Chef du Pont CG Discussion

[ibncalb]

I like this CG very much. It's a shame that there has been so little discussion of it. So with that in mind...

Scenario One

The first scenario of the CdP CG is playable in 20 minutes.

I’ve played this, I think, five times now.

The Germans have three objectives in scenario one.

• Preserve their force (if it goes badly for them the most they can hope for is to reinforce with the 4 447s from scenario 2).
• To slow down the US
• Get at least the MMG across the bridge for scenario two.

Objective one is easily achievable unless the German starts up front

Objective two is also easy, the fast route along either road are covered by the MMG in the dairy.

Objective three is a fait accompli as the Germans can setup across the bridge during the refit phase, admittedly they cannot setup behind the bocage in BB18, but they can setup adjacent and the US range is so poor they are under no threat in the first turn of scenario two.

I haven’t seen a German defend the centre of the village and I can’t really think why they would.

If the Germans retain a foothold there they can reinforce into it or shift later on, but that does not aid the attack on the hill or the defence of the west bank victory hexes. So if the Germans can’t use the village then is there any reason for the US to clear it?

I don’t think so.

This then means that the correct US action in scenario one is to attack the dairy directly – they don’t have the range to seriously threaten the bridge. So an attack through the eastern most bocage it is.

The problem there is two fold, it takes at least two turns to get into position to fire on the dairy and the Germans can skulk back to the stairwell hex which is hard to get under fire with 4 range paras.

I think that unless one side is extremely lucky then the scenario will end with the Germans attaining their objectives, having suffered an ELR or two and the US in a good position for scenario two having possibly suffered a 337 lost.

IF the US can get a FH or two behind the bocage nearest the dairy then they can setup for the next scenario with WA and make the prep phase dangerous for the defenders. If not they will have to move into position in their T1.

Does anyone have different experiences/thoughts?

 

[ibncalb]

Scenario 2

The US have four objectives

• To clear the dairy
• Take the bridge
• Get as many troops into the stream as possible
• Dig in on and keep hill 30

The first objective is easy, the FP and assault fire ensure this, but it’s important for the US player to be efficient, with only one stairwell its easy to over commit and end up with the troops taking the dairy eliminated at scenario end.

Taking the bridge is not as hard as it looks there could be three or four FL covering the approaches to the bridge. The paras have enough smoke to eliminate FFMO and only one unit needs to get onto the bridge. Its readily doable.

The third objective irks me somewhat. Although it’s not crystal clear in the rules any US units and equipment east of the stream are removed at the end of the scenario. There is no possibility to shift across the stream or off map to avoid this. By QA this does not apply to the Germans, so if they have troops on the wrong side they can stay.

This means that saving the 10 leaders, as many troops as possible and especially the MMGs becomes the real objective in this scenario.

This irks me because, as far as I understand, and I’m happy to be corrected, the big leaders secured the bridge and then headed north to La Fiere. So, by getting them into the stream, which is very easy, we create an ahistorical situation which heavily imbalances the following fight on the west bank. I would like to know how this was dealt within playtesting. I’m also surprised that the potential confusion on when the US units are removed was missed.

The final objective, digging in and defending Hill 30 is probably the most important of the four as if the Germans kick off the small US contingent it will be hard to get back on.

Luckily for the US the Germans start three turns away from being able to assault the hill, although the meatball thrower can cause some havoc in K10, which is probably the most important hex o’ death on the map. The Germans could theoretically assault earlier by placing their scenario two reinforcements on the hill, but I think this fatally weakens the bridge.

The US needs to entrench the hill as fast as possible, the threat of OBA in scenario three demands it.

If the Germans don’t setup one of the reinforcement 447s near the hill the US can push off it and take the crossroads.

The northern US reinforcements should head for the hill, they could try for the Caponnet, but a 1-3 from long range German MMGs can make that risky.

In short, unless the German ignores Hill 30, they should reinforce Shanley.

What can the German do? They can use the stairwell and concealment to keep the dairy as long as possible and suck in too many para squads. They can inflict a similar delay on US units crossing the bridge, unfortunately they cannot really prevent the US getting the big leaders and troops into the stream. They also need to close with and dig in around Hill 30 as quickly as possible to ensure a setup area adjacent to the bocage surrounding the hill. Use that 50mm mortar to plink away at K10.

 

[klasmalmstrom]

Although it’s not crystal clear in the rules any US units and equipment east of the stream are removed at the end of the scenario.

They are - if not at the end, pretty early in the RePh - that's the intention.

The way it is written could indeed be clearer......I also think the intenton is - but I could be remembering wrong - that the U.S. troops actually have to be west of stream - not just in it (that's not what it says now, so that would require errata of some sorts).

 

[ibncalb]

They are - if not at the end, pretty early in the RePh - that's the intention.

The way it is written could indeed be clearer......I also think the intenton is - but I could be remembering wrong - that the U.S. troops actually have to be west of stream - not just in it (that's not what it says now, so that would require errata of some sorts).

Thanks for the response. Yeah, that would make quite a difference.

 

[sswann]

The photo is VERY impressive! The remembrance of those paratroopers is fantastic!

 

[Doug Kirk]

This a good CG. Somewhat scripted, but that also means very balanced I believe. I won as the German. Lots of dice to be rolled and lots of stuff can happen, but I believe the CG is won or lost on scenario 2. I managed to hold the dairy with one unit upstairs (encircled). That one VP swing is big. And I managed to wound one of the 10 morale American leaders. He was too slow to get across the bridge. I think the Americans need both stud leaders across the bridge to anchor the defense. We enjoyed the game for sure. Although having to dig foxholes to constantly expand and control your set up area was somewhat annoying.

