Trump - an 'aberration'?

Brian W

Elder Member
Joined
Jan 29, 2003
Messages
7,172
Reaction score
1,133
Location
USA
Country
llUnited States
Hopefully, you'll not be right about the complacency of voters in 2020 and Trump will be ridden out on a rail.
I wasn't talking about "voters" but of that portion of the left that sabotages itself for its own gratification, because whining is more satisfying than hard work.
 

DWPetros

Senior Member
Joined
Sep 27, 2016
Messages
143
Reaction score
405
Country
llUnited States
So, he'll win by more than 3 million votes?
To win by only 3 million votes against the most unqualified person to ever run for POTUS isn't a great accomplishment. And unfortunately anyway, we don't have a democracy which recognizes the popular vote. Biden's policies are practically identical to Clintons and are designed to attract older, less progressive voters (not to mention Wall Street, whose endorsements will not go unnoticed by voters).

Younger, more progressive voters will be turned off again and remain part of the 49% of the voting population that stayed home in '16. Their votes will be sorely needed this time. 2020 isn't 2016, and things that are activating younger voters (climate, student debt, racism) have changed in 4 years and will change at a more rapid pace in the next 2. Biden has demonstrated his tone-deafness to these changed conditions. The Dems failure to recognize that the field had changed radically in '16 gave us Trump. Letting that happen again is, well, stupid.

“We can not solve our problems with the same level of thinking that created them” - Albert Einstein
 
Last edited:

zgrose

Elder Member
Joined
Jun 13, 2004
Messages
3,510
Reaction score
504
Location
Kingwood, TX
First name
Zoltan
Country
llUnited States
I wasn't talking about "voters" but of that portion of the left that sabotages itself for its own gratification, because whining is more satisfying than hard work.
Kind of like the right with their repeal and replace (with TBD)? ;)
 

Brian W

Elder Member
Joined
Jan 29, 2003
Messages
7,172
Reaction score
1,133
Location
USA
Country
llUnited States
For those who want a real reformer as the next president, GOYA and go help:


For those that just want to whine and complain, the internets are free.
 

DWPetros

Senior Member
Joined
Sep 27, 2016
Messages
143
Reaction score
405
Country
llUnited States
It's better than Bernie Sanders did.
You must know as I do that Bernie was never even given the chance by the DNC to run against Trump. He was railroaded and that's a known fact. There's good reason to think he would have kicked Trump's ass.
 

zgrose

Elder Member
Joined
Jun 13, 2004
Messages
3,510
Reaction score
504
Location
Kingwood, TX
First name
Zoltan
Country
llUnited States
You must know as I do that Bernie was never even given the chance by the DNC to run against Trump. He was railroaded and that's a known fact. There's good reason to think he would have kicked Trump's ass.
I don't agree he would've beat Trump in the General Election and I'm not so sure he would've made for a good president.
 

DWPetros

Senior Member
Joined
Sep 27, 2016
Messages
143
Reaction score
405
Country
llUnited States
I don't agree he would've beat Trump in the General Election and I'm not so sure he would've made for a good president.
It's debatable of course whether Bernie would have won or not. What's not debatable is that he was cheated* out of a fair chance to see if he could. His campaign had energy - Hillary's didn't, and you need that energy to win.

*demonstrating that the Democrats left out the democracy part...
 

Mister T

Elder Member
Joined
Aug 12, 2006
Messages
3,709
Reaction score
1,070
Location
Bruxelles
Country
llFrance
It's debatable of course whether Bernie would have won or not. What's not debatable is that he was cheated* out of a fair chance to see if he could. His campaign had energy - Hillary's didn't, and you need that energy to win.

*demonstrating that the Democrats left out the democracy part...
Has something been done on the DNC side so that cheating is prevented this time? Less superdelegate party hacks?
 

zgrose

Elder Member
Joined
Jun 13, 2004
Messages
3,510
Reaction score
504
Location
Kingwood, TX
First name
Zoltan
Country
llUnited States
Has something been done on the DNC side so that cheating is prevented this time? Less superdelegate party hacks?
Was just reading this while Googling Bernie.

Apparently
"The DNC went to great lengths to convince Sanders to sign a loyalty pledge earlier this year, making him vow not to run as a third-party candidate if he were to lose the primary. In return it made changesurged by Sanders, such as minimizing the role of superdelegates in the nomination process."

"The DNC has banned its staff from criticizing or praising any of the 2020 presidential candidates, even in private correspondence."
 

Brian W

Elder Member
Joined
Jan 29, 2003
Messages
7,172
Reaction score
1,133
Location
USA
Country
llUnited States
You must know as I do that Bernie was never even given the chance by the DNC to run against Trump.
Bernie lost because he did not garner the number of voters in the primary as did HRC. If Bernie couldn't win the primary, how was he going to beat Trump?

