WBC 2025 ASL Tourney AAR - Part 1

Paul NJ

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Listeroids,
Ron Duenskie and I went to this last week and had a great time. Curt organized a fun tournament with a great crew of players and some interesting scenarios. I did miss our Canadian and other international players (although George T did join us). Winning MMP/ASL games for life was a cool prize. I was a little leary of the format with everyone playing the same pre-published scenario each round. Plus we didn't get to see them in advance. While MMP does good work play-testing scenarios before publishing them, even the best designers probably have a 50% hit rate. However the scenarios were both reasonably balanced and interesting in their dynamics. I was also too cheap to pay the high room rate at the resort, so Ron and I stayed 20 minutes away at a highway hotel. I'm happy to say we made it there by 10 pm each night. So the only downside was the lousy (but free and good enough) breakfasts.

Round 1- WBC1 Bloody Burgberg vs Phil Lahue of Newburgh, NY
Phil and I diced for sides of this mountain fight. The germans are perched on level 4 of a wooded mountain with 10 ELR2 537/447 2nd liners, a 357 set in a specific hex/facing, two HIP 157, three wire, 7 Prepared fire zones (PFZ) and some entrenchments. Coming at them hard are 13 ranger 667's (+1 SMOKE grenades) with a 9-2, hero, 60 mtr and two baz45 (all with WP). The PFZ are used to change woods to brush and/or brush/orchard to open ground. Of course they are a double edged tool as LOS is reciprocal and the US has much higher firepower. Plus ELR4 vs ELR2 means that the germans are going to quickly turn into useless conscripts in a protracted fight. Since the 357 CA with its +5 covered arc TEM is fixed, the US has the choice to go straight at it over a forward hill, or more likely circle to its left or right flank. I liked the idea of circling around to my left through G1 (open ground not pond by SSR). However Phil's setup convinced me to go straight up my right side from the I10 road through roughly a G6-L7 front line.
32638
US turn 1
Turn 1 prep my mortar scored a WP critical hit on a 537 in F5 to ELR it. Everyone boogied forward and advanced up (becoming CX) to from G7 to J7/K8/L8. German turn 1 the mortar ELR'd another geman 537 in K7 before the sniper broke the mortar half nut.

USt2 I pushed forward more slowly towards the now revealed 157 pillboxes in H5 and L5. The wire and German fire slowed me a bit but the 667's were tough. One went berserk, charged up the hill losing a half squad to a FPF. Then freed from melee due to German fire breaking its melee opponent, it tried to charge up through a trench into the 357. Unfortunately the ASL rulebook (B30.44) doesn't allow entry to an enemy occupied pillbox, even by a berserker. I got another WP CH from a baz45 but it was from outside the pillbox's CA so NE, other than WP in the hex. I had the unusual occurrence of a hero plus a CX'ed and concealed 8-0 advancing into a hex with a defender and a berserker. Ended up with a rare +3 and -3 on the same ambush roll.
32637
The germans need some help IMHO. I know the VC are being changed but I think the defenders need another wire, LMG and 447. Just my two cents. 1-0

Round 2 WBC2 Another Bowl of Borscht vs Jeff Coyle of South Carolina
We were warned to practice our night tactics/rules so it wasn't a surprise to see a night scenario. I also practiced desert rules, but no sun blindness resulted. This features 11 squads of Russians (mostly conscripts) hunkered down in 13 trenches (with some wire and mines). An equal number of germans arrived from both flanks. Dice gave me the Russians. Here Jeff and I both brain-farted as we agreed ahead of time the two German groups entered on the opposite side of where the card said. I don't think it mattered much in our game as the terrain is mostly open anyway. I setup all the wire and mines on the side of the turn 2 Germans (9-2 led 548s). I put a couple 426's HIP in the open, hoping to preserve their hidden status until my last turn and advance them into the trench to force an attempted eviction in the last German player turn. NVR was 5 and I was in +3 TEM (trench plus night LV) so I was planning to hold my fire and just wait it out.
32640

