A9.222 Fire Lane vs Impulse movement : separate Drs or not?

[Robin Reeve]

B9.22 says : "When a Fire Lane is placed due to a First Fire attack vs a unit using some form of Impulse movement (13.62; 5.232; D14.2; E11.2; E11.52), its Fire Lane Residual FP immediately attacks all other elements of that Impulse currently in any Location(s) where that Residual FP now exists."

Does "immediately attacks" imply that one uses the initial DR of the attack that created the FL against the other elements of the Impulse?
Or does one roll one DR for all the FL RF attacks?
Or does one roll a DR per each element attacked?

 

[Treadhead]

My understanding is that each Location containing a Fire Lane Residual FP would be resolved individually, after resolving the original attack that placed the Fire Lane, but before any other actions are taken.

After the original attack, immediately make separate Residual FP DRs for each Location in the Fire Lane containing an enemy unit vulnerable to Residual FP.


Regards,
Bruce

 

[Tater]

My understanding is that each Location containing a Fire Lane Residual FP would be resolved individually, after resolving the original attack that placed the Fire Lane, but before any other actions are taken.

After the original attack, immediately make separate Residual FP DRs for each Location in the Fire Lane containing an enemy unit vulnerable to Residual FP.

But Brucster, where would the moving units be located for DFire purposes...under the RFP counter, or on top of it???

:clown:

 

[geezer]

Good question. I'd go with the first option and i'd use only the original DR for all the attacks. I have nothing to prove that it should be played that way it's only my opinion. If I had to say why i'd play it like that, i'd say because the ASLRB seems to favour rolling less DRs then more. Spraying fire would be an example and so is A0.5. Rolling many DRs would probably be a bad thing for the defender as it means an increased chance of breaking his MG. I'd see it as as the sqauds actually moving at the same time and the MG shooting in the gereral direction of the enemy (not trying to aim at every soldier) and thus consider it as one shot.

My arguments ARE weak (no need to point it out Tater ) but again, its only my opinion

 

[Robin Reeve]

Additional question : what happens when, say, a HW enters different hexes of a firelane simultaneously?
I would roll different DRs per hex...

 

[Tater]

Good question. I'd go with the first option and i'd use only the original DR for all the attacks. I have nothing to prove that it should be played that way it's only my opinion. If I had to say why i'd play it like that, i'd say because the ASLRB seems to favour rolling less DRs then more.

Where is this "favoring" found? There are a couple of specific rules that make certain attacks a single DR...but that seems more the exception than the rule to me. If anything, ASL is crazy about DR/dr.

Spraying fire would be an example and so is A0.5. Rolling many DRs would probably be a bad thing for the defender as it means an increased chance of breaking his MG. I'd see it as as the sqauds actually moving at the same time and the MG shooting in the gereral direction of the enemy (not trying to aim at every soldier) and thus consider it as one shot.

RFP attacks are always separate from the originating fire attack. Also, RFP attacks are always separate from each other...even when you have a regular RFP and a FL-RFP in the same hex, they are rolled separately. The rules are relatively clear...each RFP would be rolled separately.

My arguments ARE weak (no need to point it out Tater ) but again, its only my opinion

Oh no...there is always a point to doing so.

 

[mgmasl]

Additional question : what happens when, say, a HW enters different hexes of a firelane simultaneously?
I would roll different DRs per hex...

I think that the FIRE LANE RES attacks do it as usual ones, ie a DR per hex where is a residual. IMO they are considered different residuals hexes even coming from a same Fire Lane. The ASLRB has to say "using the same DR" as usually does. So the probabilities of breakdown and sniper are greater than if using only one DR.

Miguel

 

[IYAOYAS]

I think that the FIRE LANE RES attacks do it as usual ones, ie a DR per hex where is a residual. IMO they are considered different residuals hexes even coming from a same Fire Lane. The ASLRB has to say "using the same DR" as usually does. So the probabilities of breakdown and sniper are greater than if using only one DR.

Miguel

Agreed. Each FL hex has its own RFP. Each is rolled separately.

 

[Mister T]

I read in D14.3 "During Impulse movement, all participating units move as a stack as per A4.2 even if moving in multiple locations".

After all, if it's a stack, would they share the same fate against incoming attacks ? :shy:

 

[mgmasl]

I read in D14.3 "During Impulse movement, all participating units move as a stack as per A4.2 even if moving in multiple locations".

After all, if it's a stack, would they share the same fate against incoming attacks ? :shy:

And if the effect is 1KIA or K/1, do you roll random selection betwen all the units in the "stack"? Or hex to hex?


Miguel

 

[MadDog_CDN]

Some clarity on this would be nice.

Really good question, and some good answers, but I still do not see a good solid answer.

 

[Ole Boe]

Here's my take on this:

A9.22 says: "A Fire Lane Residual FP counter exerts a unique form of Residual FP in its Location, and in every same-level (B.5) Location of the Fire Lane Hex Grain ..."

So a FL is really the same as one separate Residual FP counter in each hex of the FL (with some differences regarding Hindrances etc. of course).

And since they are separate RFP counters, you make separate attack DR for each hex as well, just as you would do if units of the HW entered different hexes containing normal RFP counters.

 

[Brian W]

And since they are separate RFP counters, you make separate attack DR for each hex as well, just as you would do if units of the HW entered different hexes containing normal RFP counters.

You mean that is part of my human wave enters a location with residual, the entire "stack" is not affected? Why that makes perfect sense!

 

[Robin Reeve]

I would add that 9.22 says "immediately attacks" which is not the same as "attacks simultaneously".
The rule seems to indicate when one uses the "same effects DR" for different attacks (cf. Spraying Fire or Collateral attacks). A9.22 doesn't.
I would consider that a DR is rolled in each hex where the FL is placed.

 

[Tater]

Really good question, and some good answers, but I still do not see a good solid answer.

How about this...

In each case where the rule intends for the same DR to be used for all attacks it always specifically says so. If the rule doesn't specifically say to use the same DR for all attacks then...you don't.

 

[geezer]

How about this...

In each case where the rule intends for the same DR to be used for all attacks it always specifically says so. If the rule doesn't specifically say to use the same DR for all attacks then...you don't.

Your saying that unless stated otherwise, use seperate DRs. If this were the case, the rules would never specify to use seperate DRs since "thats how it should be". A23.6 specifically says to use seperate DRs. Either the guy that wrote the book wasted a few words , or your reasoning is wrong.

Was a question sent to perry?

 

[Tater]

Your saying that unless stated otherwise, use seperate DRs. If this were the case, the rules would never specify to use seperate DRs since "thats how it should be". A23.6 specifically says to use seperate DRs. Either the guy that wrote the book wasted a few words , or your reasoning is wrong.

Jeeez man...the rule says there is an attack...you roll the attack. Unless the rule specifically states to combine a given attack(s) into one DR the basic rule still stands...i.e., you roll an attack.

Was a question sent to perry?

I hope not...it's pretty d@mn embarrassing that there even has to be a question.