Note that the RNC hated the idea of candidate Trump and did as much as it could to avoid his nomination. FoxNews was vocal against Trump, as were most national republicans. Yet Trump won. The DNC did basically nothing but enforce its rules. Yet Bernie lost.
 

Brian W

Elder Member
Joined
Jan 29, 2003
Messages
7,172
Reaction score
1,133
Location
USA
Country
llUnited States
"The DNC went to great lengths to convince Sanders to sign a loyalty pledge earlier this year, making him vow not to run as a third-party candidate if he were to lose the primary. In return it made changesurged by Sanders, such as minimizing the role of superdelegates in the nomination process."
To be a working member of the party you have to take a pledge, even here in a small town. Sanders was never a democrat.
 

DWPetros

Senior Member
Joined
Sep 27, 2016
Messages
143
Reaction score
405
Country
llUnited States
Bernie lost because he did not garner the number of voters in the primary as did HRC. If Bernie couldn't win the primary, how was he going to beat Trump?
The DNC did basically nothing but enforce its rules. Yet Bernie lost.
You have the MSN/MSNBC cover story down about how fair and objective the DNC was, but the more objective jury is still out on whether the DNC's bias to Clinton and their efforts to kill the Sanders campaign had a significant effect on the primaries. I suspect it did. But the bigger story than that isn't whether Clinton or Sanders gained the most primary voters. It's the fact that the DNC was loading the dice against Sanders in favor of Clinton; a very undemocratic thing that cannot be ignored if one cares more about the democratic process than winning. The bias within the Dem corporatist establishment against progressive candidates continues and one suspects will also affect the 2020 race.

Here's a read from FAIR: https://fair.org/home/with-dnc-leaks-former-conspiracy-theory-is-now-true-and-no-big-deal/

"While it’s impossible to know whether systemic pro-Hillary Clinton bias at the DNC was decisive in the 2016 Democratic primary race, we now know beyond any doubt that such a bias not only existed, but was endemic and widespread. DNC officials worked to plant pro-Clinton stories, floated the idea of using Sanders’ secular Judaism against him in the South, and routinely ran PR spin for Clinton, even as the DNC claimed over and over it was neutral in the primary. The evidence in the leaks was so clear that Debbie Wasserman Schultz has resigned her role as DNC chair—after her speaking role at the Democratic National Convention this week was scrapped—while DNC co-chair Donna Brazile, who is replacing Wasserman Schultz in the top role, has apologized to the Sanders camp."
 

Sparky

Member
Joined
May 3, 2018
Messages
298
Reaction score
246
Country
llUnited States
For those who want a real reformer as the next president, GOYA and go help:


For those that just want to whine and complain, the internets are free.
that is my dark horse... note she got a standing O in the heart of MAGA country. As I said sometime back in an earlier thread here. Populism is a double edged sword. It cuts both ways.. for both sides. Unlike Trump and the right.. it isn't a con sucker job while they enrich themselves and their cronies and political donor class.. she is a true believer and that makes her and her policies extremely interesting. However more so than anyone else in that rather crowded field.. she is the one most likely to suffer from HRC syndrome. I strongly suspect while her proposed policies will win in 2020. the messenger herself may not.

and not sure if it is me.. but get the strong feeling her and Biden are not on each other's X-mas card lists hahah.
 

Brian W

Elder Member
Joined
Jan 29, 2003
Messages
7,172
Reaction score
1,133
Location
USA
Country
llUnited States
The funny thing is that even if Bernie won/wins, nothing would have gotten done/ will get done, and you would/will be here whining that Bernie sold you out. NOTHING will ever work for you because you cannot allow anything to work.
 

larrymarak

Member
Joined
Jun 4, 2011
Messages
303
Reaction score
98
Location
burbank calif
First name
Larry
Country
llUnited States
He's the first stage of the return to populism in the U.S. And his success record in keeping promises may well usher in a line of elected leaders who must either deliver or step aside. Being a good party member may well become a non-asset in the future
 

DWPetros

Senior Member
Joined
Sep 27, 2016
Messages
143
Reaction score
405
Country
llUnited States
Jesus, you are a foxnews viewer from the other side.
No offense, but being an MSNBC viewer is the opposite side of Fox, albeit not as horrible by many degrees.
I'm non-MSN - and find my news in places where they don't have a corporate driven agenda. You aught to try it yourself.
 

Sparafucil3

Elder Member
Staff member
Moderator
Joined
Oct 7, 2004
Messages
9,075
Reaction score
1,669
Location
USA
First name
Jim
Country
llUnited States
Apparently
"The DNC went to great lengths to convince Sanders to sign a loyalty pledge earlier this year, making him vow not to run as a third-party candidate if he were to lose the primary. In return it made changesurged by Sanders, such as minimizing the role of superdelegates in the nomination process."

"The DNC has banned its staff from criticizing or praising any of the 2020 presidential candidates, even in private correspondence."
So the Left's Grover is out now. How long until the hyperbole hits about this? -- jim
 
Top