TO&E issues

Dr Zaius

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One other thing I noticed while playing is that the TO&E's for the US aviation units are all wrong. There are no longer any mixed aircraft-type units at battalion and below in the US Army. The Army overhauled it aviation force structure several years ago with something called ARI, which stands for Aviation Restructuring Initiative. The end result of this initiative is to have only one type of aircraft in each battalion element. Lift battalions are now UH-60 Black Hawk pure. Attack battalions (AHB's) are AH-64 pure. The same goes for CH-47 units. Cavalry units are either made up of Apaches or Kiowa Warriors. AH-64A's and AH-64D's (Longbow) are not mixed in the same unit. The soldiers that support these aircraft come from different MOS's and they are not mixed together.

https://jacg.wpafb.af.mil/vol1/archive/word/ARMY.DOC

The TO&E's in the game mix Kiowa Warriors, Black Hawks and Apaches at company level and below. That's wrong and I will report this to Scott.

I suspect the same may be true of many of the TO&E's in POA2.
 

HPS

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Thanks for the info. Sturm must have been using old TO&E’s.

If you like, you can send us the TO&E’s and we can change them, or I have another idea that might be better.

You and some of the other folks on the Warfare HQ board have said they want to help in improving the game. Well, this might be a great way to do that and give the board and guys some credit at the same time. What I was thinking is that once I get the new DataView module done, the WHQ guys could fix whatever errors they find and make the changes they want to all the “soft” tables like the nations and TOE’s (including ranks, awards, etc). We could then post those as the official update, “courtesy of Warfare HQ” (and we can give individual credits, as well). That way everybody sorta wins.... especially the guys that have hung with me though this so far!

Please let me know what you think, and we’ll take it from there.

See ya,
-Scott
 

Dr Zaius

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This sounds like a good idea to me. Perhaps everyone here can start keeping track of the TO&E issues they come across. I already have some ideas for the US Army aviation units.
 

MikeSinn

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Don Maddox said:
This sounds like a good idea to me. Perhaps everyone here can start keeping track of the TO&E issues they come across. I already have some ideas for the US Army aviation units.
Great idea!

Let me bring up a couple of issues I mentioned in a different thread...

The Iraqi infantry company is currently composed entirely of ADA units. While I'm not exactly a military expert, I would hazard to guess that even the Iraqi army was equipped with more than the SA-16.

The Iraqi Tank Battalion is made up of T-72M company command vehicles and T-90 tank platoons. :crosseye:

Thanks,
Mike
 

tws71669

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What source(s) would be considered "gospel"... that way I know what to compare game information against. I ngeneral I know the orbat website is pretty authoritative and FAS.org seems a bit dated but might be accurate. I guess I'm looking for a direction to go in...

Thanks!
-Tiberius
 
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Don Maddox said:
This sounds like a good idea to me. Perhaps everyone here can start keeping track of the TO&E issues they come across. I already have some ideas for the US Army aviation units.
I volunteer for Engineer! Example CEV's are no longer in the system! The CIS 122mm Arty unti has HAVOC's as the companies! As far as what is official that is a hard call. Maybe something from the various school houses for the branch's?

John
 

Dr Zaius

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This is a difficult issue as the current setup does not have any kind of system for displaying TO&Es of different eras. It might list US army Infantry Squad, for example, but is this as of 2004 or 1984? What we really need is a way to divide the TO&Es by year.

I'll run this by Scott and see if we can't get this added when he patches the dataview and updates the scenario editor.
 

Gary

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I have just completed TO&E for the following British Formations and sent it off to Scott.

Armoured Regiment
Armoured Infantry Bn
Mech Infantry Bn
Para Bn
Artillery Regt - AS90
Artillery Regt - L118
Artillery Regt - MLRS
Artillery Regt - ADA
Army Air Corp Attack Helicopter Sqaudron.

Gary Bezant
 

tws71669

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Gary said:
I have just completed TO&E for the following British Formations and sent it off to Scott.

Armoured Regiment
Armoured Infantry Bn
Mech Infantry Bn
Para Bn
Artillery Regt - AS90
Artillery Regt - L118
Artillery Regt - MLRS
Artillery Regt - ADA
Army Air Corp Attack Helicopter Sqaudron.

Gary Bezant
Gary, can you share what resource(s) you used for accuracy... I asked about what should be used for references awhile back but it may have been lost in all the threads. It would be nice to know so that myself and anyone else who's wondering could follow the lead.
Thanks!
-T
 

Gary

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Orbat British Army

T

The orbat has been constructed using my personal knowledge as well as the following source material:

The Encyclopaedia of the Modern British Army (2nd Edition) by Terry Gander. This is quite dated now but still has some valid information.

The British Army Pocket Book 2002 -2003 by Charles Heyman. This is a very detailed book.

I am quite happy to post the file on this site if Scott at HPS has no objections. I am currently trying to find pictures to go with the weapons file.

Gary
 

XRAY

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Gary

The British Army Pocket Book 2003 -2004 by Charles Heyman has now been published. Slightly larger format but little change in the contents.
 

Gregory Smith

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Gary,
Your British TO&Es have made it into the official patch. Thank you for your efforts. Additionally, I've pretty much added all the extra Brit stuff you wanted.

Now, if there are other things you'll need/want to add, it should probably wait till you've seen the new database.

Take care,
-Greg
HPS Sims
 

Gary

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Thanks Greg, the efforts of the POA2 development team are very much appreciated. I can't thank of many other game manufactures that would provided the level of service you guys have to us, the end users.

Gary Bezant
 

tws71669

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Gregory Smith said:
Gary,
Your British TO&Es have made it into the official patch. Thank you for your efforts. Additionally, I've pretty much added all the extra Brit stuff you wanted.

Now, if there are other things you'll need/want to add, it should probably wait till you've seen the new database.

Take care,
-Greg
HPS Sims
SAS ? did they make it? need'em to go scud huntin!:D
 

Gary

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Hi T

The SAS did not make it into the orbat this time round. However as soon as the new data dase is released I will revise the orbats and add in SAS teams.

I have an orbat set ready to post here but every time I try I get a mesage telling me I am not authorised to post files. I sent a private message to Don a few days back so I am waiting on his reply.

Gary Bezant
 

tws71669

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Gary, thanks for doing all this... it's really good to see all the involvement going on.
-T
 

tws71669

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Gary said:
Hi T

The SAS did not make it into the orbat this time round. However as soon as the new data dase is released I will revise the orbats and add in SAS teams.

I have an orbat set ready to post here but every time I try I get a mesage telling me I am not authorised to post files. I sent a private message to Don a few days back so I am waiting on his reply.

Gary Bezant
Ahhhh! But I do see them listed in the unit lists! wootwoot!
 
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