Terrain transformation and SSRs

[Thunderchief]

I'm working on some scenarios for Op Market Garden and Overloon/Venray and nearby areas and am creating some terrain SSRs.

What do you think about these for ease of play and clarity? I want them to be as geoboard and VASL friendly as possible.

1. All Woods are Heavy Brush. Heavy Brush has a +1 tem in addition to normal brush properties. (So a unit firing at another unit in HB with 2 HB between them will have a +3 modifier. Is there a "light woods" SSR somewhere?).

2. All terrain is at level 0. Printed hills have a positive bog modifier determined by the level of the printed hill hex. (So even though all terrain is at level 0, moving into a hex printed as being at level 2 will incurr a +2 bog modifier. Weather for this will be mud).

By the way, I claim sole right to these battles, and demand that everyone immediately stop what they are working on if their work may encroach on my designs in any way.

 

[synicbast]

As long as they are visually intuitive and consistent across all boards then they should work. Anything that asks me to disregard large amounts of the printed mapboard and differes from board to board puts that scenarioon the only by VASL queue and if the mapboard cannot be easily duplicated iin VASL, it's in the Bargepole category.

 

[Thunderchief]

I am hoping the brown of the hils will trigger the bog SSR "memory".

 

[synicbast]

I am hoping the brown of the hils will trigger the bog SSR "memory".

That's visually intuitive as it is a straight substitution, the thing that would kill it would be if it only involved a partial number of hills on a board or boards.

 

[Thunderchief]

The ground was quite flat so it would be for all areas in play.

 

[dlazov]

I like your Heavy Brush, that is a very good addition to SSRs.

I believe there is a light woods SSR from BFP, I'd have to dig it up.

I think your bog rule seem reasonable.

 

[witchbottles]

I like your Heavy Brush, that is a very good addition to SSRs.

I believe there is a light woods SSR from BFP, I'd have to dig it up.

I think your bog rule seem reasonable.

a note to consider

Heavy Brush works well as an additive as noted previously. That said, if the Light Woods SSR by BFP accomplishes the same end result, you may ind it fits the KISS principle better to simply state so and annotate the rules section . By now, most players either have or are striving to acquire such good TPP stuff as BFP and LFT ( and now LCP); so using their respective rules as you would the ASLRB is just like using their geo maps, really. ( insofar as scen design works). ie

" All brush is Light Woods (BFP 4.1)"

for your SSR. or so on... fits the KISS principle better.

overall, the visualization of terrrain alterations can kill a scen quickly in some players eyes. Never be so hooked on your SSR that you can't dump it. The most played scen is the one with a single SSR:

"EC are moderate with no wind at start."



If you can achieve the effect desired by simply invoking the soft ground rule from KGP; so much the better; as its an official ASLRB chapter. Then just state it verbatim from the divider card and cite the the Cptr P reference.

some alternate ideas.

Other notes: overlays to achieve the terrain desired = smaller amounts of play. This geometrically progressive with the increasing # of overlays being used.

KRL ,Jon H

 

[witchbottles]

The ground was quite flat so it would be for all areas in play.

Different board, maybe ?

you got 65 or so from AH/ MMP, all the BFP and LFT boards and HASL maps to start with.

( amazing how you can use a portion of a HASL map to represent a geo area if needed).

even if players don't have the BFP / LFT boards or the HASLs, everyone has or can get VASL and the map files for it, and can use a color printer to print the map as needed for play ( a great non - actual VASL playing use for VASL).

Of course , using non common HASL maps or remotely available geo boards will mean the scen must be that much better to get the players to actually do that in order to play it.

I have a design ready to go using a BFP board that will not be out till they release Poland in Flames; but the playtest map they provided was perfect; so the design is on the back burner till PiF is published!!

Still in all, of you van use say a portion of the Singling map, or the Riley's road map to get the efffect you are seeking ,use it instead of geo boards needing lots of overlays or terrain alterations.



some thoughts for food,

KRL Jon H

 

[Thunderchief]

Different board, maybe ?

you got 65 or so from AH/ MMP, all the BFP and LFT boards and HASL maps to start with.

( amazing how you can use a portion of a HASL map to represent a geo area if needed).

even if players don't have the BFP / LFT boards or the HASLs, everyone has or can get VASL and the map files for it, and can use a color printer to print the map as needed for play ( a great non - actual VASL playing use for VASL).

