VASL Logfile etiquette

Hubbs5

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Hey Guys,

A couple of years ago I was playing VASL by e-mail and I had a situation occur that left me wondering if I handled it correctly.

I sent my opponent a logfile and near the end of that logfile I took a shot with one of my ATG's and malfed it. My opponent sent the logfile back but he had only gotten part way through it because I had made some minor error and he wanted to give me the chance to correct it. Not knowing how to retrieve the previous logfile I just started from where he had gotten and redid the last half of my logfile only this time my ATG got a CH on his best tank and blazed it. I have had the same thing happen to me in reverse where I knew I got a very important CH and yet for some reason my opponent stops the logfile and sends it back and I lose everything that happened after that point.

So here is the question, what is considered proper in those cases? Do you re-do the logfile and lose whatever events occurred after that or do you open the previous logfile and make the changes in that logfile and then keep the events that happened before? These events can be major swings that can make the difference between winning and losing a scenario. Most of the time my opponents never knew what happened as they hadn't gotten that far yet, but I don't want to be dishonest if a bad event occurred or slighted if a favorable event occurred. Above all I don't want my integrity questioned so if anyone has any thoughts or suggestions on this matter I would appreciate hearing them.
 

paul

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I see this happen a lot, it is almost unavoidable. Since your opponent
isn't able to correct your moves in real time, they will find issues that
need to be corrected. (unless you are one of the perfect players :)

My suggestion is to talk with your opponent prior to the start of the game,
and set the ground rules.

You should agree on how to recover from an error found part of the way
through a log file. Many errors can just be modified in place (i.e. wrong
DRM for a MC), but other will require a more aggressive approach.

I believe in these cases, it is necessary to completely redo the log file,
although I suppose you could agree to "re-create" the results in the new
log file (but where is the fun of just hearing the results) In addition, you
can view it the log file you send as preliminary until the opponent blesses
them, if they don't get to them (i.e. find an issue) then they never
happened.

VASL is a game based on odds, and if you have a relatively standard
method to handle the results it shouldn't impact the overall results greatly
(i.e. a CH could have been replaced by a malf'ed gun)

Bottom line is a game of VASL PBEM is based on trust, as long as you
agree with your opponent on how to handle these issues prior to the start
of the game and be honest about when results like yours are overridden
you should be fine with any reasonable player.

-Paul
 

SamB

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This is one of the things I -really- don't like about PBEM. (I don't -do- PBEM anymore).

You end up playing the game about three times. You go throu your movement phase and mail it to your opponent. He blazes a tank or lays residual and mails the file back to you. You re-do your movement from that point, only this time your bounding fire shot misses... etc.

I -much- prefer live play.

JMO, YMMV
Sam
 

paul

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Sam,

I also don't like it, but I get in ASL how ever I can. I think those of us
with young families can find it more difficult to find time to play. It is easier to find 10-15 minutes here and their than a solid 1/2 day.

Maybe MMP can start a baby sitting service to help us with kids get
more playing in . . . :)

-Paul
 

Johnny Canuck

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Paul said:
Sam,

I also don't like it, but I get in ASL how ever I can. I think those of us
with young families can find it more difficult to find time to play. It is easier to find 10-15 minutes here and their than a solid 1/2 day.

Maybe MMP can start a baby sitting service to help us with kids get
more playing in . . . :)

-Paul
Let's see now:

1) I'm a scout leader
2) I'm a father of 2 young kids
3) I'm taking night school
4) I'm a manager during the day
5) My wife has various volunteer and work duties as well . .

It's amazing I've got ANY time for ASL. PBEM will have to suffice for me.

Not only that, but when I was a kid . . . .
 

Barber

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In response to the original query, I think what you did and what happened was fine. If you're opponent thinks an error was significant enough to merit stopping the file for a correction, then nothing else happens after that point and you got the free do over. C'est la guerre.

Usually in my games, errors get corrected on the fly. If a DRM gets missed, or MF aren't tallied correctly, my opponent points it out (and it's always my opponent because I'm always the one making mistakes) and keeps the file going. Those missed DRMs and such can be a problem at times and the difference between a break and a pin so on occasion that merits stopping and a creating new file. As always with PBeM games, it's a gray area.

With regards to Sam's post: well then don't try and do the entire MPh in one logfile. Move a couple of guys that won't draw fire, then move a couple that might. Stop and wait and see what your opponent does in his file and then continue.

I have a different excuse in addition to those already offered for playing PBeM games. Until just recently, I thought I was the only ASL player in Montana. Thanks to this forum, another ASL player has been unearthed in Montana. The good news: I finally get to play my second ever face to face game this weekend :D . The bad news: I can no longer describe myself as the ASL Champion of Montana :( .

Jeff
 

Hubbs5

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Thanks guys for the input. I agree with Sam that, if possible "Live VASL" or FTF is a better way to go, however I am also one of those people who just has 30 minute windows of time and that doesn't work for anything but PBEM. My only other option is to play FTF 4 times a year and leave it at that....... nah that isn't even an option, what was I thinking?

Seriously though there are benefits to PBEM that you don't get playing "live" or FTF. I have really increased my grasp of the rules because when I have a question I can take all the time I need to fully answer it, and all of the secondary questions that inevitably arise from looking for the first question. PBEM, at least for me, increases my ASL playtime tenfold and I also get to play people from all over the world, so I gain a wider experience and I don't have to stay up until 4:00 am to play somebody "live" in Europe. So for now it is the best thing going for me. Thanks again Rodney for creating VASL, you should be Knighted for your work. :wink:
 
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