Your favourite sentence in ASLRB?

von Marwitz

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"A unit may jump from an upper building level only if the building depiction is within a counter edge width from the cliff/water depiction."

Say WHAT?! ?:unsure:??

Yep, it's in dem rulz... E6.1

von Marwitz
BTW, triggered by another thread for which I tried to find out if there might exist a Level 2 Building atop a Cliff anywhere in the AH/MMP geoboard universe (it does not), I realized that there is only a single hex in creation into which you could jump in the abovementioned manner.

It is 8V5.

Maybe I could bother MMP with a request to create my favorite 'Perry Sez':

Does a Commando (H1.24) MMC that jumps from an upper Building Location into a Water Obstacle as per E6.1 and - provided it survives - is henceforth represented by an Unarmed Unit, retain its Scaling ability (B23.424) as to be able to climb up the Cliff again from the Water Obstacle to retake Control of the Building?

von Marwitz
 
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Michael Dorosh

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I thought maybe this came up somehow due to the Dornot Watermark scenario in original Squad Leader, but the board configuration is wrong. That was the one with the chase and the GIs needing to get across the river. I see the Rivers to the Reich scenario has Board 8 replaced by Board 40 in any event.
 

Tuomo

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Does a Commando (H1.24) MMC that jumps from an upper Building Location into a Water Obstacle as per E6.1 and - provided it survives - is henceforth represented by an Unarmed Unit, retain its Scaling ability (B23.424) as to be able to climb up the Cliff again from the Water Obstacle to retake Control of the Building?
Because after crawling back to shore, the first thing they're gonna say is, "Let's do that again!" ???
 

von Marwitz

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One does not need Scaling ability to Climb a cliff, IIRC.
Right. My question was indeed imprecise. Maybe I might be excused as the situation does not come up that often.

Commandos have Scaling Ability (B23.424) which you only need to Climb Bridges/Buildings. But per B11.433 Commandos have a smaller chance to Fall while Climbing. And thus a greater chance to retake the Building in our situation.

So the question should have been whether a Commando (H1.24) MMC that jumps from an upper Building Level Location per E6.1 and survives, being henceforth represented by an Unarmed Unit, retains its Commando abilities, namely B11.433.


B11.41 FALLING DR: An Infantry unit must make a DR (Δ) ≤ 9 in order to ascend or descend a cliff hexside during that MPh. If a 10 or 11 Final DR is rolled, the unit may not move from its present position during that phase even though it is considered to be in the act of Climbing/descending. If a 12 or higher is rolled on the Falling DR, the unit and any SW in its possession is eliminated. There is a cumulative +1 DRM to the Falling DR if rain, snow of any kind, or heavy winds are currently in effect. A broken/wounded unit may not Climb. A Climbing unit may portage only its CX IPC (i.e., one less PP than its normal IPC; A4.52).

B11.433 COMMANDO: Gurkhas, or any unit specified by SSR or DYO special purchase as Commandos are specially trained and equipped for climbing. Commandos are prevented from Climbing a cliff hexside only on a Final Falling DR of 12 and eliminated only on a Final Falling DR ≥ 13 (11.41).

von Marwitz
 

von Marwitz

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BTW, triggered by another thread for which I tried to find out if there might exist a Level 2 Building atop a Cliff anywhere in the AH/MMP geoboard universe (it does not), I realized that there is only a single hex in creation into which you could jump in the abovementioned manner.

It is 8V5.

Maybe I could bother MMP with a request to create my favorite 'Perry Sez':

Does a Commando (H1.24) MMC that jumps from an upper Building Location into a Water Obstacle as per E6.1 and - provided it survives - is henceforth represented by an Unarmed Unit, retain its Scaling ability (B23.424) as to be able to climb up the Cliff again from the Water Obstacle to retake Control of the Building?

von Marwitz

We do have a ruling by Perry:

Question:
B23.424, E6.1, H1.24
Does a Commando (H1.24) MMC that jumps from an upper Building Location into a Water Obstacle as per E6.1 and - provided it survives - is henceforth represented by an Unarmed Unit, retain its Scaling ability (B23.424) as to be able to climb up to the Cliff again from the Water Obstacle to retake Control of the Building?

Answer:
Unarmed units do not have Scaling ability.

....Perry
MMP

Note that my question has been imprecise. I should have asked whether Unarmed Units retain their Commando ability as per B11.433 which reduces the chance of Falling.

