World War One ASL

[Pitman]

The problem with doing WWI at the ASL level is that the squad was not the tactical unit of maneuver. At the start of the war, the company was the basic level of tactical maneuver. As some nations evolved their tactics, it began to be the platoon, but basically only by the end of the war, and only in a few armies (German, British, etc.) did you begin to see the sort of squad level tactics that were the hallmark of most WW2 tactical combat. As a result, any WWI system based on ASL would either have to drastically modify ASL or would basically be extremely unrealistic. If I were designing a WWI tactical game, I would base it primarily on the company level, with provisions for certain nationalities to use platoons beginning in, say, 1916 or so.

 

[Calimero]

Yes, you would design it so.

But would you keep it in print at all times ? :laugh:

jp

 

[Pitman]

My print strategy would be based on the idea of printing whatever Glenn owned and not printing whatever he did not own!

 

[Psycho]

My print strategy would be based on the idea of printing whatever Glenn owned and not printing whatever he did not own!

Then you would never print anything in the first place.

 

[rreinesch]

The problem with doing WWI at the ASL level is that the squad was not the tactical unit of maneuver. At the start of the war, the company was the basic level of tactical maneuver. As some nations evolved their tactics, it began to be the platoon, but basically only by the end of the war, and only in a few armies (German, British, etc.) did you begin to see the sort of squad level tactics that were the hallmark of most WW2 tactical combat. As a result, any WWI system based on ASL would either have to drastically modify ASL or would basically be extremely unrealistic. If I were designing a WWI tactical game, I would base it primarily on the company level, with provisions for certain nationalities to use platoons beginning in, say, 1916 or so.

Couldn't that scale essentially be replicated through the use of the human wave rules for movement, and the requirement that attacks be firegroups of minimum unit densities?

Rick

 

[Michael Dorosh]

The problem with doing WWI at the ASL level is that the squad was not the tactical unit of maneuver. At the start of the war, the company was the basic level of tactical maneuver. As some nations evolved their tactics, it began to be the platoon, but basically only by the end of the war, and only in a few armies (German, British, etc.) did you begin to see the sort of squad level tactics that were the hallmark of most WW2 tactical combat. As a result, any WWI system based on ASL would either have to drastically modify ASL or would basically be extremely unrealistic. If I were designing a WWI tactical game, I would base it primarily on the company level, with provisions for certain nationalities to use platoons beginning in, say, 1916 or so.

The squad was a basic maneuver unit in the British army by the middle of 1917, or in other words, for the last year and a half of the war. A British infantry platoon consisted of four "squads" (called "sections"), one composed of riflemen, another of rifle grenadiers, another of "bombers" (hand grenades) and a fourth equipped with a Lewis machine gun - one gunner and the rest ammo bearers. There were changes on this org through late 1917 and 1918, and the French and Germans had similar orgs, particularly in their storm troop organizations.

One discussion of this from a gaming perspective at this URL: http://theminiaturespage.com/boards/msg.mv?id=125663

ASL is a perfectly fine system to depict all this, and the section was very often the basic unit of maneuver from the middle of the war on - not the platoon.

No need to modify ASL to depict tactical combat from the middle of 1917 onwards, in other words.

 

[Michael Dorosh]

While the Western Front were static on an operational level, if you zoom in to look at company level you will find a lot of movement. Just because the end result of a battle usually was some very minor movement of the front, doesn't mean that there wasn't a lot of things going on when you look at it in ASL scale (there was). An advance of a few km might be insignificant on an operational level, but could provide for many ASL scenarios.

You need to find an action were both sides fought with squads as tactical elements (NOT common) or one were the attackers fight with squads and the defenders have been sufficiently punished by the artillery preparation to just be small groups of scattered men (very common!).

Excellent post.

 

[Carln0130]

LFT put out some very nice Russian Revolution material, which is of course right around that time period. Very esoteric, which is right up my alley and works quite nicely.

 

[Paul M. Weir]

LFT put out some very nice Russian Revolution material, which is of course right around that time period. Very esoteric, which is right up my alley and works quite nicely.

Their "From the Cellar" #4 pack. I would recommend it, even for those who are not into strange stuff.

Mainly infantry with some artillery with a good mix of sizes of scenario. Includes a 3 way fight.

 

[Pitman]

Couldn't that scale essentially be replicated through the use of the human wave rules for movement, and the requirement that attacks be firegroups of minimum unit densities?

Rick

Basically, if you have to go to all sorts of jury-rigging efforts, you might as well design a new system from the start that would be designed for the job.

 

[Paul M. Weir]

Basically, if you have to go to all sorts of jury-rigging efforts, you might as well design a new system from the start that would be designed for the job.

It is interesting to note that when Avalanche Press mutated Panzergrenadier to WW1 they went to company level units even though they started from platoon rather than squad. SPI's Soldiers was company level.

 

[Michael Dorosh]

It is interesting to note that when Avalanche Press mutated Panzergrenadier to WW1 they went to company level units even though they started from platoon rather than squad. SPI's Soldiers was company level.

Soldiers was company-based (i.e. the individual units represented infantry companies). The game itself was a battalion-level game portraying tactical actions in the 1914 era.

 

[Paul M. Weir]

Soldiers was company-based (i.e. the individual units represented infantry companies). The game itself was a battalion-level game portraying tactical actions in the 1914 era.

Soldiers could go up to regiment or brigade. What I called level, you called based. Base level, geddit?:laugh:

 

[Michael Dorosh]

Soldiers could go up to regiment or brigade. What I called level, you called based. Base level, geddit?:laugh:

I suppose if you threw enough counters on that cardboard map, you could call it a division...

 

[footsteps]

I suppose if you threw enough counters on that cardboard map, you could call it a division...

Too many counters, and Pitman might mistake it for his tub o' counters and dive in wearing nothing but a speedo! :crosseye:

 

[Gunner Scott]

Hi-

Here is a good game on the subject:

http://www.clashofarms.com/landships.html

As can be seen, 1918 seems to be the default year the action takes place in. Wild Bill also has a couple of WW1 modules but are most likely crap and CH! might be releasing their WW1 ASL Opus this year, which I am looking forward to.


Scott

 

[footsteps]

CH! might be releasing their WW1 ASL Opus this year, which I am looking forward to.

Scott

If they do that before G48v2, I will cry.

 

[Psycho]

If they do that before G48v2, I will cry.

Sack up, Nancy! :angry: