Turning covered arc when eligible to fire

[commissarmatt]

Say you have a tank that is eligible to fire its weapons, but really all it wants to do is change covered arc. Can it change covered arc without rolling the dice, or must a DR occur for one of the eligible weapons to chance breakdown? What if the only eligible weapon is an AAMG? Can you change the CA with an AAMG shot?

 

[Koestler]

See D3.12: an AFV can change its VCA/TCA at the end of a friendly fire phase if it has a bow-mounted/turret-mounted weapon which is still eligible to fire (without intensive fire), without actually taking a shot. There is a Q&A saying that one can change VCA if a turret mounted weapon is eligible to fire, provided it is a Gun. (I.e.: a CMG is not enough).

I would say an AAMG is not enough to change TCA (either with or without taking shot), but I could not find a rule or official Q&A confirming this.

 

[Binchois]

According to D1.83:

...for rules purposes [an AAMG] is considered neither "turret-mounted" nor "bow-mounted"...​

​

At the end of a friendly fire phase, you may change VCA without rolling dice so long as a turret-mounted or bow-mounted weapon (not just Gun - D3.12...I see the Q&A, but I don't see how that statement squares with D3.12) is still eligible to fire (without using Intensive Fire). You may likewise change TCA when a turret-mounted weapon is so eligible to fire.

NOTE: C3.22 - "...Such a change in the PFPh cancels any movement possibilities for that Gun (even a vehicular Gun) and its crew for the rest of that Player Turn, but does not prevent that Gun from attacking in the AFPh — presumably now without any Case A DRM."​

You may also attempt an actual shot by the same weapons in order to change VCA/TCA as appropriate to that weapon (as above), but for either a TCA or VCA change, an AAMG is not sufficient (unless that AAMG is CA restricted).

 

[Binchois]

While I think the OP question has been answered and is clear, Koestler's notice of the Q&A is interesting (possibly old news? - It's new to me). Here's the Q&A:

D3.12 May an AFV change the VCA at the end of a friendly fire phase in which the AFV is eligible to fire only a turret-mounted weapon?​

A. Yes, if it is a Gun (C3.22 & D3.12). [Compil3]​

But the relevant passage in D3.12 doesn't say "Gun." It says any "weapon.":

D3.12 ...The TCA may change as a result of firing a turret-mounted weapon outside its current TCA and the VCA may change for firing a turret/bow-mounted weapon outside its current VCA (Case A), or at the end of any friendly fire phase in which the AFV is eligible to fire (a turret-mounted weapon for TCA or turret/bow-mounted weapon for VCA) without using Intensive Fire (as per C3.22).​

​

Reference to C3.22 doesn't seem to add any confusion:

3.22 CHANGING CA WITHOUT FIRE: A Gun may change its CA without firing only at the end of a friendly fire phase (not MPh), and only if at that time its crew is still able to fire it without using Intensive/Sustained Fire [EXC: (un)limbering (10.22), Pushing (10.3), and turreted guns with other turreted armament (D3.51)]. Such a change in the PFPh cancels any movement possibilities for that Gun (even a vehicular Gun) and its crew for the rest of that Player Turn, but does not prevent that Gun from attacking in the AFPh — presumably now without any Case A DRM.​

​

The rule itself refers to Guns, but D3.12 says that VCA can be changed using any eligible "turret/bow-mounted weapon (as per C3.22). To me, I think C3.22 is a rule for Guns, but D3.12 is allowing other weapons to do the same thing as if they were Guns.

On the facts that I can see, I think the Q&A has misinterpreted the rule. Any thoughts?

 

[Koestler]

D1.83 indeed prevents using an AAMG (except a fixed one) to change TCA; thanks.

About the 'old' Q&A, note that it concerns changing VCA (not TCA) by having an eligible turret mounted weapon, something the text of D3.12 does not seem to allow for. The Q&A would thus add that an eligible turret mounted Gun allows changing VCA. This is still a bit odd, since actually firing a CMG seems to allow for changing VCA as per D3.12. ("However, whenever a vehicle fires a turret-mounted weapon outside its VCA (...) the VCA is not changed (unless the vehicle uses the NT DRM application of case A).") Further thoughts?