I have no luck when I roll for the use of FTs...In the book, it seemed to me that flamethrowers could not be used during Subsequent Fire or Final Protective Fire Phase.
Can FT's be used on defensive fire?
A DR of 10 on the 24 FP column results in a 1MC even as it x's your FT. So, good shootin', Tex.I have no luck when I roll for the use of FTs...
The numbers 10 & Higher are always there.
This is not the intent of the rule. The squad can fire both the inherent and the FT on the same MF. "Different attackers" means roughly "different weapons" in, "A unit the survives a Defensive First Fire attack can be fired upon again the same location during its MPh before expending additional MF/MP, but only by different attackers or if it expended at least 2 MF/MP in that hex". A squad with a MG must FG because of Mandatory Firegroup requirements and can't attack separately, but a weapon that can't FG (e.g. FT, PSK) can be fired independently on the same MF expenditure. The FT and the squad's inherent FP are different attackers.3.3.3 Final Protective Fire (FPF) "A unit the survives a Defensive First Fire attack can be fired upon again the same location during its MPh before expending additional MF/MP, but only by different attackers or if it expended at least 2 MF/MP in that hex.
This last one is interesting because if a moving enemy unit is attacked in a hex that it expended less the 2 MP (into an open hex, grain hex, orchard, etc), it can only be shot at once by the squad with the FT. The squad can use its inherent or the FT but not both. Shooting at a unit moving into a building however allows both shots (takes 2 MP to move into a building thus possibility of 2 shots, with one being inherent and other being the FT. Order of which shot first is not applicable).
Definitely TRUE.....Nah, Kev was probably shooting at a range of two with a CXed, non-elite unit. LOL
WORDINGS?This is not the intent of the rule. The squad can fire both the inherent and the FT on the same MF. "Different attackers" means roughly "different weapons" in, "A unit the survives a Defensive First Fire attack can be fired upon again the same location during its MPh before expending additional MF/MP, but only by different attackers or if it expended at least 2 MF/MP in that hex". A squad with a MG must FG because of Mandatory Firegroup requirements and can't attack separately, but a weapon that can't FG (e.g. FT, PSK) can be fired independently on the same MF expenditure. The FT and the squad's inherent FP are different attackers.
The wording of the rule is unfortunate, because yours is a perfectly good interpretation, and probably the one that most players will think of first. I am applying ASL knowledge here. I expect that MMP would not change the rules that drastically.
JR
Jrv,
Got home from my vacation so now my BOB (Big Orange Book alias ASLRB) is at hand.
I have researched the FT usage in full ASL.
"A22.31 FG: A FT may not combine with any other unit/weapon - including the unit firing it or even another FT."
Same as SK and not disagreement about this issue.
"A8.14 FOLLOW-UP ATTACK: ... A unit that survives a Defensive First Fire attack with no effect can be fired on again in the same Location during its MPh before expending additional MF/MP, but only be different attackers or if it expended at least two MF/MP in the Location. ..."
Now comes the problem. This topic has been discussed on the full ASL forums but I do not know if an agreement has been reached. Is there a clarification or errata statement in the Annuals or Journals? Is there a Prez says covering this.
Without any of these I have only my original opinion to fall back on.
jrv, do you have a specific reference that can shed light on this?
I agree that the wording leaves us in a grey area.
Pat
Because the wording was unfortunate, I had to punt and ask for a Perry Sez (http://forums.gamesquad.com/showthread.php?101658-A8.14-Fire-by-same-quot-attacker-quot-on-same-MF-MP-point&p=1414577#post1414577). Long story short, an "attacker" in this sense is a weapon and not the squad possessing it.Jrv,
Got home from my vacation so now my BOB (Big Orange Book alias ASLRB) is at hand.
I have researched the FT usage in full ASL.
"A22.31 FG: A FT may not combine with any other unit/weapon - including the unit firing it or even another FT."
Same as SK and not disagreement about this issue.
"A8.14 FOLLOW-UP ATTACK: ... A unit that survives a Defensive First Fire attack with no effect can be fired on again in the same Location during its MPh before expending additional MF/MP, but only be different attackers or if it expended at least two MF/MP in the Location. ..."
Now comes the problem. This topic has been discussed on the full ASL forums but I do not know if an agreement has been reached. Is there a clarification or errata statement in the Annuals or Journals? Is there a Prez says covering this.
Without any of these I have only my original opinion to fall back on.
jrv, do you have a specific reference that can shed light on this?
I agree that the wording leaves us in a grey area.
Pat
My excuses, where did you get this? :crosseye:In the book, it seemed to me that flamethrowers could not be used during Subsequent Fire or Final Protective Fire Phase.
A FT can never be used in Subsequent First Fire (SFF) or FPF.So, your point is in that if an MMC posessing a FT and both are marked with First Fire, this MMC would forfeight FT in SFF/FPF since FT attacks cannot be combined with any other?
Many thanks! I've missed this point. (It's presented even in SK1).SFF and FPF attacks may only be made with Inherent FP, MGs, and IFE.