B11.433 COMMANDO: Gurkhas, or any unit specified by SSR or DYO special purchase as Commandos are specially trained and equipped for climbing. Commandos are prevented from Climbing a cliff hexside only on a Final Falling DR of 12 and eliminated only on a Final Falling DR ≥ 13 (11.41).

Nevertheless, Perry's answer provides us with the insight that Unarmed Units do not seem to retain Special Abilities that their parent units might have had.

von Mawitz
 

'Ol Fezziwig

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We do have a ruling by Perry:

Question:
B23.424, E6.1, H1.24
Does a Commando (H1.24) MMC that jumps from an upper Building Location into a Water Obstacle as per E6.1 and - provided it survives - is henceforth represented by an Unarmed Unit, retain its Scaling ability (B23.424) as to be able to climb up to the Cliff again from the Water Obstacle to retake Control of the Building?

Answer:
Unarmed units do not have Scaling ability.

....Perry
MMP

Note that my question has been imprecise. I should have asked whether Unarmed Units retain their Commando ability as per B11.433 which reduces the chance of Falling.

B11.433 COMMANDO: Gurkhas, or any unit specified by SSR or DYO special purchase as Commandos are specially trained and equipped for climbing. Commandos are prevented from Climbing a cliff hexside only on a Final Falling DR of 12 and eliminated only on a Final Falling DR ≥ 13 (11.41).

Nevertheless, Perry's answer provides us with the insight that Unarmed Units do not seem to retain Special Abilities that their parent units might have had.

von Mawitz
I think, in this case, it's more that they no longer have the equipment necessary for scaling.
 

bprobst

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Nevertheless, Perry's answer provides us with the insight that Unarmed Units do not seem to retain Special Abilities that their parent units might have had.
I wouldn't go that far. An unarmed crew, for instance, is worth more CVP if eliminated/captured than an unarmed HS. Although if it re-arms it still becomes an inexperienced HS ... presumably a 2 CVP inexperienced HS? Don't ask me to quote a rule on that. :)

We might know for certain if we ever get that long-promised rewrite of the Prisoner rules, but I'm not holding my breath.
 

Actionjick

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I think, in this case, it's more that they no longer have the equipment necessary for scaling.
Not sure about this. Is it the equipment they carry or their training? Unless they were specifically on a mission where they knew they were going to Scale would they be carrying specialized equipment? I know nothing about the kit a commando squad would be routinely issued so this is just a gut feeling.
 

von Marwitz

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We might know for certain if we ever get that long-promised rewrite of the Prisoner rules, but I'm not holding my breath.
:D In Germany there is a saying: "Die Hoffnung stirbt zuletzt." Hope dies last...

Even if no iota would be changed in the Prisoner rules, dividing the text into more than a single paragraph would already be a tremendous relief in itself. ;)

von Marwitz
 

Sparafucil3

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We might know for certain if we ever get that long-promised rewrite of the Prisoner rules, but I'm not holding my breath.
I sent a draft along with questions that remain to be answer several years ago. One of my favorite:

We all know Disrupted units are no obstacle to movement and surrender right away. What if the capturing side declares NQ? Does this change? It seems to reason to me, that once a side declares NQ, disrupted units would become an obstacle to movement and rout normally when DM. -- jim
 

Rock SgtDan

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This is were we agree (it shouldn't be Open Ground) but the rules disagree with us. On the occasion where a unit is capable of firing on us with a mortar, that particular unit--per C.1--imposes a condition on our unit which makes HA non-applicable. If the hex is otherwise devoid of TEM or Hindrance, it is Open Ground absent the Q&A. This is why I am pretty sure there should be errata to follow that up. A10.531 most certainly is one occasion where this is relevant. That has application to routing.
... -- jim
What if the unit with the mortar could choose to use some other type of weapon? Are you saying that the unused mortar must affect the HA TEM of that other weapon? Its "capable" of using any of their weapons.
 
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Rock SgtDan

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My least favorite rule was A.14 in the first edition rules. Not the rule itself but it's placement at the beginning of the rulebook. I felt it was too confusing especially for the player reading the rules for the first time. I was glad to see the revision in the second edition that referenced it in chapter A but moved the actual rule to chapter D where it belonged.
So what is the precedence of a rule in Chapter C when it conflicts with the rule in Chapter A which references the rule in Chapter D?
 
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