GT1 - However Jeff attacked vigorously, ignoring starshell illumination. This forced me to shoot at moving, adjacent units. My 2-1 and 4 -1 shots did pretty good with Jeff rolling poorly to break up the 467-sides' attack. In fact on a 2(-1) one cloaking counter was hit by a 3 DR, on the resulting K/ everyone tied and died leaving a MMG abandoned next to my trench. I sent a 248 to pick it up and destroy it (to avoid the auto sniper check for firing captured weapons). While we both rolled 5 boxcars and no snakes, Jeff's were all on morale checks and then he rolled poorly to rally his brokies. Nothing much went Jeff's way on this one. The germans need to stack (no multi-hex fire groups at night) to get enough firepower to affect the russkies in +3 TEM. This leaves them vulnerable to lucky 2+1 or 4+1 shots.
32641
Borscht Russian turn 2
In our game Jeff could never get any traction. 2-0

Round 3 WBC3 Earned, Not Given vs Steve Brooks of Florida
I hadn't played Steve before but he had just beaten Gary Fortenberry, who is a top player, so I assumed he was sharp. We played a PTO scenario featuring 13 cavalry 667s led a 10-2 (see a theme anyone?) attacking 7 447 plus 4 crews manning MG's and a 105 Arty cannon. The US has to control 8 of 12 building/hut hexes on the board 42 village. I wanted the elite GIs again but so did Steve. We gave the IJA the balance of a 228/MMG and then Steve chose them. Steve set up across the half board. There was mixed open ground on my left and solid light jungle on my right so I decided to go student body right.
32642

US Turn 1

I ran one squad into palm trees in front of two concealed stacks. A half squad opened up and pinned my unit before it could try WP grenades to trip the other stack. I ran a 667 bypassing in the open two hexes away and Steve didn't shoot, so I thought it was a dummy stack. Then I ran a 9-1/667/MMG next to the dummy and it turned out to be a 447. One KIA and Yahtzee later, everyone was dead. Although that 447 then had a 12 MC during advanced fire. I chased the half nut through the jungle on turns 2 and 3.
32644
IJA turn 3 (or 4?)
I got across the jungle ok but then in US turn 3 Steve brought out his HIP gun and 9-1/447/HMG and broke several squads. During turns 3-5 his four HMG/MMG plus Arty+mortar dished out a load of low roll attacks which set me back on my heels. At one point I had five broken 667 and the broken 10-2 stacked in one hex. Luckily the leader rallied under DM and then rallied most of the troopers. Then the sniper hit the big stack! Only one squad broke and the 10-2 led stack did a rare scenario sniper check.
My two half squads with nearly useless bazookas on my left got into CC with a couple half squads for mutual destruction. A 667 pinned in the street before going HOB twice in a row to become fanatic and make a hero (it tried to go double fanatic but the darn rules don't allow that). Steve did waste some units' time collecting up the bazookas. The HMG malfunctioned due to being manned by a non-crew. Led by the fanatic/hero I battled back turn 5 to kill the arty crew and push the MG's back across the street.
32643
US turn 5

By IJA turn 5 I had rallied my many broken units to have 9 GO squads vs 5 IJA SE and 3 crews. I still needed to take 4 more buildings though. On US turn 6 I took H5 for the 5th building, but still needed the area of the 10-1 and three crews around J2/3.

JT6 Steve decided to skulk instead of prep at adjacent troopers. I think I would have shot it out. One crew pinned in the street leaving J3 open to me.
32645
The fanatic 667 NAM into J3 and placed a smoke grenade on the 10-1 in I3. This let me move the 10-2 and another squad into J3. In final fire the smoke cleared and Steve got three good ROF shots with the MMG for a 2MC, 1MC and NMC. The studly 10-2, fanatic 667 and other 667 passed all the checks to advance into CC in I3. In CC I had a 6-1(-2) and rolled a 10 for a narrow win. If any of those units had broken in the three MMG shots, I would have lost. It was a close, exciting, and hard-fought game. 3-0
 

wrongway149

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Round 3 WBC3 Earned, Not Given vs Steve Brooks of Florida
I hadn't played Steve before but he had just beaten Gary Fortenberry, who is a top player, so I assumed he was sharp. We played a PTO scenario featuring 13 cavalry 667s led a 10-2 (see a theme anyone?) attacking 7 447 plus 4 crews manning MG's and a 105 Arty cannon. The US has to control 8 of 12 building/hut hexes on the board 42 village. I wanted the elite GIs again but so did Steve. We gave the IJA the balance of a 228/MMG and then Steve chose them. Steve set up across the half board. There was mixed open ground on my left and solid light jungle on my right so I decided to go student body right.
View attachment 32642

