Translated ASLRB

[WuWei]

There's an established (and growing) German community, too. But when I have a rule question, I go to Gamesquad.

 

[hongkongwargamer]

Excellent point. Maybe English is the way it should stay. Even if a Chinese sub-community existed I can imagine at some point members would want to graduate to the bigger native English community.

However.......Maybe a ASLRB in Chinese would be primary school ASL for a billion people. It certainly makes entry more accessible. The double whammy of hugely complicated game with hugely complicated language makes it nearly impossible for most Chinese.

I am not sure if that’s your intent but it sounds like you think English is a tough language to learn!

 

[hongkongwargamer]

There's an established (and growing) German community, too. But when I have a rule question, I go to Gamesquad.

Was someone asking where German players go ask questions?

 

[hongkongwargamer]

i have seen a few translation attempts in Asia but it’s not a job for the fainthearted. The biggest issue with the ASLRB is that, at its finest, each rule hangs on the presence/absence of certain words or specialist terms. Plus most of the rules work fairly well with all other rules in terms of coherence and consistency. Thousands of players made sure of it over time. These factors make the creation of a “workable” Rulebook a tall order. I think it’s possible to create a translation someone can read for basic understanding but it a whole another level of have a translation that can stand up to all the cross referencing we do in the normal course of play.

Then of course, theres the matter of maintenance with all the errata and stuff.

 

[Actionjick]

My college advisor wouldn't let me take Spanish. I had to take German because it was more "sciencey". I insisted and he insisted. Of course he won and he was wrong about which language would help me the most.

Yes, of course, they always know what is best for you.

Seems like you should learn the language of those who you are most likely to interact with, either personally or professionally. Or what you have a hankering to understand.

 

[Actionjick]

I am not sure if that’s your intent but it sounds like you think English is a tough language to learn!

Wear due ewe get that crazy idea from??
Eye sea know reel pane their.?

E.T. homophone.

Isle stop four now.

Jest bean a jick. Watts gnu about that???

 

[nekengren2]

Other Chinese players. There’s a fairly established community already.

Are the Chinese communicating in English or Chinese about ASL? I see nothing about ASL in Chinese on your website.
I'm curious if a Chinese Forum exists for ASL.

Neal

 

[hongkongwargamer]

Are the Chinese communicating in English or Chinese about ASL? I see nothing about ASL in Chinese on your website.
I'm curious if a Chinese Forum exists for ASL.

Neal

Chinese ain't my strongest suit.

Players from China communicate via large real time chat groups (via QQ for instance). I have seen wargame forums but there seems to be a real preference for real time chats. They are on GS though.

PS Then again I am generalising. I have met up with clients time and time again who speak absolutely fluent English (not having studied overseas) in my travels to Beijing / Shanghai. We also hosted a number of China players at our tourneys - esp the one in Manila. China players hosted a tournament in Chengdu that had a number of English speakers (GS members) who flew in as well.
PPS On reflection, I should probably be the last person speaking for China players. Guys - my apologies - chime in if you like.

 

[hongkongwargamer]

The main problem is the massive use of acronyms based on English expressions.
If a Spanish, French, etc. ASL community wants to remain in touch with the rest if the world, English is essential.
If one had a translation, there would be a double effort of learning the game in both languages.
That said, there has been at least one attempt to translate the ASLRB in French. But people hardly use it.
The SK1 and 2 rules have been translated, and that makes much more sense, as the rules are shorter than the full ASL tome.

This is a real issue. I have seen a few translations where all the standard ASL terms were reinvented. When folks ask rule questions, we get more confused by the nonstandard terms more than anything else. Best to be using the English RB/ terms, plus that opens you up to more opponents that way.

 

[nekengren2]

Yes, re-inventing standard ASL terms would be a disaster. Those stay the same. However, the text itself can be translated to good purpose I think.

 

[Gordon]

Yes, even in the '80s back when I was back in college and I was first really exposed to other foreign students, I would often hear them talking "blah, blah, blah function, blah, blah, blah, procedure, blah, blah, integer", etc. etc.

 

[Actionjick]

Yes, re-inventing standard ASL terms would be a disaster. Those stay the same. However, the text itself can be translated to good purpose I think.

Was thinking the same thing myself. Would at least give a bridge.

 

[Paul John]

Having done some professional translating, I have to say, this is an immense project.
Perhaps especially given the rhetoric and syntax of the ASLRB, it would be really tough.
I mean, this forum is a clear example of how hard the original is to read.
I love the idea, but I think it would require someone who is near native in both English and the
target language for sure. And someone with a lot of time to devote to it.

 

[Robin Reeve]

It is more than acronyms : there are so many technical terms and expressions.
No language can be rendered word to word (I translate Hebrew and Greek to French and English to French on a daily basis).
If the rulebook were a literary work, one could use periphrases and approximations. But it is a technical manual, which doesn't tolerate the same type of freedom from the translator.

As a side reflexion, what proportion of potential players would the language barrier stop from learning and persevering on the demanding path of ASL?
I have doubts that a game requiring many intellectual skills would be only challenging on the linguistic aspect.

 

[nekengren2]

It is more than acronyms : there are so many technical terms and expressions.
No language can be rendered word to word (I translate Hebrew and Greek to French and English to French on a daily basis).
If the rulebook were a literary work, one could use periphrases and approximations. But it is a technical manual, which doesn't tolerate the same type of freedom from the translator.

As a side reflexion, what proportion of potential players would the language barrier stop from learning and persevering on the demanding path of ASL?
I have doubts that a game requiring many intellectual skills would be only challenging on the linguistic aspect.

Yes, translation is an art and never happens word for word.
Yes, that is why someone has to be quite fluent in all 3............ English, OtherLanguage, ASL.
This is the ONLY person who could attempt such a feat.

The question about potential players and barriers to ASL entry are exactly what I'm questioning. I have no idea..................If a Chinese ASLRB was available................would suddenly 5,000 more people be playing? I'm pretty sure I would NOT want to play one of these people who can't speak English. However, if they have rudimentary English and know the English acronyms...................well at least they could compete in a tournament game. maybe?

Neal

 

[Actionjick]

Yes, translation is an art and never happens word for word.
Yes, that is why someone has to be quite fluent in all 3............ English, OtherLanguage, ASL.
This is the ONLY person who could attempt such a feat.

The question about potential players and barriers to ASL entry are exactly what I'm questioning. I have no idea..................If a Chinese ASLRB was available................would suddenly 5,000 more people be playing? I'm pretty sure I would NOT want to play one of these people who can't speak English. However, if they have rudimentary English and know the English acronyms...................well at least they could compete in a tournament game. maybe?

Neal

It poses enormous challenges, almost better to just come out with a version based on ASL, not a word for word translation.

 

[Actionjick]

Brought this thread up with Action Debbie. Her comment: Have a good time, how long do you have? I Lmao. For a California blonde she has her moments.?

Btw if you have a plaque from one of the early Oktoberfests Action Debbie hand colored the squad leader image. Fish asked her if she would and being good at crafts and art she did. Just a little bit of ASLOk trivia. It's that time of year.

 

[bendizoid]

so basically, It’s easier to learn English than learn to play ASL. I could see that.

 

[Actionjick]

so basically, It’s easier to learn English than learn to play ASL. I could see that.

Bob, just listened to part of your interview with the 2 Half Squad's ( episode 47 ). Some pretty good stuff. Well done!

Lots of good English. Lol. Just keeping on threads topic.

 

[Larry]

My wife and I watch Spanish language movies with subtitles in English. I read, she criticizes the subtitles. I speak enough spanish to know that some of the translations are fudged because the literal translation would make no sense.