Whatever happened to...

[Nineteen Kilo]

Yesterday I was going out to have lunch by myself and as is my habit on such occasions I wanted to take along something "light" to read read. Trouble was I didn't have any magazines or catalogs, so I grabbed an old ASL Annual at random and took it along to the local Pannera Bread - where I proceeded to have my sandwich and read an article at an umbrella table. The random Annual was Annual '95 and the article I chose was "The Gentle Art of Routing" by Steve Tinsley.

Steve did an ok job with the article (it did have a talking point which looped on itself and should have been edited out). However the article did remind me of a rule I am embarrassed to admit that I had forgotten (that voluntarily routing leaders are interdicted using the morale of the unit they are routing with, not their own morale) so I mark the time to read the article as useful.

After finishing my delicious cinnamon scone I looked at the cover and mused, "Wow did this really come out 22 years ago? I wonder whatever happened to to the author?"

And so my question of the now is, Whatever happened to Steve Tinsley? Did he go on to contribute more articles on The Game? Does he still play ASL? Is he (and I hesitate to ask) even still with 'US'?

Kurious Kev

 

[Ganjulama]

He was at ASLOK 2015. He still plays.

 

[Nineteen Kilo]

He was at ASLOK 2015. He still plays.

There you go, mystery solved.

 

[Brian W]

(that voluntarily routing leaders are interdicted using the morale of the unit they are routing with, not their own morale)

Actually, voluntary routing leaders aren't interdicted at all; they simply suffer the fate of the MMC they're routing with. I had forgotten that the leadership DRM may apply (lucky the 6+1 does not have to apply its DRM). But yeah, don't expect your broken 426 + 10-2 leader to get very far.

 

[von Marwitz]

Actually, voluntary routing leaders aren't interdicted at all; they simply suffer the fate of the MMC they're routing with. I had forgotten that the leadership DRM may apply (lucky the 6+1 does not have to apply its DRM). But yeah, don't expect your broken 426 + 10-2 leader to get very far.

It is worse:
If the broken unit whom the the leader is voluntarily accompanying on its rout fails its interdiction MC, he dies while the interdicted MMC may only be CR'ed.

"A10.711 VOLUNTARY ROUT: A non-berserk, non-pinned leader already stacked with a broken unit before it routs may elect to rout with the broken unit even though he is not broken. If he does so, the leader shares the broken unit's vulnerability to Interdiction and, although he does not have to take any Interdiction NMC himself, he is eliminated if the broken unit he is stacked on top of fails an Interdiction MC. He must remain with the broken unit throughout the RtPh, but is not considered broken and may add his leadership DRM to its Interdiction NMC. The leader, if already in possession of a SW, may portage it, but cannot improve the broken unit's portage capacity."

von Marwitz

 

[Brian W]

Here's a question: what happens if a leader using voluntary rout cannot remain with the broken unit through that unit's RtPh--in other words, does the leader's inability to rout farther limit the other unit's ability to rout, or can the leader be left behind.

 

[jrv]

Here's a question: what happens if a leader using voluntary rout cannot remain with the broken unit through that unit's RtPh--in other words, does the leader's inability to rout farther limit the other unit's ability to rout, or can the leader be left behind.

As in, the leader is wounded? I would read that "the leader must remain with the broken unit throughout the RtPh" cuts both ways: the leader can't leave the broken unit and the broken unit can't leave the leader.

JR

 

[Brian W]

As in, the leader is wounded?

That would be the main way, but also if the leader were carrying two PP of SW.

I would read that "the leader must remain with the broken unit throughout the RtPh" cuts both ways: the leader can't leave the broken unit and the broken unit can't leave the leader.

That's what I think, too, but it seems strange that a broken unit could die for failure to rout or surrender because it cannot leave the leader behind.

"Guys, you can't leave me behind. Oh, but go ahead and surrender, I'll stay here."

 

[bprobst]

Seems pretty clear to me.

 

[jrv]

That would be the main way, but also if the leader were carrying two PP of SW.
That's what I think, too, but it seems strange that a broken unit could die for failure to rout or surrender because it cannot leave the leader behind.

I'm not clear what you are envisioning here. I suppose it could happen if the broken unit had to rout two (or more) hexes through woods. In the first hex it finds a new enemy unit that forces it to rout a second hex, which it could not do if it had the wounded leader tagging along. Is that the sort of thing you are thinking of? The leader is not required to voluntary rout. If taking the leader along causes some problem to the broken unit that leaving him behind would solve, by all means leave the leader behind.

JR

 

[Brian W]

Is that the sort of thing you are thinking of?

Yes, exactly. Unknown units popping up, or starting the rout and being wrong about where it has to end up. I was also thinking of sniper attacks wounding the leader, but snipers aren't active in the RtPh.