US Turn 1

I ran one squad into palm trees in front of two concealed stacks. A half squad opened up and pinned my unit before it could try WP grenades to trip the other stack. I ran a 667 bypassing in the open two hexes away and Steve didn't shoot, so I thought it was a dummy stack. Then I ran a 9-1/667/MMG next to the dummy and it turned out to be a 447. One KIA and Yahtzee later, everyone was dead. Although that 447 then had a 12 MC during advanced fire. I chased the half nut through the jungle on turns 2 and 3.

IJA turn 3 (or 4?)
I got across the jungle ok but then in US turn 3 Steve brought out his HIP gun and 9-1/447/HMG and broke several squads. During turns 3-5 his four HMG/MMG plus Arty+mortar dished out a load of low roll attacks which set me back on my heels. At one point I had five broken 667 and the broken 10-2 stacked in one hex. Luckily the leader rallied under DM and then rallied most of the troopers. Then the sniper hit the big stack! Only one squad broke and the 10-2 led stack did a rare scenario sniper check.
My two half squads with nearly useless bazookas on my left got into CC with a couple half squads for mutual destruction. A 667 pinned in the street before going HOB twice in a row to become fanatic and make a hero (it tried to go double fanatic but the darn rules don't allow that). Steve did waste some units' time collecting up the bazookas. The HMG malfunctioned due to being manned by a non-crew. Led by the fanatic/hero I battled back turn 5 to kill the arty crew and push the MG's back across the street.

US turn 5

By IJA turn 5 I had rallied my many broken units to have 9 GO squads vs 5 IJA SE and 3 crews. I still needed to take 4 more buildings though. On US turn 6 I took H5 for the 5th building, but still needed the area of the 10-1 and three crews around J2/3.

JT6 Steve decided to skulk instead of prep at adjacent troopers. I think I would have shot it out. One crew pinned in the street leaving J3 open to me.

The fanatic 667 NAM into J3 and placed a smoke grenade on the 10-1 in I3. This let me move the 10-2 and another squad into J3. In final fire the smoke cleared and Steve got three good ROF shots with the MMG for a 2MC, 1MC and NMC. The studly 10-2, fanatic 667 and other 667 passed all the checks to advance into CC in I3. In CC I had a 6-1(-2) and rolled a 10 for a narrow win. If any of those units had broken in the three MMG shots, I would have lost. It was a close, exciting, and hard-fought game. 3-0
This sounds pretty much like what happened in real life (per the before/after narrative on the card.)
 

Tuomo

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Waitaminnit. I thought Great Players thought 3 turns ahead. There's none of that in Paul's AAR. Except for the winning, it almost sounds like a Normal Person wrote it.
 

Sparafucil3

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Waitaminnit. I thought Great Players thought 3 turns ahead. There's none of that in Paul's AAR. Except for the winning, it almost sounds like a Normal Person wrote it.
I have spoke with a LOT of great players asking them what separates them from the rest of us. I think I reach out to two dozen players and got two dozen different answers. There was no rhyme or reason. It was all over the place. What I thought would be a good article had zero basis.

This leads me to believe there is no one path to greatness. It also made me think most of what great players do is done without thought. They probably couldn't put into words what they see. Which is aggravating for me since I can so easily tell you what I am thinking. Guess we know who is not great. :( -- jim
 
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Tuomo

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What I thought would be a good article had zero basis.
Actually, I think that'd still be a good article - Ten Thousand Paths to Greatness. You did all the work interviewing people, why not make use of it and write the story that presented itself, rather than the one you expected.

