What do you think of MMP's stewardship of ASL so far?

What do you think of MMP's handling of ASL so far?

  • They are doing a fantastic job!

    Votes: 9 6.3%
  • Not perfect, but they're doing very well

    Votes: 42 29.6%
  • Good. Better than I thought they would

    Votes: 8 5.6%
  • I'm content with the job they're doing

    Votes: 32 22.5%
  • They're doing a mediocre job

    Votes: 30 21.1%
  • Not terrible, but I wish they were doing a lot better

    Votes: 16 11.3%
  • Terrible. I'm very disappointed so far

    Votes: 5 3.5%

  • Total voters
    142

WaterRabbit

Member
Joined
Jul 25, 2004
Messages
2,566
Reaction score
28
Location
Somewhere
Country
llGreenland
kdalton said:
[*]We reprinted Doomed Battalions, not Croix De Guerre. If you're going to accuse us of screwing up something, at least make sure it's the right product, please. :rolleyes:
I stand corrected. I meant DB, but my fingers translated it to CdG. Sorry. However, that is no reason to be snide. I was actually planning on editing it, but too many people had subsequently posted, which surprised me since this forum usual has a much slower pace. :surprise: This coupled with your over simplification of my points translates to someone who is overly defense – a strange trait for a Public Relations person. :confused:

kdalton said:
1. We are taking too long to produce product, namely AOO.
My problem is not that MMP is taking too long per se. My problem is that MMP has published deadlines for products and then slipped on them. The problem here is communication with the customer. A simple progress report on the website would improve this. Also, it is not just AoO that has slipped.

kdalton said:
2. We keep rearranging the product line.
Rearranging the product line is not my issue either. Again the problem is communication. If a product like WoA or BV is updated, it should be clear as to the impact it will have for both the Old Guard and the new player. A detailed upgrade path posted on the website would help. It is difficult for most consumers to keep track of which counter has been replaced and in which product it was replaced. An online armory would go far to alleviate this confusion. Also, listing which products, when combined, create a complete current rulebook would be a great service as well.

kdalton said:
3. Our website isn't updated regularly.

Our website: It's out of date. That's why we're in the process of completely redesigning it, complete with some content management features that will help us update the system more efficiently, increase order tracking, automate our shipping process, you name it.
Again, communication. It would be great if this kind of information was available on the website. I am glad to hear that step are being taken to improve it. However, I am not prescient – I can’t know ahead of time that improvements are in the works unless that is communicated.

kdalton said:
4. We screw up counters and don't proof anything.
That is clearly a misstatement of my comments. Only one error for the counters in Operation Veritable is great and I applaud the good job that was done. However, I was part of the playtest for Blood Reef Tarawa. Not once was a proof sheet of the counters sent to our team to inspect for errors. Perhaps this has changed. My only point is that the more eyes that examine the proofs, the more likely errors will be caught. ;)

kdalton said:
OK, let me address the criticism of the ASL starter kit first. Not only was it a starter product, it was also a market test for the new style board.
This is interesting news. Perhaps I be more interested in purchasing at least the boards to have a look at them. However, if the product is mainly geared toward new players, how do you really know that they are accepted by the Old Guard ? If this idea was communicated (again on the web site) you might have been able to get even more feedback. I am at least more interested in it now since it might have some value to me.

Now I don’t know you and you don’t know me. You are probably a great guy and one I would love to game with. As a matter of fact, it would be cool if you had a little blurb on the “About Us” page on the website. :cool:

My intent is not to run down the company. I want you guys to succeed and succeed big. I have gammed with Brian and he has participated in WWF when I was the TD. I have participated in the playtest of West of Alamein, The Last Hurrah, Red Barricades, and BR:T. I have been TD for the Portland Adventure Gamefest and Wild West Fest. Not because I particularly like running tournaments – I would much rather play. However, I love this game and I want to see new people drawn into it and I am willing to “pay the dues” when necessary to keep the hobby going. :love:

One of the first rules of business is to communicate with the customer. IMHO, the biggest failing of MMP to this point has been communication with the fan base. An official company forum – even if only a link to an already established forum like this one would be great. As a matter of fact, I think you should take with Don about doing this since he runs a first rate forum here. It is fast and well organized and his “forum culture” has the right level-headed feel. :D It seems to me that the MMP website should be the premier portal for ASL. If I want any info on ASL, my first stop should be the MMP website.

