KGS2 Their Fate Sealed A-T SET DC question.

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John Fedoriw

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Hi gents,

"SSR 6 For the Germans one of their DC must be setup HIP in a road hex and plays as per G1.6121...."

"G1.6121 A-T SET DC: During his onboard setup for a 1945 scenario vs other than Russians, the Japanese player may set up ≤ 25% (FRU) of the DC in his OB unpossessed in paved/unpaved road [EXC: bridge] Locations. Such DC are termed A-T Set DC,10 and are treated as normal Set DC except as stated otherwise. An A-T Set DC always uses HIP, even if its road Location contains no Concealment Terrain. ... An A-T Set DC may be detonated only as Defensive First Fire, and only as a vehicle enters its Location using the road...."

Per SSR 1 Deep snow is in effect & roads are not plowed:

"E.72 GROUND SNOW: ...
3.724 VEHICULAR MOVEMENT: The minimum Road Entry MP cost in Ground Snow is one MP—not ½. All non-tracked vehicles [EXC: sledges] must expend one extra MP (or MF) per hexside crossed/bypassed. Both effects apply even on plowed roads."

"3.73 DEEP SNOW: ...
3.7331 VEHICULAR MOVEMENT: In Deep Snow the minimum Road Entry MP cost is one MP—not ½—whether BU or not (even on plowed roads). Except along plowed roads, all tracked vehicles must pay one extra MP, and all non-tracked vehicles [EXC: sledges] must pay two extra MP (or MF), per hexside. Along plowed roads, all non-tracked vehicles [EXC: sledges] must pay one extra MP/MF per hexside. Gallop is allowed only if entirely across plowed road hexsides."

I have some Q & A here regarding AT SET DC:

"A4.132, A6.12, B3.43, & G1.6121
Ver. 28
Under B3 generally and in the absence of “road negating terrain” (B3.43), can a unit state that it is not using the road to avoid LOS
under A4.132 (hexside LOS) per A6.12 (atypical LOS generally)? Does it make a difference if the unit is infantry versus
vehicular? If a player has placed a hidden set DC in a road, can the opposing player simply avoid the possibility of being subject to
the effects of a potential A-T Set DC simply by declaring that he is not “using the road” while entering a hex?
A. Yes. No. Yes."

...SO...

It seems there is absolutely no benefit to the Russians to ever drive on the road. If I were the Russians I would just announce that I was never using the road with any vehicles . Seeing as how the DC can be detonated only as Defensive First Fire, and only as a vehicle enters its Location using the road this would effectively nullify the DC before the game starts. It would be completely useless.

It seems to me that if the Russians do this the DC is useless (and unfortunately my opponent is cunning enough to spot this loophole)....so what is the point of including it in the scenario? Is this what the designers intended? Am I missing something? How have others played this SSR?

Thanks,
John
 

Michael R

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There was a similar discussion in another thread recently, but nothing to do with KGS. The AT-Set DC can be difficult to use when the opponent knows how to defeat it.
 

sdennis

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The Deluxe Scenario Mayhem in Manila suffers from the same issue, just never use the road.
 

John Fedoriw

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Thanks gents for those comments.

A note to the Forum editors:

My opponent suggested I have a better chance of a response if I copied this thread to the LFT folder so I have done so. My apologies if a duplicate thread is a problem ...in that case please delete whichever thread you think is less likely to attract a designer's attention. I also apologize if posting the original thread in the general forum is an issue. I just figured it would get more attention there.
 

Michael R

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Just trying to keep things organized. Closing this thread because of the newer one with a response in the LFT topic.
 

MajorDad

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Thanks gents for those comments.

A note to the Forum editors:

My opponent suggested I have a better chance of a response if I copied this thread to the LFT folder so I have done so. My apologies if a duplicate thread is a problem ...in that case please delete whichever thread you think is less likely to attract a designer's attention. I also apologize if posting the original thread in the general forum is an issue. I just figured it would get more attention there.
I posted a response from the Designer in the LFT Folder. I hope that helps

Keith
 
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