And there's still probably commonalities among the GPs - they probably still need to play often enough to keep sharp, they need to play sharp players who challenge them, they probably have good memories for rules, they keep setbacks in perspective and press on, etc.

And their differences would be interesting, too. Some favor attack, some defense. Curious if their favorite nationalities or theaters are any different than what one might expect. Are there specialists in DTO, Night, PTO, etc?

You could then do a companion piece titled Ten Thousand Paths To Sucking At This Game, talking about the many things that Bad Players do. That would be a much more relateable article :)
 

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Actually, I think that'd still be a good article - Ten Thousand Paths to Greatness. You did all the work interviewing people, why not make use of it and write the story that presented itself, rather than the one you expected.

And there's still probably commonalities among the GPs - they probably still need to play often enough to keep sharp, they need to play sharp players who challenge them, they probably have good memories for rules, they keep setbacks in perspective and press on, etc.

And their differences would be interesting, too. Some favor attack, some defense. Curious if their favorite nationalities or theaters are any different than what one might expect. Are there specialists in DTO, Night, PTO, etc?

You could then do a companion piece titled Ten Thousand Paths To Sucking At This Game, talking about the many things that Bad Players do. That would be a much more relateable article :)
There were literally no commonalities. I was flabbergasted by the returns. It was maddening on some level. These led me to believe much of what they did was subconscious. That led to an article I did describing what good players do more of. That was on my blog and will be re-released on Neal's at some point. Some of the things I recall from that article:
  • Good players prefer to attack.
    • This is exacerbated by scenarios playtested by players who aren't as good as they are giving the attackers more balance than they need just on the card.
    • Often times, the printed balance isn't enough to make up for the additional stuff they got to begin with.
  • Good players know the rules.
    • Surprisingly, not as well as you would think but they are in the top 5% generally
  • Good players are usually good sports
  • Good players are first masters of themselves
    • This is where I generally fail.
Eventually Neal will put it back up. You can find it here if the wayback machine will load it. -- jim
 

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Hmm. Sounds like general collusion among the GPs, aiming to rain on your parade. Time to Lawyer Up.
 

wrongway149

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  • Good players prefer to attack.
  • Good players are first masters of themselves
    • This is where I generally fail.
Two strikes right there.
I prefer to defend, and often am proud of my play if I only hold my fire a little longer and put the residual marker where it does the most good - as opposed to merely just putting out the most residual fire markers.
 

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Two strikes right there.
I prefer to defend, and often am proud of my play if I only hold my fire a little longer and put the residual marker where it does the most good - as opposed to merely just putting out the most residual fire markers.
Maybe you think you're in the wrong group ;) Truly, I don't know. I don't think we have ever had the pleasure.

Read the article. I was much less definitive there. Going from memory is always questionable. -- jim
 

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Hmm. Sounds like general collusion among the GPs, aiming to rain on your parade. Time to Lawyer Up.
Nah. I can live with what I took from it. If you read the article, maybe you can be too. -- jim
 

bendizoid

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Listeroids,
Ron Duenskie and I went to this last week and had a great time. Curt organized a fun tournament with a great crew of players and some interesting scenarios. I did miss our Canadian and other international players (although George T did join us). Winning MMP/ASL games for life was a cool prize. I was a little leary of the format with everyone playing the same pre-published scenario each round. Plus we didn't get to see them in advance. While MMP does good work play-testing scenarios before publishing them, even the best designers probably have a 50% hit rate. However the scenarios were both reasonably balanced and interesting in their dynamics. I was also too cheap to pay the high room rate at the resort, so Ron and I stayed 20 minutes away at a highway hotel. I'm happy to say we made it there by 10 pm each night. So the only downside was the lousy (but free and good enough) breakfasts.