One of the second rules of business is that ever complaint is an opportunity. Please take my comments in this vein. Also remember that the topic of the thread is “What do you think of MMP's stewardship of ASL so far?” If you would like I can also post a thread on all of the things that you have done right, however, much of that has been covered above. :)
 

WaterRabbit

Member
Joined
Jul 25, 2004
Messages
2,566
Reaction score
28
Location
Somewhere
Country
llGreenland
kazbah_707 said:
Nonetheless, I hope you will understand that the British can be "a bit testy" at the suggestion that there wasn't really a war going on until the Americans entered it. British soldiers were dying while you practiced "isolation-ism" or whatever you called it.

To evaluate a Campaign-Game that involves British forces as gag-worthy suggests to me that either an incomplete understanding of the war exists, or an American-centric world-view that makes it gag-worthy for me.

Just my opinion...Alan

Alan
I am going to have to call foul here. ;) This is a little bit of revisionist history mixed with 20/20 hindsight. You might make a case for American isolationism in ’39 and during the Phony War. However, us Yanks were revving up the Arsenal of Democracy in ’40. We would have been hard pressed to field an Army any sooner than we did. Perhaps you might want to review a few history books from the American perspective instead of the French. :devil:
 

Dr Zaius

Chief Defender of the Faith
Staff member
Administrator
Moderator
Joined
May 1, 2001
Messages
8,897
Reaction score
514
Location
The Forbidden Zone
First name
Don
Country
llUnited States
kdalton said:
We're not sure what we're going to do about company updates with Consimworld changing. Many game companies, just like us, used it to update customers. We're not sure if we're going with an onsite forum or not right now. The ASLML hasn't been our product update forum in at least a year, but you're right, we need to address that in the site redesign.
Allow me to throw out my own 2 cents on this one. Warfare HQ was created expressly for this very purpose: to bring wargamers together and provide them with the latest news and updates from around the wargaming community. Starting an "official" ASL forum would no doubt kill off almost all the traffic at the various ASL forums that currently exist, including this one. It would also do the one thing I have railed against since I started this enterprise several years ago: isolate the fans of this wargame in one place. ASLers would start going exclusively to that forum and in my humble opinion, it's bad for the wargaming community as a whole whenever that happens.

Running a forum like this is a huge amount of work and it takes constant moderation and manpower to ensure it doesn't devolve into a flame pit like the ML and several other wargame usegroups I can think of. If MMP were to start an official forum, them customers would have a right to expect timely responses to any questions or concerns posted there. MMP would also then be in the "bad guy" position I am occasionally in when I have to remove threads and throw people off. Doing it on ConSim is one thing, doing it on the company's official webiste is entirely different.

The reason that Warfare HQ has been as successful as it has is precisely because of how well we do this kind of thing. Some game developers have almost adopted us as semi-official forums for particular games because of our ability to attract so many wargamers of so many different kinds.

What would I like to see? I do agree that MMP needs a way to communicate important stuff to the customer base on a regular basis. That is easily done by incorporating a news program like the one we use for the main Warfare HQ website. Take a look at the main news page (http://www.warfarehq.com/index.php?page=news.php). It's powerful and easy to use and it's highly customizable. It's called Cutenews and it's free.

