What next?

wrongway149

Forum Guru
Joined
Aug 25, 2005
Messages
9,403
Reaction score
2,099
Location
Willoughby, Ohio
Country
llUnited States
You know, I have just never been thrilled by the Guards Counterattack.

I think it is because it is just so scripted. Plus the unit density for the second scenario.

I know. Shut up and play!
With both sides having a SAN of '6', it can turn fluid in a hurry.

I still enjoy it.
 

Actionjick

Forum Guru
Joined
Apr 23, 2020
Messages
7,468
Reaction score
4,995
Location
Kent, Ohio
First name
Darryl
Country
llUnited States
With both sides having a SAN of '6', it can turn fluid in a hurry.

I still enjoy it.
Pete while looking through my notebooks and play listings I was struck by how many times we played Guards Counterattack as it's ASL incarnation. Understandable to have multiple playings of it in SL but to keep going back to it in ASL speaks to our enthusiasm for it. As I posted on another thread it was the first scenario I played and the last I played. I'm good with that.

All that being said I can understand that it is not a scenario that everyone would want to go back and replay. I also understand the preordained setup is not what a lot of people are looking for. I like it on occasion. It sort of increases the challenge having to essentially use someone else's setup.

I think atiago44 is referring to The Streets of Stalingrad when he refers to piece density or possibly The Tractor Works. Those were some awesome days playing that trio the first couple times!!🥰🥰

Btw the picture on my avatar is the last time I played it. Fish too probably.
 

atago44

Member
Joined
Jan 3, 2012
Messages
197
Reaction score
172
Country
llUnited States
Well, I am thinking of both The Guards Counterattack (scripted) and The Tractor Works (counter density). Throw in the the tanks, and you've got The Streets of Stalingrad.

However, the past couple of days I have taken a second look at them and have pretty much changed my opinion. With regards to counter density, I was thinking standard-sized compared to Red Barricades-sized hexes. A sniper number of six will no doubt make things interesting.
 
Last edited:

Actionjick

Forum Guru
Joined
Apr 23, 2020
Messages
7,468
Reaction score
4,995
Location
Kent, Ohio
First name
Darryl
Country
llUnited States
Well, I am thinking of both The Guards Counterattack (scripted) and The Tractor Works (counter density). Throw in the the tanks, and you've got The Streets of Stalingrad.

However, the past couple of days I have taken a second look at them and have pretty much changed my opinion. With regards to counter density, I was thinking standard-sized compared to Red Barricades-sized hexes. A sniper number of six will now doubt make things interesting.
Very good for you Sir. 🤗🤗🤗

Going back and looking at old scenarios with experienced eyes can sometimes be quite revealing. Well done you!🤗🤗🤗
 

TimNiesen

Member
Joined
Dec 3, 2020
Messages
304
Reaction score
36
Country
llUnited States
As I related in one of the first posts in this thread, Don1 related that at the first SL conventions players were reluctant to play with engineers and their SW. I expect that with the maturation of the ASL hobby that this era has past. Steve and I in our 25 years of playing ASL alone seldom played with them. In our campaign game Don1 used his Soviet Marine engineers to quickly blow through the seemly impressive line of Steve's Rumanian infantry in the woods. I suppose that it is a skill that one learns with practice. But with the right DRs by Steve, Don1's Soviets could have been defeated. But the right combination of smoke, DCs, and FT is often capable of inflicting a defeat of a seeming secure line of infantry and MGs. The envelopment of the Rumanian pocket in the center, and the capture of the two hills on either side of the valley isolating them, would not have been possible without this decisive destruction of the Rumanian right flank by the Soviet engineers. My task was much simpler, I simply used CX movement up the densely wooded hill on the Rumanian left flank, through mainly enemy dummy counters. Do German engineers play a decisive role in Red Barricades? Tim
 

bendizoid

Official ***** Dickweed
Joined
Sep 11, 2006
Messages
4,630
Reaction score
3,244
Location
Viet Nam
Country
llUnited States
As I related in one of the first posts in this thread, Don1 related that at the first SL conventions players were reluctant to play with engineers and their SW. I expect that with the maturation of the ASL hobby that this era has past. Steve and I in our 25 years of playing ASL alone seldom played with them. In our campaign game Don1 used his Soviet Marine engineers to quickly blow through the seemly impressive line of Steve's Rumanian infantry in the woods. I suppose that it is a skill that one learns with practice. But with the right DRs by Steve, Don1's Soviets could have been defeated. But the right combination of smoke, DCs, and FT is often capable of inflicting a defeat of a seeming secure line of infantry and MGs. The envelopment of the Rumanian pocket in the center, and the capture of the two hills on either side of the valley isolating them, would not have been possible without this decisive destruction of the Rumanian right flank by the Soviet engineers. My task was much simpler, I simply used CX movement up the densely wooded hill on the Rumanian left flank, through mainly enemy dummy counters. Do German engineers play a decisive role in Red Barricades? Tim
Yep, lots of reasons, one is being able to retain FTs and DCs. They don’t ELR have infantry smoke almost on demand and have very dense firepower. They also help in the refit phase to clear obstacles.
 

TimNiesen

Member
Joined
Dec 3, 2020
Messages
304
Reaction score
36
Country
llUnited States
I did not witness the action, but Steve was amazed by Don1's skillful use of the engineers, and their SWs, which resulted in the near total destruction of the strong Rumanian defensive line in the woods. The next turn saw a mop up of the three or four remaining Rumanian MMCs on that flank. Off to the races after that. Steve did not roll well in his defensive fires, 8s,9s,10s,11s, so he could have done better. The assault mechanics of engineers are different than those of the normal prep fire and attack methods of regular ASL infantry combat. Steve and I had been kept in ignorance about the effectiveness of engineers in combat. I expect that the future Manila module will require the extensive and effective use of American 747 engineers against the dug in Japanese Naval infantry. Tim
 

Vic Provost

Forum Guru
Joined
Sep 18, 2016
Messages
1,454
Reaction score
3,266
Location
Pittsfield, MA USA
First name
Vic
Country
llUnited States
When you guys can, pool your money and buy Red Factories, the RB part alone is worth the money and is the basis for so many other HASLs. Great scenarios and several campaigns to fight, I have never spent better $ on any ASL product (other than the rules), for sure, Vic.
 

