Looking for PBeM opponent - usually 1 log/day - Must use dicelog.com

KenH

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Hello all,

Looking to add another PBeM game to the one match that I have currently.

Been playing since early 2000s, but took several years off lately due to busy family life. But, back in the saddle now! So, I know most of the rules ok, but am a bit rusty at the moment. Willing to play any theater - but the farther from basic ETO, the more rusty I will be.

Am not willing, however, to rely on the VASL in-log dice. I only game using https://dicelog.com/dice. If you haven't tried it, check it out. Super easy to use. The site is free and maintains a log of all dice rolls so that when you roll that killer snake-eyes, there will be no doubt that it was legit. The process does take a few more clicks than just using standalone VASL, but worth the comfort, IMO.

Let me know if you are interested.

Ken
 

xenovin

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I don’t use VASL that much but are you saying players have hacked the VASL dice and cheat? Man there is no $ involved so that’s crazy....
 

KenH

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I don’t use VASL that much but are you saying players have hacked the VASL dice and cheat? Man there is no $ involved so that’s crazy....
No, I am not saying that. It's just that when playing VASL by email (i.e. using logs), it is easy and tempting to simply rerun a log until one gets a good outcome. This, then, is the log that the player emails back to his opponent. All the other logs (the one's without good rolls) are simply discarded. So, no hacking needed. Just an easy way to cheat.

Using dicelog.com, each player must additionally open a browser window (in addition to the VASL screen) and go to the dicelog.com site. It's a little hassle, but not much really.

This free-to-use website has the option to create a private, but shared between both players, log that records all dice rolls throughout the match. So, each roll is verified and logged. It works really well and is designed exactly for the purpose of providing dice rolls for PBeM gaming.

As I said before, this method not only helps prevent your opponent from bending the rules, but also gives you the comfort of knowing that your opponent will not question your dice rolling. Just last game, I rolled three snake-eyes in the span of five rolls. So happy that I was using dicelog.com or my opponent (first time matched up with him) might have been questioning my integrity...

Ken
 

hongkongwargamer

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No harm in using the dicelog I suppose, especially when (somehow) playing strangers.

No, I am not saying that. It's just that when playing VASL by email (i.e. using logs), it is easy and tempting to simply rerun a log until one gets a good outcome. This, then, is the log that the player emails back to his opponent. All the other logs (the one's without good rolls) are simply discarded. So, no hacking needed. Just an easy way to cheat.
That does sound like a lot of work. If your opponent really want to win that badly (and value that over friendship), perhaps you should let him win?

Just make that your last game with him. No big loss.

might have been questioning my integrity...
If that's your one and only log, definitely make that your last game. :)

I have met a surprising number of real gents in this game. I submit to you that it might be less work for you if you start off assuming that folks don't cheat.

And if they assume you do, no biggie, it's just not meant to be.
 

xenovin

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I agree with Jackson that replaying a log file multiple times to get the best results (as the dice are going to screw you on some other action) seems like a ton of work. We all have crazy dice streaks in ASL but your plan has to be strong enough to take one or two hits else you are losing anyway.

If somebody is claiming you are cheating, there are many more fish in the VASL stream to choose from.

Sorry didn’t mean to derail your thread for an opponent. PBEM is supposed to be relaxing!
 

KenH

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HKwargamer,

I do "start off assuming that folks don't cheat". I just prefer for both players to have that peace of mind that the game is being played fair and square. Even one game lost to someone who reruns their logs is a waste, IMO. Time is valuable and I want to use it wisely.

Now, all that being said, I haven't found a new opponent yet. Perhaps my request to use dicelog.com will be a lead zeppelin anyhow...
 
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Jeff Sewall

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I think this is a worthy discussion. I play a lot of pbem and the possibility of cheating, or more importantly, wanting to make sure that your opponent feels good about your own honesty, is a factor that weighs into one's enjoyment of the experience. It's easy to say "If you suspect your opponent of cheating, don't ever play him again", but since you never know for sure, it would be nice to have a system that completely eliminates the possibility, as long as it didn't introduce a bunch of extra work.

I know that on the rare occasion when my very first DR of a logfile is a defensive fire snake-eyes, I cringe a little, especially if the opponent is fairly new to me.

Question: with dicelog.com, is your opponent aware of your dice rolls before he receives the logfile? This would be the case if they were emailed to him as they occur, or if he could simply review the dice roll log prior to processing your vasl log.

If so, this would allow an unscrupulous opponent to "know" that a snake-eyes bounding fire shot is about to occur, for example, and cause him to take low-odds shots he might otherwise not have taken. I only bring this up because this method is obviously more work than using the in-line dice (I recommend the random.org option), and if it still leaves a little room for doubt, I don't see the advantage.
 

KenH

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I think this is a worthy discussion...
If so, this would allow an unscrupulous opponent to "know" that a snake-eyes bounding fire shot is about to occur, for example, and cause him to take low-odds shots he might otherwise not have taken. I only bring this up because this method is obviously more work than using the in-line dice (I recommend the random.org option), and if it still leaves a little room for doubt, I don't see the advantage.
Jeff,

That is a good point. The issues that I see from VASL PBeM are two-fold:

1. Unscrupulous players can rerun their own logs as many times as they wish in order to "wait" for a beneficial set of dice rolls. Using dicelog.com closes this loophole.

2. Unscrupulous players can run their opponent's VASL log all the way through to gain insight into "the future". Then, they can start the log over and "react" (e.g. DFire) optimally versus what will happen later in the log. Using dicelog.com does not close this loophole.

Dicelog.com keeps a running log of all the dice rolls that both players make. FYI, the site does not email you anything-- to see the dice rolls, one must log in. But, once one logs in, all the dice rolls are there immediately. This doesn't change anything-- issue #2 still exists. I cannot think of a way to eliminate this, short of VASSAL fundamentally changes how logs are created and tracked.

In the end, using dicelog is actually incredibly simple. It is more clicks, no doubt, but it works well to remove one of two "weaknesses" in the VASSAL PBeM system. IMO, it's worth the minor hassle for that increased peace of mind.

By the way, am still looking for another opponent. Anyone? Bueller?

Ken
 
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KenH

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Am looking for a new opponent. Must agree to use dicelog.com. Trust me, it's easy to use. Not as easy as hitting F2 within the log, but not bad. Removes all thought of anyone possibly re-running logs to get better results.

Ideally, I am looking for a simple scenario - ETO and either a new-ish player or a grognard willing to go slowly, hold my hand a bit, and let me re-learn this game. I've been around for a long while, but am just returning from a long break. I miss ASL.
 
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