The Worst Place of Any OBO question

rdw5150

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Hello

Getting ready to start OS17.

I find SSR1 confusing. OBA cannot be accurate during the Mist turns. OK got it.

"However, OBO have LOS to the entire map (EX: LOS Hindrances Blockage (B.10) is NA for OBA)."

OK so:

-If an OBO has LOS to the entire map, why even note what hex and level the OBO is at?

-If OBO have LOS to the entire map why the hindrance exception?

-Do all OBO (purchased?) have LOS to the entire map the entire scenario?

-Does the "LOS to entire map" continue after mist?

-Does LOS to the entire map mean no blind hexes?

Taking this literally, it means an OBO has LOS to the entire map, blind hexes and hindrances do not matter.

I just want to make certain we play is correctly.

thanks!

Roger
 

klasmalmstrom

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The text you quoted certainly seems to say so....I don't have the scenario though. Perhaps that text was added at a later state and the Level part was left in even though it is not needed?
 

volgaG68

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I'm starting to ruminate on a defensive strategy myself for this one, and this is what I came away with from that SSR, YMMV.

OBA can not be accurate during Mist.
OBO have LOS to the entire map (length), unless normally blocked by terrain height. A building might create a blind hex, but if there is +8 Hindrance out to that point, the Hindrance accumulation will not in and of itself block that LOS.

My take was that it probably should have stated in a truncated form "All OBO LOS is unaffected by Hindrance additions between the OBO and the target hex, although they still negate accuracy". I'm probably wrong, as usual, but that was my take on reading it. Hopefully one of the crew will stop by and clean up the confusion...
 

rdw5150

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I'm starting to ruminate on a defensive strategy myself for this one, and this is what I came away with from that SSR, YMMV.

OBA can not be accurate during Mist.
OBO have LOS to the entire map (length), unless normally blocked by terrain height. A building might create a blind hex, but if there is +8 Hindrance out to that point, the Hindrance accumulation will not in and of itself block that LOS.

My take was that it probably should have stated in a truncated form "All OBO LOS is unaffected by Hindrance additions between the OBO and the target hex, although they still negate accuracy". I'm probably wrong, as usual, but that was my take on reading it. Hopefully one of the crew will stop by and clean up the confusion...

This was originally my take as well, but, that is not what it says. To me it is pretty clear what it says, but I am not certain that is what they meant.:cool: Blind hexes will certainly build up over time and the OBOs are not really that high considering the level of the hill that the scenario starts at.
 

volgaG68

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This was originally my take as well, but, that is not what it says. To me it is pretty clear what it says, but I am not certain that is what they meant.:cool: Blind hexes will certainly build up over time and the OBOs are not really that high considering the level of the hill that the scenario starts at.
1) you do know there is errata for the height of the OBOs, right?
2) I took the SSR to mean he can see the
entire 'map' but not 'every unit'. YMOV...
 

rdw5150

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I did not, what is the errata?

Thanks!
 

rdw5150

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never mind, found it.

Still it is not what the SSR says. ASL is a game of exact wording SMILE and following the EXACT wording, the OBOs have LOS to the entire map....... :cool::nod:
 

JR Brackin

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never mind, found it.

Still it is not what the SSR says. ASL is a game of exact wording SMILE and following the EXACT wording, the OBOs have LOS to the entire map....... :cool::nod:
Having done 2 playlists of the scenario that is correct that you can see the entire map. The only way it would be blocked is as you say by a building or say too much Smoke - B.10 refers to a combination of hindrances like Orchards, Smoke, etc. Mist is covered by the first part will it cannot be accurate.

When we first tried the scenario it was not that way - the mist could block so the 2 forces did not have visibility over the whole board - this was never the intent so we re-wrote the rule on it. Blame for any confusion can lie with me when we submitted the suggestion.

I hope that you enjoy the scenario. if you are the defender consider spending the extra for some of the German units to be set up OB - otherwise there will possibly those American Fighters zooming overhead. Also, for the defender it is important to be able to conduct a good fighting withdraw. If that is the case this is a downright fun scenario for both sides.
 

rreinesch

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I'm starting to ruminate on a defensive strategy myself for this one, and this is what I came away with from that SSR, YMMV.

OBA can not be accurate during Mist.
OBO have LOS to the entire map (length), unless normally blocked by terrain height. A building might create a blind hex, but if there is +8 Hindrance out to that point, the Hindrance accumulation will not in and of itself block that LOS.
Chris has stated it pretty well. The intent of the SBR wasn't to preclude the occurrence of blind spots caused by terrain. It was stated to try and address the issue that arises with the Mist, which given the length of the map, would eventually cause the OBO to not to be able to see anything past about halfway down the map.
 

klasmalmstrom

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Chris has stated it pretty well. The intent of the SBR wasn't to preclude the occurrence of blind spots caused by terrain. It was stated to try and address the issue that arises with the Mist, which given the length of the map, would eventually cause the OBO to not to be able to see anything past about halfway down the map.
So the intention is that LOS blockage due to B.10 ("LOS Hindrance DRM ≥ +6") does not apply to the Offboard Observer - all other LOS rules apply?
 

rdw5150

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Chris has stated it pretty well. The intent of the SBR wasn't to preclude the occurrence of blind spots caused by terrain. It was stated to try and address the issue that arises with the Mist, which given the length of the map, would eventually cause the OBO to not to be able to see anything past about halfway down the map.
OK thanks!

As with Volga, that is what we *thought* but wanted to make certain. Still OBOs are gonna have pretty crappy LOSs once half way down the map with the blind hexes...... We shall see SMILE!

Still, seems like it could have been clearer....... I assume too much SMOKE will also block?

Peace

Roger
 

jrv

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I spoke with one of the playtesters, and my understanding is that the intention was something like that mist hindrance DRMs do not count for B.10 purposes. But that is not official.

JR
 

rreinesch

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I spoke with one of the playtesters, and my understanding is that the intention was something like that mist hindrance DRMs do not count for B.10 purposes. But that is not official.

JR
Correct, but instead of simply ignoring B.10 completely, the compromise was to make any fire always inaccurate.
 

rreinesch

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OK thanks!

As with Volga, that is what we *thought* but wanted to make certain. Still OBOs are gonna have pretty crappy LOSs once half way down the map with the blind hexes...... We shall see SMILE!

Still, seems like it could have been clearer....... I assume too much SMOKE will also block?

Peace

Roger
The same application of B.10 would apply to SMOKE as well. That is one of the side effects of basically ignoring B.10 without introducing a whole slew of exceptions. You're correct that terrain is already going to make is hard enough to target units halfway down the map with the number of blind hexes introduced, on top of not being accurate.
 
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