What does mean that a leader directs an attack?

turlusiflu

Member
Joined
May 2, 2006
Messages
163
Reaction score
42
Location
Catalonia
Country
llSweden
This is a question that is still confusing for some of our group of players. As per A10.7 LEADERSHIP: ...An unbroken Personnel leader may use its leadership rating to affect the performance of other Personnel in its Location... (A leader) may use his leadership modifier...to direct Multiple ROF, Subsequent First Fire, Final Fire, or FPF attacks...

So, could we conclude that to direct an attack means that the leader is able to apply its leadership rating to that attack? Then, its mere presence won't be enough to direct that attack in any manner.

For instance, a leader cannot apply its DRM to a FT attack, so it cannot direct that attack and, consequently cannot avoid any possible cowering penalty.

A leader stacked with a squad with a MG directs First Fire of the MG, and then the squad (not british) fires vs another target and rolls doubles. The presence of the leader wouldn't prevent the cowering.
 

klasmalmstrom

Forum Guru
Joined
Feb 26, 2003
Messages
18,317
Reaction score
5,151
Location
Sweden
Country
llSweden
So, could we conclude that to direct an attack means that the leader is able to apply its leadership rating to that attack?
Pretty much yes...a leader can direct a FT attak, even it's leadership factor does not apply.

Then, its mere presence won't be enough to direct that attack in any manner.
Correct.

For instance, a leader cannot apply its DRM to a FT attack, so it cannot direct that attack and, consequently cannot avoid any possible cowering penalty.
Yes a leader can direct a FT attack.


A leader stacked with a squad with a MG directs First Fire of the MG, and then the squad (not british) fires vs another target and rolls doubles. The presence of the leader wouldn't prevent the cowering.
Correct.
 

The Cisco Kid

Member
Joined
Oct 30, 2011
Messages
198
Reaction score
29
Location
Over the Rainbow
First name
Paul
Country
llUnited States
I don't understand the purpose of a Leader directing an FT attack without using it's DRM. (I guess for preventing cowering, self-deploy, rallying, routing to name a few etc) Clearly, 22.2 says it cannot, but what is the Leader then directing? Of course, it can help a unit to Rally etc. Reading A7.53 last paragraph..."A Leader directing fire is treated as if he were firing." So he shares any First Fire, Final Fire, Prep Fire counters unless he is directing a multiple ROF weapon?
 
Last edited:

EagleIV

Senior Member
Joined
Jan 3, 2008
Messages
1,160
Reaction score
366
Location
California
Country
llUnited States
...
So he shares any First Fire, Final Fire, Prep Fire counters unless he is directing a multiple ROF weapon?
Actually the leader shares the same Fire counter and status as the ROF weapon he is directing so if ROF is maintained and not used the proper counter would be placed at the end of the phase on the leader, weapon and unit(s) actually firing the weapon.
 

The Cisco Kid

Member
Joined
Oct 30, 2011
Messages
198
Reaction score
29
Location
Over the Rainbow
First name
Paul
Country
llUnited States
Actually the leader shares the same Fire counter and status as the ROF weapon he is directing so if ROF is maintained and not used the proper counter would be placed at the end of the phase on the leader, weapon and unit(s) actually firing the weapon.
Yup figured that, thanks
 

Stewart

Senior Member
Joined
Jun 20, 2006
Messages
2,360
Reaction score
330
Location
California
Country
llUnited States
I think the question behind everything (if I undestand Turlusiflu) was if a leader directing a squad that is firing a FT can prevent the cowering of it. Yes, it will not cower.
It's almost pointless to direct a FT attack.
12 changes from NMC to PTC
10 NE
8 NE
6 4MC -3MC Nigh an effect
4 1KIA -K/4 You lose a HS effect...almost no one passes a 4MC
2 3KIA - 2KIA Yeah ok...
 

ibncalb

Member
Joined
Jun 12, 2004
Messages
499
Reaction score
242
Location
St. Malo
Country
llFrance
It's almost pointless to direct a FT attack.
It stops the firing unit being marked with a FF counter if it does cower.

The FT might be firing at long range or against a ? target. The column shift for cowering can be significant. I'm not sure why you think its pointless.
 

Stewart

Senior Member
Joined
Jun 20, 2006
Messages
2,360
Reaction score
330
Location
California
Country
llUnited States
It stops the firing unit being marked with a FF counter if it does cower.

The FT might be firing at long range or against a ? target. The column shift for cowering can be significant. I'm not sure why you think its pointless.
My example wasn't long range up to 2nd level.
If you FF after you break a full stack of units....you shouldn't be disappointed...
MAYBE use the leader and fire the squad in First fire since you don't need it in the FT attack.
 

turlusiflu

Member
Joined
May 2, 2006
Messages
163
Reaction score
42
Location
Catalonia
Country
llSweden
Yes a leader can direct a FT attack.
There is a Q&A fron an Annual '92 that agrees with this. But that brings me again to the subject of the question. When does this game consider that a leader "directs" an attack? When you "attach" the leader to the units/SW that make that attack, even if the leader cannot apply its leadership? I don't think of other cases similar to that of the FT, but the rulebook is so huge...
 

klasmalmstrom

Forum Guru
Joined
Feb 26, 2003
Messages
18,317
Reaction score
5,151
Location
Sweden
Country
llSweden
I think the leader-directed FT attacks could be the only such attack that a leader can direct but not apply his leadership drm..
 

Philippe D.

Elder Member
Joined
Jul 1, 2016
Messages
1,874
Reaction score
1,059
Location
Bordeaux
Country
llFrance
I think the leader-directed FT attacks could be the only such attack that a leader can direct but not apply his leadership drm..
Possibly a Thrown DC? (that's the other SW with a "no leadership drm" symbol that I can think of - I'm not even sure if a Thrown DC can Cower, so maybe there really is no reason to try to direct it)
 

EagleIV

Senior Member
Joined
Jan 3, 2008
Messages
1,160
Reaction score
366
Location
California
Country
llUnited States
Possibly a Thrown DC? (that's the other SW with a "no leadership drm" symbol that I can think of - I'm not even sure if a Thrown DC can Cower, so maybe there really is no reason to try to direct it)
Cowering does not effect DCs (penultimate sentence of A7.9).
 

Old Noob

Senior Member
Joined
Jan 10, 2020
Messages
986
Reaction score
913
Country
llUnited States
EagleIV: Cowering will not affect a Demolition Charge attack. BUT the breaking of the unit that placed said Demolition Charge might.
 

EagleIV

Senior Member
Joined
Jan 3, 2008
Messages
1,160
Reaction score
366
Location
California
Country
llUnited States
I'm not sure what your situation is. If the DC is being placed, you can have a leader moving with the placing unit who could help with any MC, but that leader isn't "Directing" the DC attack in any way.
You could also have a unit throw the DC, but then if there is a leader with the unit throwing the DC he must help with any MC, it doesn't matter if he is directing the attack or not.
 
Top