entrenchment hex or the same unit in a 100% entrenchment hex? (I dont think so)
Is there a difference between a fortified unit in a 100% hex and a fortified unit in a fortification hex? And does it matter on what hex border this fortification is drawn relatively to the attacking direction ?
Is there a differenc between a unit in mobile deployment in a hex with 0% entrenchment and in a hex with 100% entrenchment?
Does a unit in mobile deployment in a fortification hex get's any bonus in combat ?
 

mr_clark

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Kraut said:
Something I've always pondered: Is there a difference between a fortified unit in a 1% entrenchment hex or the same unit in a 100% entrenchment hex? (I dont think so)
Is there a difference between a fortified unit in a 100% hex and a fortified unit in a fortification hex? And does it matter on what hex border this fortification is drawn relatively to the attacking direction ?
Is there a differenc between a unit in mobile deployment in a hex with 0% entrenchment and in a hex with 100% entrenchment?
Does a unit in mobile deployment in a fortification hex get's any bonus in combat ?
Isn't that all in the manual???
 

Dicke Bertha

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Will digging in (from mobile, dug-in, entrenched status) eat up supply and readiness, and if so, how much?

Follow up question, are there negative aspects about digging in? E.g. will digging in a unit which is in poor supply, readiness, and has little movement left, make it more vulnerable if/when it is retreated out of the hex due to enemy attack (will it take more casualitites, be easier to evaporate etc because its movement was at zero when the turn ended)?
 

laszlo.nemedi

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I am always happy to see my units in a 100% hex. That's why if I achive the fortified status, but below 100%, I make them mobile and dig in again to push up the entrenchment percentage.
 

Kraut

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mr_clark said:
Isn't that all in the manual???
As far as I know, no (haven't read the thing since a loong time ;) ), it only says that units have an easier time to dig in in a hex if the entrechment level is higher and that hexes with a fortification always start at 100%. Obviously the fortification status of a unit influence it's defencive strength, as does the defence terrain (ruined urban is always a plus ;) ) but I don't remember ever reading whether the difference entrenchment levels have any influence other than helping a unit to fortify at a higher percentage.
 

laszlo.nemedi

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Well it seems the entrenchment percent is not important in the battle (there is no modifier at least for the percentage).

However if you do 100% entrenched hexes in your back you can fall back to that hexes and you can get more easily to fortified status.
 

JAMiAM

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Kovi did some tests a while back that demonstrated that the "fortified" hex tile does have an effect on the combat strengths.

Otherwise, disregarding basic tile characteristics, the level of entrenchment has no direct influence over the combat strengths of the units, only on the ability to dig in.
 

JAMiAM

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Dicke Bertha said:
Will digging in (from mobile, dug-in, entrenched status) eat up supply and readiness, and if so, how much?

Follow up question, are there negative aspects about digging in? E.g. will digging in a unit which is in poor supply, readiness, and has little movement left, make it more vulnerable if/when it is retreated out of the hex due to enemy attack (will it take more casualitites, be easier to evaporate etc because its movement was at zero when the turn ended)?
No, and no. This is based on CoW. Earlier versions may have had different behavior with 0 MP's remaining.
 

JAMiAM

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laszlo.nemedi said:
I am always happy to see my units in a 100% hex. That's why if I achive the fortified status, but below 100%, I make them mobile and dig in again to push up the entrenchment percentage.
I do the same thing. I'm incredibly obsessive when it comes to micromanaging seemingly inconsequential stuff like this. Especially on long games, and for inactive portions of the front.

Like Bobby Lee, you can call me "The King of Spades"... ;)
 

JAMiAM

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Tue said:
And does it increase over time or do I have to order it to dig in every turn to reach fortified status?
Oops! I screwed up on my previous reply to this question. They do continue to attempt digging in each turn. This will raise the entrenchment level of the hex, until the point where all of the units have reached fortified deployment. After they have all reached fortified deployment, then there is no further increase, unless you set units to mobile and restart the digging in process.

A quick hotseat test of Arracourt '44, will show this behaviour.
 

laszlo.nemedi

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JAMiAM said:
I do the same thing. I'm incredibly obsessive when it comes to micromanaging seemingly inconsequential stuff like this. Especially on long games, and for inactive portions of the front.

Like Bobby Lee, you can call me "The King of Spades"... ;)
Recently I am playing my first DnO as Soviet and most of my time is for making high percentage hexes around Moscow and Kiev, etc.

Somehow boring but I feel I have to do it :nuts:
"King of Spades", lol, I love it :D
 

Dicke Bertha

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JAMiAM said:
Kovi did some tests a while back that demonstrated that the "fortified" hex tile does have an effect on the combat strengths.

Otherwise, disregarding basic tile characteristics, the level of entrenchment has no direct influence over the combat strengths of the units, only on the ability to dig in.
Thanks, Jam, thus a unit fortified at 50% indication in a hex doesn't get dug-out easier than if fortified at 100%? The sole pupose of reaching 100% fortification (going mobile, then shovelling dirt again) for a hex is thus to make digging-in easier for any other unit attempting to dig-in in that hex?

You know a fool can ask more questions than a hundred wise can answer:
Can the % fortification of a hex be altered by combat (enemy artillery etc) or is it permanent once achieved?

And will the enemy gain/experience the percentage fortification status of a hex once taken?

My experience says no and yes respectively, but then there is the disclaimed moron warning :surprise: :cheeky:
 

Tue

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JAMiAM said:
Oops! I screwed up on my previous reply to this question. They do continue to attempt digging in each turn. This will raise the entrenchment level of the hex, until the point where all of the units have reached fortified deployment. After they have all reached fortified deployment, then there is no further increase, unless you set units to mobile and restart the digging in process.

A quick hotseat test of Arracourt '44, will show this behaviour.
Thank you. Will try it when I get home.
 

rasmus

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A quick way to increase your entrenchment is to divide your units into three subunits, dig in two them, then recombine and dig in again. This will raise you entrenchment faster than just digging in the full unit.
 

Davich

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rasmus said:
A quick way to increase your entrenchment is to divide your units into three subunits, dig in two them, then recombine and dig in again. This will raise you entrenchment faster than just digging in the full unit.
The down side to this is that your unit, when recombined, is at only 88% of it's original proficiency. This is a permanent loss.

Regarding entrenchments, "The presence of units with an engineering capability increases the chance or entrenching or fortifying."

Each turn you attempt to entrench raises the entrenchment level of the hex even if you are unsuccessful. Field fortifications are supposed to be permanent making it easier for subsequent units to entrench. However, when a hex changes hand the entrenchment level drops by 25%.

All of this is according to the manual which I have been forced to read because of a current game of DNO against Dicke whom, I'm sure, will sack me.
 

Kraut

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Davich said:
The down side to this is that your unit, when recombined, is at only 88% of it's original proficiency. This is a permanent loss.
Nope , that once was the case but was changed in one of the CoW patches, I don't know in which but the 1.04 patch certainly no longer has this penalty. You can divide an reunite a unit as often as you wich without suffering a proficiency penalty. Oh, sure, the divided subunits have a slightly lower proficiency, but once reunited the original proficiency is restored.
 

Kraut

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rasmus said:
A quick way to increase your entrenchment is to divide your units into three subunits, dig in two them, then recombine and dig in again. This will raise you entrenchment faster than just digging in the full unit.
That goes as cheating in my book, same as splitting up an engineer, trying to repair a bridge/RR with 2 of the 3 thirds, reuniting the unit, splitting it up again in thirds, repeat step one. It was certainly not intended that way by TOAW and you are exploiting a bug here.
 
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