TimNiesen

Member
Joined
Dec 3, 2020
Messages
304
Reaction score
36
Country
llUnited States
Vic, There are always replacement modules to purchase. I think that I am going to cancel my own Manila preorder, and instead preorder Rising Sun as well as the relatively new French module. It would be nice to have the new French vehicle and ordinance notes for playing Stonne. Not that I expect that there is substantial difference. The new PTO rules in Rising Sun may or may not be significant. Don 1 is pre-ordering the Manilia game, so there is no need to order a second one. Red Barricades would likely be a game ordered at a later date. I have doubles of most of the regular modules. Tim
 

atago44

Member
Joined
Jan 3, 2012
Messages
197
Reaction score
172
Country
llUnited States
As I related in one of the first posts in this thread, Don1 related that at the first SL conventions players were reluctant to play with engineers and their SW. I expect that with the maturation of the ASL hobby that this era has past. Steve and I in our 25 years of playing ASL alone seldom played with them. In our campaign game Don1 used his Soviet Marine engineers to quickly blow through the seemly impressive line of Steve's Rumanian infantry in the woods. I suppose that it is a skill that one learns with practice. But with the right DRs by Steve, Don1's Soviets could have been defeated. But the right combination of smoke, DCs, and FT is often capable of inflicting a defeat of a seeming secure line of infantry and MGs. The envelopment of the Rumanian pocket in the center, and the capture of the two hills on either side of the valley isolating them, would not have been possible without this decisive destruction of the Rumanian right flank by the Soviet engineers. My task was much simpler, I simply used CX movement up the densely wooded hill on the Rumanian left flank, through mainly enemy dummy counters. Do German engineers play a decisive role in Red Barricades? Tim
Right now I am on the getting "blowed up" side of the equation. Smoke (OBA) your location (stone building), the location adjacent to you, the engineer with the flame thrower moves next to you, you die.

Yeah, that's my skill level. 😕
 

atago44

Member
Joined
Jan 3, 2012
Messages
197
Reaction score
172
Country
llUnited States
As I related in one of the first posts in this thread, Don1 related that at the first SL conventions players were reluctant to play with engineers and their SW. I expect that with the maturation of the ASL hobby that this era has past. Steve and I in our 25 years of playing ASL alone seldom played with them. In our campaign game Don1 used his Soviet Marine engineers to quickly blow through the seemly impressive line of Steve's Rumanian infantry in the woods. I suppose that it is a skill that one learns with practice. But with the right DRs by Steve, Don1's Soviets could have been defeated. But the right combination of smoke, DCs, and FT is often capable of inflicting a defeat of a seeming secure line of infantry and MGs. The envelopment of the Rumanian pocket in the center, and the capture of the two hills on either side of the valley isolating them, would not have been possible without this decisive destruction of the Rumanian right flank by the Soviet engineers. My task was much simpler, I simply used CX movement up the densely wooded hill on the Rumanian left flank, through mainly enemy dummy counters. Do German engineers play a decisive role in Red Barricades? Tim
As for German engineers in RB, play it and you will find out.
 

TimNiesen

Member
Joined
Dec 3, 2020
Messages
304
Reaction score
36
Country
llUnited States
I have little experience with the use of engineers of any nationality. One of my gaps in ASL experience. I know that there ASL scenarios with such troops and SWs, but there never were part of my play. Tim
 

von Marwitz

Forum Guru
Joined
Nov 25, 2010
Messages
14,358
Reaction score
10,207
Location
Kraut Corner
Country
llUkraine
I have little experience with the use of engineers of any nationality. One of my gaps in ASL experience. I know that there ASL scenarios with such troops and SWs, but there never were part of my play. Tim
Some sound tactical advice on their use:
Roll low.

Cheers,
von Marwitz
 

TimNiesen

Member
Joined
Dec 3, 2020
Messages
304
Reaction score
36
Country
llUnited States
Or in the case of Don1's Soviet 628 engineer's massacre of the seemingly impressive Rumanian infantry line. Have your opponent roll high in his defensive first fire and subsequent first fire! In the Stonne purchase list for the Germans there is a staff car. I suppose that this is in game terms akin to a jeep without weapons? Larger carrying capacity? Tim
 

atago44

Member
Joined
Jan 3, 2012
Messages
197
Reaction score
172
Country
llUnited States
I have little experience with the use of engineers of any nationality. One of my gaps in ASL experience. I know that there ASL scenarios with such troops and SWs, but there never were part of my play. Tim
Me either.

The one time I played RB (as German) I purchased engineers. The only thing I remember is my guy with a flame thrower dying and my opponent picking it up.
 

Robin Reeve

The Swiss Moron
Staff member
Moderator
Joined
Jul 26, 2003
Messages
19,596
Reaction score
5,557
Location
St-Légier
First name
Robin
Country
llSwitzerland
Or in the case of Don1's Soviet 628 engineer's massacre of the seemingly impressive Rumanian infantry line. Have your opponent roll high in his defensive first fire and subsequent first fire! In the Stonne purchase list for the Germans there is a staff car. I suppose that this is in game terms akin to a jeep without weapons? Larger carrying capacity? Tim
See chapter H note.
 
Top