To my mind creating an official ASL forum will only serve to re-isolate the ASL community from other wargamers again. That's a mistake, but it's just my own opinion. :cool:
 

kdalton

Member
Joined
Feb 11, 2003
Messages
2,457
Reaction score
72
Location
Charleston, WV
Right on, Don. ;)


THe thing we liked about consim was the one stop shopping aspect. A gamer who liked several different games could roll into there and get what they needed. Of course, a revamped news site on our website would help. :cheeky: Besides there, we have here and the forums. SInce this site contains more than than just ASL, you have some of that synergy here, although not as much because of consimworld's expansiveness. That's why we're being cautious right now. We just want to do what is best for our customers and our company.
Keith
 

WaterRabbit

Member
Joined
Jul 25, 2004
Messages
2,566
Reaction score
28
Location
Somewhere
Country
llGreenland
On Forums

I think the point I am trying to make has been lost. I don't care who hosts the forum. What I want is a button on the MMP site that, when pushed, takes me to the "official" forum.

The problem with a forum like ConsimWorld is that it is not self-archiving and easily searchable. That means a lot of repetition of questions, answers, announcements, and other information.

The problem with the unofficial ASL forum is it does not have "hover" (where you can see what is posted without entering the topic) and a lot of other features. The software they are using is archaic (at least in computer terms).

The software on this site looks to be the same used over at En World -- a site that has an enormous amount of traffic. The only time I have seen it to be slow is when someone posts a large graphic.

Whatever solution MMP decides upon, I hope it is a forward-looking one and not an antiquated one.
 

ibncalb

Member
Silver Supporting Member
Joined
Jun 12, 2004
Messages
392
Reaction score
128
Location
St. Malo
Country
llFrance
i'm an average asl'er

i leave civilisation for 14 months, i get back, and the only new official asl product available to me is J5.

not really worth the wait.

b e n
 

M Faulkner

Disgruntled Democrat
Joined
Feb 1, 2003
Messages
1,179
Reaction score
22
Location
Formerly The Ghetto
Country
llUnited States
Maybe KDalton can give reason to this:

I have found it quite intresting that over the last three (maybe four) MMP hasn't debuted a single product as ASLOK. When I first started attending ASLOK (10 years ago), it was the place to show case the new productm{AH(MMP),CH,HOB,SP and reciently SoCal (Melee pack)}. I realize that it can be difficult to time all products to meet such a deadline, but at ASLOK people have $$$$$ to spend on product(Just ask Evan Sherry). I remember plopping down $400 cash for ABTF and BRT when they came out(I was buying for friends also).

Why has this way of doing business changed?

Just my thoughts and opinions,
 
Last edited:

Priest

Member
Joined
Aug 18, 2003
Messages
2,132
Reaction score
4
Location
Denver, Colorado
SGT HOLST said:
Hi-

Well Kommrade, your gonna have Ron Mosher, Keith D. and a host of other MMP supporters shout you down. So be ready for the back lash.
Just trying to be fair to MMP

SGT HOLST said:
Also, I did lodge a complaint with Josh Izzo, Hasbro's Publications and license department head. He is investigating MMP's lack of product output right now.

Scott
Unless I am very much mistaken there are only two people working part-time on the ASL side and that is Brian and Perry. Well this takes time, both Brian and Perry need to earn some money to pay the bills. When was the last time anyone voluteered to help these two out, without expecting free games or your name on a counter? If you want faster output then instead of complaining to some suit at Hasbro, volunteer some time. Remember if Hasbro takes this over, you may be playing it with plastic tanks.
 

graydo

Member
Joined
Jul 5, 2004
Messages
144
Reaction score
4
Location
Northern Minnesota
Country
llUnited States
Priest said:
When was the last time anyone voluteered to help these two out, without expecting free games or your name on a counter?
I offered to help with the counter layout but didn't have the right DTP software (still using Pagemaker, not Quark).

dave
 

Gunner Scott

Elder Member
Joined
Jan 27, 2003
Messages
13,046
Reaction score
1,676
Location
Chicago, IL
Country
llUnited States
Howdy-

Priest, first of all, if MMP felt like they were over their heads, then let another outfit put ASL stuff out. I am an ASL Customer, I have the right to complain, if you dont like it tough. It aint my problem MMP is in over their heads. But hey, they have the propaganda minister to tell us otherwise.

Ben, looks like Shifting Sands is going to the printers next, so dont expect any ASL modules for some time.