Of course , using non common HASL maps or remotely available geo boards will mean the scen must be that much better to get the players to actually do that in order to play it.

I have a design ready to go using a BFP board that will not be out till they release Poland in Flames; but the playtest map they provided was perfect; so the design is on the back burner till PiF is published!!

Still in all, of you van use say a portion of the Singling map, or the Riley's road map to get the efffect you are seeking ,use it instead of geo boards needing lots of overlays or terrain alterations.



some thoughts for food,

KRL Jon H

These will (eventually) be a submission to MMP, so it will be official boards only. The particular scenarios I was thinking of for these SSRs are those where vehicles stuck to the roads due to the risk of bog going offroad and ASL boards (in general) don't have long stretches of straight road.

I try to not use too many overlays, and am well aware of the nuisance value that some people attribute to them (though I don't mind them myself).

I can't seem to find the BFP Light Woods SSR - was it in a scenario or CG?

 

[dlazov]

My bad I was thinking (confusing) COS HBR 1. Sparse Orchard (always treated as out of season Orchards (B14.2).

 

[witchbottles]

These will (eventually) be a submission to MMP, so it will be official boards only. The particular scenarios I was thinking of for these SSRs are those where vehicles stuck to the roads due to the risk of bog going offroad and ASL boards (in general) don't have long stretches of straight road.

I try to not use too many overlays, and am well aware of the nuisance value that some people attribute to them (though I don't mind them myself).

I can't seem to find the BFP Light Woods SSR - was it in a scenario or CG?

so why not the Riley's Road map, a nice straight line , so does the Singling map have ( not as long), both official MMP products

KRL ,Jon H

 

[Thunderchief]

so why not the Riley's Road map, a nice straight line , so does the Singling map have ( not as long), both official MMP products

KRL ,Jon H

Good point

PM sent

Adam

 

[Vinnie]

Are there not going to be light woods sections coming in HP? I think Bloody Bois Jacques has a similar ruling (fire breaks cut in trees)

As an aside I had to read one post twice as what was written was "I like your heavy brush" but I read "I like your hairy bush"....

 

[Thunderchief]

Are there not going to be light woods sections coming in HP? I think Bloody Bois Jacques has a similar ruling (fire breaks cut in trees)

As an aside I had to read one post twice as what was written was "I like your heavy brush" but I read "I like your hairy bush"....

I don't know too much about HP so can't say either way on that.

As for the rest........I'll leave that to Psycho.

 

[Spencer Armstrong]

Are there not going to be light woods sections coming in HP? I think Bloody Bois Jacques has a similar ruling (fire breaks cut in trees)

As an aside I had to read one post twice as what was written was "I like your heavy brush" but I read "I like your hairy bush"....

Yes, Light Woods will be in HP (and Korea). It's very similar to the Heavy Brush suggested here (but hindrance is +2 IIRC). So this feels like that to me: simple, elegant, workable.

S

 

[witchbottles]

Yes, Light Woods will be in HP (and Korea). It's very similar to the Heavy Brush suggested here (but hindrance is +2 IIRC). So this feels like that to me: simple, elegant, workable.

S

{ waiting expectantly for Psycho's cues up on the fact that the "heavy brush" is so "simple, elegant, and workable"}


;+)

KRL ,Jon H

 

[DrDeath]

"heavy brush" is so '70's

:skull:

 

[jwb3]

2. All terrain is at level 0. Printed hills have a positive bog modifier determined by the level of the printed hill hex. (So even though all terrain is at level 0, moving into a hex printed as being at level 2 will incurr a +2 bog modifier. Weather for this will be mud).

I respectfully submit that you need to bone up on your Mud-Bog rules for this project.

The crucial question is whether the ex-hills become Bog hexes. If they are not Bog hexes, then their modifier is irrelevant; the D8.23 roll for Mud-Bog doesn't care what kind of hexes are involved, since it is made without knowing where the vehicle is going to go.

And if they are Bog hexes, then they require a separate roll for each hex, whether Mud is in effect or not (as described in D8.23). In that case the combination of EC of Mud, plus extensive Bog terrain, makes for a very nasty (but possibly appropriate) form of double jeopardy.


John

 

[JRKrejsa]

As long as the hills aren't multi-level..... Maybe. The brush part, either way, is do-able.

 

[Thunderchief]

ok how about......

All terrain is at level 0. For the purposes of movement and Bog, the level 1 hill depiction is treated as sand (D7.3). Other terrain in those hexes exists normally.