Round 1- WBC1 Bloody Burgberg vs Phil Lahue of Newburgh, NY
Phil and I diced for sides of this mountain fight. The germans are perched on level 4 of a wooded mountain with 10 ELR2 537/447 2nd liners, a 357 set in a specific hex/facing, two HIP 157, three wire, 7 Prepared fire zones (PFZ) and some entrenchments. Coming at them hard are 13 ranger 667's (+1 SMOKE grenades) with a 9-2, hero, 60 mtr and two baz45 (all with WP). The PFZ are used to change woods to brush and/or brush/orchard to open ground. Of course they are a double edged tool as LOS is reciprocal and the US has much higher firepower. Plus ELR4 vs ELR2 means that the germans are going to quickly turn into useless conscripts in a protracted fight. Since the 357 CA with its +5 covered arc TEM is fixed, the US has the choice to go straight at it over a forward hill, or more likely circle to its left or right flank. I liked the idea of circling around to my left through G1 (open ground not pond by SSR). However Phil's setup convinced me to go straight up my right side from the I10 road through roughly a G6-L7 front line.
View attachment 32638
US turn 1
Turn 1 prep my mortar scored a WP critical hit on a 537 in F5 to ELR it. Everyone boogied forward and advanced up (becoming CX) to from G7 to J7/K8/L8. German turn 1 the mortar ELR'd another geman 537 in K7 before the sniper broke the mortar half nut.

USt2 I pushed forward more slowly towards the now revealed 157 pillboxes in H5 and L5. The wire and German fire slowed me a bit but the 667's were tough. One went berserk, charged up the hill losing a half squad to a FPF. Then freed from melee due to German fire breaking its melee opponent, it tried to charge up through a trench into the 357. Unfortunately the ASL rulebook (B30.44) doesn't allow entry to an enemy occupied pillbox, even by a berserker. I got another WP CH from a baz45 but it was from outside the pillbox's CA so NE, other than WP in the hex. I had the unusual occurrence of a hero plus a CX'ed and concealed 8-0 advancing into a hex with a defender and a berserker. Ended up with a rare +3 and -3 on the same ambush roll.
View attachment 32637
The germans need some help IMHO. I know the VC are being changed but I think the defenders need another wire, LMG and 447. Just my two cents. 1-0

Round 2 WBC2 Another Bowl of Borscht vs Jeff Coyle of South Carolina
We were warned to practice our night tactics/rules so it wasn't a surprise to see a night scenario. I also practiced desert rules, but no sun blindness resulted. This features 11 squads of Russians (mostly conscripts) hunkered down in 13 trenches (with some wire and mines). An equal number of germans arrived from both flanks. Dice gave me the Russians. Here Jeff and I both brain-farted as we agreed ahead of time the two German groups entered on the opposite side of where the card said. I don't think it mattered much in our game as the terrain is mostly open anyway. I setup all the wire and mines on the side of the turn 2 Germans (9-2 led 548s). I put a couple 426's HIP in the open, hoping to preserve their hidden status until my last turn and advance them into the trench to force an attempted eviction in the last German player turn. NVR was 5 and I was in +3 TEM (trench plus night LV) so I was planning to hold my fire and just wait it out.
View attachment 32640

GT1 - However Jeff attacked vigorously, ignoring starshell illumination. This forced me to shoot at moving, adjacent units. My 2-1 and 4 -1 shots did pretty good with Jeff rolling poorly to break up the 467-sides' attack. In fact on a 2(-1) one cloaking counter was hit by a 3 DR, on the resulting K/ everyone tied and died leaving a MMG abandoned next to my trench. I sent a 248 to pick it up and destroy it (to avoid the auto sniper check for firing captured weapons). While we both rolled 5 boxcars and no snakes, Jeff's were all on morale checks and then he rolled poorly to rally his brokies. Nothing much went Jeff's way on this one. The germans need to stack (no multi-hex fire groups at night) to get enough firepower to affect the russkies in +3 TEM. This leaves them vulnerable to lucky 2+1 or 4+1 shots.
View attachment 32641
Borscht Russian turn 2
In our game Jeff could never get any traction. 2-0

Round 3 WBC3 Earned, Not Given vs Steve Brooks of Florida
I hadn't played Steve before but he had just beaten Gary Fortenberry, who is a top player, so I assumed he was sharp. We played a PTO scenario featuring 13 cavalry 667s led a 10-2 (see a theme anyone?) attacking 7 447 plus 4 crews manning MG's and a 105 Arty cannon. The US has to control 8 of 12 building/hut hexes on the board 42 village. I wanted the elite GIs again but so did Steve. We gave the IJA the balance of a 228/MMG and then Steve chose them. Steve set up across the half board. There was mixed open ground on my left and solid light jungle on my right so I decided to go student body right.
View attachment 32642