I luvs you people, and I am so looking forward to meeting you bozo's at ASLOK. Will your online personality match your offline personality? we shell see in October.


Scott
 

kdalton

Member
Joined
Feb 11, 2003
Messages
2,457
Reaction score
72
Location
Charleston, WV
M Faulkner said:
Maybe KDalton can give reason to this:

I have found it quite intresting that over the last three (maybe four) MMP hasn't debuted a single product as ASLOK. When I first started attending ASLOK (10 years ago), it was the place to show case the new productm{AH(MMP),CH,HOB,SP and reciently SoCal (Melee pack)}. I realize that it can be difficult to time all products to meet such a deadline, but at ASLOK people have $$$$$ to spend on product(Just ask Evan Sherry). I remember plopping down $400 cash for ABTF and BRT when they came out(I was buying for friends also).

Why has this way of doing business changed?

Just my thoughts and opinions,
The reason for this change is the preorder system. Before it, a lot of people used to wait until a tourney before buying a game. Now, everyone preorders either directly or through a game store for the discount. Op Veritable shipped in December 2002. At Winter Offensive in January 2003, there weren't that many sold, not like a new product would sell in the past.

Now, we did do a brisk business at the World Boardgaming Championships, spurred by the starter kit and the fact we were offering a WBC discount, but so far that's been the exception instead of the norm.
 

kdalton

Member
Joined
Feb 11, 2003
Messages
2,457
Reaction score
72
Location
Charleston, WV
You're welcome herr section leader.:p Is that a Lewis Gun in your avatar or are you just happy to see me?
 

Gunner Scott

Elder Member
Joined
Jan 27, 2003
Messages
13,046
Reaction score
1,676
Location
Chicago, IL
Country
llUnited States
Ha ha, any moron knows that WO attendence will not be as high as ASLOK's, worse, its just after Xmas, so thats a double whamy as far as selling ASL stuff.

Anyway mr.propaganda minister august is half way done, I know there will be no products in september, what about October? AoO? VotG? J6?

Scott



MMP's propaganda minister writes;
<<The reason for this change is the preorder system. Before it, a lot of people used to wait until a tourney before buying a game. Now, everyone preorders either directly or through a game store for the discount. Op Veritable shipped in December 2002. At Winter Offensive in January 2003, there weren't that many sold, not like a new product would sell in the past.

Now, we did do a brisk business at the World Boardgaming Championships, spurred by the starter kit and the fact we were offering a WBC discount, but so far that's been the exception instead of the norm.>>
 

Aries

Member
Joined
Dec 14, 2002
Messages
4,187
Reaction score
5
Location
Earth
Country
llCanada
Its a catch 22 situation for me.

Let's say MMP suddenly announced every fricking article in their entire inventory (even rare items like Annuals) was now fully in stock and priced at 50% off for the next 6 months, with stock 100% garanteed to be in stock and shipping within 3 business days.

It would likely mean a sudden urge to cry out of control for days for me.

Because I don't have any spare cash anyways :)

Must be about 5 major purchase articles I want.
So what they ain't on sale or ain't in stock in some cases.

Only glimmer of joy in my life is I bought ASL as it was being made in the 80s 90s and I already own 90% of it now.

I will likely never make a better decision than I did back then to buy it all back then.
Because there sure ain't no way I could ever buy it all today.
 
Joined
May 15, 2004
Messages
102
Reaction score
7
Location
Logroño
Country
llSpain
Only a question

Why MMP doesn´t hire a full-time person to research ASL line as Dean Essig does in The Gamers line?
 

Harold

Member
Joined
Feb 2, 2003
Messages
209
Reaction score
1
Location
Puget Sound
Country
llUnited States
Without yet looking at any of the other responses I think MMP has done a fabulous job in piloting the ASL line. They do this in between their day job or studies and do it under a very harsh microscope. The quality and effort that goes into the products is top notch. AS long as they are producing ASL, and OCS and SCS for that matter I'm buying.
 
Top