 

[TopT]

How would this CG compare to Purple Heart Draw?
I really enjoyed that one.

 

[pensatl1962]

I’m playing as the German and we’re up to Scenario date 3 (Recall) German turn 5. Scenario 1 went okay as I retained the creamery. But scenario two was a disappointment. I lost the MMG in the creamery and the US pushed across the bridge and avoided losing any units due to the recall. We played footsie a bit up near the hill but nothing of note happened. Except perhaps that I didn’t think to entrench. Scenario three ended up as US attack (I chose Idle). US quickly moved to reinforce the hill and his 10-3 and 10-2 kill stacks made mincemeat out of the small village defenders. By the end of his turn 5, all German defenders in the village to the west of the stream were eliminated. Germans have made flanking moves from the entered reinforcements to the north and south of the hill. Personally it does not look good to me. Is this CG salvageable at this point, for those who’ve played into scenario 4 and beyond?

 

[Houlie]

An excellent thread.

 

[ibncalb]

Is this CG salvageable at this point, for those who’ve played into scenario 4 and beyond?

I don't think so.

Its far too easy to get the big US leaders across the stream. Once that happens the Germans are too weak to contest the hill AND defend against 10-3.

I think the possible errata alluded to by Klaus above, needing US units to be west of the stream to survive is necessary to balance the CG.

 

[pensatl1962]

For further viewing enjoyment of my plight. This is the current situation.

 

[pensatl1962]

I don't think so.

Its far too easy to get the big US leaders across the stream. Once that happens the Germans are too weak to contest the hill AND defend against 10-3.

I think the possible errata alluded to by Klaus above, needing US units to be west of the stream to survive is necessary to balance the CG.

And get the US units west of the stream is exactly what he accomplished. Seems like an onslaught at this point. Turn 2 was indeed the linchpin to this unfolding disaster. Proves yet again, that when you venture into a campaign game, you MUST read the entirety of the CG scenario dates and scenario specific special rules completely, and have an understanding of the forthcoming ebb and flow and key "change points" that might occur in the CG. A casual reading will usually catch you by the short hairs.

 

[von Marwitz]

Proves yet again, that when you venture into a campaign game, you MUST read the entirety of the CG scenario dates and scenario specific special rules completely, and have an understanding of the forthcoming ebb and flow and key "change points" that might occur in the CG

I think exactly this is quite difficult before you have begun playing the CG and developed a "feel" for the terrain, possible timing, and tactically important locations.

von Marwitz

 

[ibncalb]

And get the US units west of the stream is exactly what he accomplished. Seems like an onslaught at this point. Turn 2 was indeed the linchpin to this unfolding disaster. Proves yet again, that when you venture into a campaign game, you MUST read the entirety of the CG scenario dates and scenario specific special rules completely, and have an understanding of the forthcoming ebb and flow and key "change points" that might occur in the CG. A casual reading will usually catch you by the short hairs.

St Mere Eglise is the epitome of this, CdP is so but on a smaller scale. I think they're both great, but CdP does have the above described balance issue.

 

[pensatl1962]

We’re going to play on into scenario 4 in a few days just to see how this develops. Germans dug some foxholes just before scenario three ended. And a 747 and hero promptly retook one back in CC at end of turn 6.

 

[pensatl1962]

Regarding the hill, I’m getting the impression that you don’t want to assault it from the west or south due to the slopes and the LOS they give the Americans over the bocage. If possible a line of advance from the north and/or east seems safer.

 

[ibncalb]

Those slopes give Los to the Germans also. There are a few spots far away where German mediums can make some surprising shots.

I think the fight for the hill is well balanced and interesting.

The US player must prioritise keeping those infantry guns that enter later from setting up close to the hill or it really is over for the paras.

 

[ibncalb]

Similarly the top right high ground allows the US mortars to completely lock down some key hexes.

This map rewards understanding LOS, bocage and mandatory fire direction.

 

[Pedro ASL]

We are playing this campaign as a sort of "introductory campaign" for newer players, since the unit count is low for a campaign and mostly infantry. We are having a lot of fun, now finishing date 3. Some observations so far:
Day 2 the germans used most of their reinforcements on the bridge, merely attacking the hill, this may be a mistake.
The americans haven't dug in on the hill, they are defending it from around and in a reverse slope, the German OBA has been mostly useless as the observer has to enter and has had little LOS to american units.
The americans have been having an easy time, with the 10 morale leaders, and have been firmly in control except for the last turn of date 3, where they have gotten greedy to try to obliterate the germans and have taken some casualties.
The day 2 elimination of american units is confusing, but we could finally sort it out.
The feeling I've had till now is that the German player has to be very good and careful while the americans can just casually stack 2 squads, a 10-2 and an mmg and fire 16 flat on anything. The germans have to be very careful of stacking, have to pull-back on day 2, have to manage 1st, 2nd line and conscripts and have many more decisions to make that can punish them. In our playing they have had a big beating on day 2 and 3.

 

[Pedro ASL]

LOS are tricky and not obvious to newer players, they are struggling with bocage, slopes and hills.
The level 2 on the creamery has fewer clear LOS for the germans than you could expect.
I don't mind the campaign being somewhat "scripted" for reinforcements, but the fixed number of turns per date is a change that I don't like. Other campaigns have increasing dice rols to determine a date's end. With fixed turns per date, players get "gamy" since they know it is the last turn and the oponent won't be able to react. One appeal of campaign games over scenarios is that campaign games don't usually have the "end of scenario all-out rushes", because players don't know when will the date end. Oh, and I recall an epic game in Festung Budapest where a "1" in the date end dr saved me the day when I would have lost lots of troops and ground if my opponent had another turn.