US Turn 1

I ran one squad into palm trees in front of two concealed stacks. A half squad opened up and pinned my unit before it could try WP grenades to trip the other stack. I ran a 667 bypassing in the open two hexes away and Steve didn't shoot, so I thought it was a dummy stack. Then I ran a 9-1/667/MMG next to the dummy and it turned out to be a 447. One KIA and Yahtzee later, everyone was dead. Although that 447 then had a 12 MC during advanced fire. I chased the half nut through the jungle on turns 2 and 3.
View attachment 32644
IJA turn 3 (or 4?)
I got across the jungle ok but then in US turn 3 Steve brought out his HIP gun and 9-1/447/HMG and broke several squads. During turns 3-5 his four HMG/MMG plus Arty+mortar dished out a load of low roll attacks which set me back on my heels. At one point I had five broken 667 and the broken 10-2 stacked in one hex. Luckily the leader rallied under DM and then rallied most of the troopers. Then the sniper hit the big stack! Only one squad broke and the 10-2 led stack did a rare scenario sniper check.
My two half squads with nearly useless bazookas on my left got into CC with a couple half squads for mutual destruction. A 667 pinned in the street before going HOB twice in a row to become fanatic and make a hero (it tried to go double fanatic but the darn rules don't allow that). Steve did waste some units' time collecting up the bazookas. The HMG malfunctioned due to being manned by a non-crew. Led by the fanatic/hero I battled back turn 5 to kill the arty crew and push the MG's back across the street.
View attachment 32643
US turn 5

By IJA turn 5 I had rallied my many broken units to have 9 GO squads vs 5 IJA SE and 3 crews. I still needed to take 4 more buildings though. On US turn 6 I took H5 for the 5th building, but still needed the area of the 10-1 and three crews around J2/3.

JT6 Steve decided to skulk instead of prep at adjacent troopers. I think I would have shot it out. One crew pinned in the street leaving J3 open to me.
View attachment 32645
The fanatic 667 NAM into J3 and placed a smoke grenade on the 10-1 in I3. This let me move the 10-2 and another squad into J3. In final fire the smoke cleared and Steve got three good ROF shots with the MMG for a 2MC, 1MC and NMC. The studly 10-2, fanatic 667 and other 667 passed all the checks to advance into CC in I3. In CC I had a 6-1(-2) and rolled a 10 for a narrow win. If any of those units had broken in the three MMG shots, I would have lost. It was a close, exciting, and hard-fought game. 3-0
I find it funny you had to play Ron, your ‘sparring’ partner. ‘I drove all the way to Pennsylvania to play him again !’ Lol

Thanks Paul for the interesting report and congratulations on the fine showing at the tournament.
 

bendizoid

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There were literally no commonalities. I was flabbergasted by the returns. It was maddening on some level. These led me to believe much of what they did was subconscious. That led to an article I did describing what good players do more of. That was on my blog and will be re-released on Neal's at some point. Some of the things I recall from that article:
  • Good players prefer to attack.
    • This is exacerbated by scenarios playtested by players who aren't as good as they are giving the attackers more balance than they need just on the card.
    • Often times, the printed balance isn't enough to make up for the additional stuff they got to begin with.
  • Good players know the rules.
    • Surprisingly, not as well as you would think but they are in the top 5% generally
  • Good players are usually good sports
  • Good players are first masters of themselves
    • This is where I generally fail.
Eventually Neal will put it back up. You can find it here if the wayback machine will load it. -- jim
You’re right about the attacker having a ‘edge’ but I think the balance has shifted toward the defender on newer scenarios say in the last 10-15 years.
All things being even I’ll take the attacker, the defender has the first chance to screw up. I will say though my best games, the ones I am proud of and most memorable and against great players, the crazy ones, the miracle ones are on defense.
 
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