 

[Nineteen Kilo]

Actually, voluntary routing leaders aren't interdicted at all; they simply suffer the fate of the MMC they're routing with. I had forgotten that the leadership DRM may apply (lucky the 6+1 does not have to apply its DRM). But yeah, don't expect your broken 426 + 10-2 leader to get very far.

Brian you phrased it much better than I did. It appears I need an editor as well.

 

[Eagle4ty]

Seems pretty clear to me.

I don't see what seems pretty clear. What if the Leader was broken or wounded because of the interdiction. It seems quite obvious that the rule is speaking of an unbroken leader accompanying the MMC throughout its RtPh. If the leader was broken by interdiction and since broken units must rout one unit at a time [EXC: if accompanied by an unbroken leader], it would seem any surviving MMC that started the RtPh (say a CRed HS) would end its RtPh in the hex, but now would the recently broken LDR be able to rout by himself? And, if he is allowed to do so does he (the LDR) have the full 6MF available for him to rout from that location. If the LDR was wounded in an interdicted Location, I agree with jrv that the resultant MMC/LDR combo could only continue to rout as far as the wounded LDR would permit them to move together (or possibly not any further at all).

 

[klasmalmstrom]

That would be the main way, but also if the leader were carrying two PP of SW.

Per Q&A a leader voluntary routing can't carry more that its IPC.

A10.711
May a voluntarily-routing leader (A10.711) portage 2PP while routing?, May a GO leader drop possession of a 3PP SW at the
beginning of the RtPh in order to be able to voluntarily rout (A10.711)?
A. No. Yes.

Of course, I know you don't bother with unofficial Q&A.

 

[Brian W]

No doubt, and the first answer would be a change in the rule.

 

[von Marwitz]

What if the Leader was broken or wounded because of the interdiction.

The leader will neither break nor wound due to interdiction. If he voluntarily accompanies the brokie, he will never roll for interdiction but only the unit he is stacked with will. If they fail, he dies (A10.711).

von Marwitz

 

[Bob Walters]

Yesterday I was going out to have lunch by myself and as is my habit on such occasions I wanted to take along something "light" to read read. Trouble was I didn't have any magazines or catalogs, so I grabbed an old ASL Annual at random and took it along to the local Pannera Bread - where I proceeded to have my sandwich and read an article at an umbrella table. The random Annual was Annual '95 and the article I chose was "The Gentle Art of Routing" by Steve Tinsley.

Steve did an ok job with the article (it did have a talking point which looped on itself and should have been edited out). However the article did remind me of a rule I am embarrassed to admit that I had forgotten (that voluntarily routing leaders are interdicted using the morale of the unit they are routing with, not their own morale) so I mark the time to read the article as useful.

After finishing my delicious cinnamon scone I looked at the cover and mused, "Wow did this really come out 22 years ago? I wonder whatever happened to to the author?"

And so my question of the now is, Whatever happened to Steve Tinsley? Did he go on to contribute more articles on The Game? Does he still play ASL? Is he (and I hesitate to ask) even still with 'US'?

Kurious Kev

Back to the original post. Being as I am coming back to the hobby after a long hiatus I too wonder what happened to many of the people with whom I became familiar. I wonder what happened to Randall Reed, Allen Moon, and Mick Uhl plus a host of others. Some are still around like Jim Dunnigan, Don Greenwood, and Roger MacGowan and sadly at least one, John Hill has passed away.

 

[Nineteen Kilo]

Back to the original post. Being as I am coming back to the hobby after a long hiatus I too wonder what happened to many of the people with whom I became familiar. I wonder what happened to Randall Reed, Allen Moon, and Mick Uhl plus a host of others. Some are still around like Jim Dunnigan, Don Greenwood, and Roger MacGowan and sadly at least one, John Hill has passed away.

I was actually going to suggest that the person who answered my question should pose the next "whatever happened to", so Bob your question holds the floor (along with the interesting voluntarily routing leader sidebar).

 

[bprobst]

I don't see what seems pretty clear.

Which part of "the leader must remain with the broken unit throughout the RtPh" is unclear? Is it the "must"? Or the "RtPh"? If there's any part of the RtPh where the unbroken leader and the broken unit are no longer stacked together, you have just violated the rule.

What if the Leader was broken or wounded because of the interdiction.

Explain to me how that could happen.

However, there is a chance that the leader might break or wound during the rout (but not due to interdiction). For example, they might rout into an FFE, or into a minefield. Well, if the leader wounds, his available MF is going to be reduced, and that will therefore similarly reduce the broken unit's MF (because they must remain stacked together). If the leader breaks, they're no longer routing together (broken units rout individually, not as a stack) [EXC: if they are surrendering].

Basically, if the leader's MF is restricted (for whatever reason) then the broken unit's MF is going to be similarly restricted -- if you want the leader to rout with the broken unit. It could not possibly be clearer. If you're worried that they won't get far enough as a consequence, then don't do the voluntary rout.

 

[Hutch]

What happened to them? "Da Priest" disappeared after AoO came out.