Sugarloaf Hill Playtesting Underway!!!

[witchbottles]

I have used the sleaze go for an ESB for the maximum of extra MP in order to provoke Immobilization before. If a Crews are by SSR not allowed to voluntarily Abandon their vehicles, this still does not allow them to do so (red). At this point, the manning Crew could use the MG assets firing from the vehicle.
In order to remove the MG armament, the vehicle would first have to be attacked without being destroyed, stunned, shocked, the crew would have to pass its Immobilization TC, remaining in the vehicle. Only afterwards it could voluntarily Abandon it, which opens the path to attempting the removal of its MG armament (green).

So in practice, while this sleaze has a good chance to keep an Immobilized vehicle in place, it seems unlikely to me that its Crew will indeed manage to get out removing MG armament. Probably, the Immobilized vehicle would rather be destroyed before that happens as the LVTs are rather thin-skinned.

In case of an Immobilization of a vehicle under Recall, I believe the Crew would have to Abandon it without the option of MG-Removal and be 'Recalled' on foot, being required to reach the friendly board edge unless doing so would be impossible (say due to a water obstacle). In case of a Beach Landing, I suppose the sea would be the friendly board edge.

In case of an Immobilization before a Recall and not due to ESB, then the 'normal' procedures would apply.

D5.5 IMMOBILIZATION TC: An immediate TC is required of the non-Shocked, non-Stunned Inherent crew of a vehicle [EXC: one in a Water Obstacle; 16.3] that becomes immobilized by any non-CC attack, or that is already bogged/immobilized and is hit by Direct Fire ordnance which fails to destroy, Stun, or Shock it but that would have destroyed or Shocked it with an Original TK or IFT DR of 5. Failure of the TC results in the crew being immediately placed beneath the vehicle (expending all remaining MF) and subject to the Hazardous Movement DRM during that phase (see also 9.3). Place an Abandoned counter on the vehicle (5.41). A crew thus forced to leave its vehicle may not Remove (6.631) any weapons from it. If the TC is passed, the crew may continue to Inherently man it or may abandon it voluntarily (5.41) during its MPh.

I do not know if BRT special rules exist, which would alter this.

That said, if you want to prevent ahistorical ESB sleazing in order to keep some more LVTs on board as firebases, cover or for later Scrounging, you'd need to catch that by an SSR.


von Marwitz

The desire to ESB sleaze for an immobilized LVT here is three fold.

1. the AAMGs can be manned and fired by the inherent crew, and provide a fair amount of FP useful in the game.

2. The LVT (or its wreck), are TEM in a landscape with little to assist the Marines in TEM cover while moving.

3. The LVT, even immobilized, represents a rout destination as long as other conditions for routing are met. The TEM from the LVT or its wreck would allow DM to be removed normally.
6 FP in the VCA + 4 FP in each side to rear CA, offers a good firebase. In this scenario, the Japanese are short on armor penetrating weapons.

So the SSR may need modifications, is our belief.

 

[von Marwitz]

3. The LVT, even immobilized, represents a rout destination as long as other conditions for routing are met.

So the SSR may need modifications, is our belief.

I had not been aware of the cited part of 3, but even if this had not been the case, I agree to your assessment that an SSR is in order.

von Marwitz

 

[Actionjick]

The desire to ESB sleaze for an immobilized LVT here is three fold.

1. the AAMGs can be manned and fired by the inherent crew, and provide a fair amount of FP useful in the game.

2. The LVT (or its wreck), are TEM in a landscape with little to assist the Marines in TEM cover while moving.

3. The LVT, even immobilized, represents a rout destination as long as other conditions for routing are met. The TEM from the LVT or its wreck would allow DM to be removed normally.
6 FP in the VCA + 4 FP in each side to rear CA, offers a good firebase. In this scenario, the Japanese are short on armor penetrating weapons.

So the SSR may need modifications, is our belief.

Good points.

 

[sunoftzu]

An SSR making ESB NA would do the trick.....

 

[sunoftzu]

Last Sunday, Euan and I took our playing of BD-002 to the end of turn 5. Both sides had opportunities to hit the other hard and impose themselves on the game, but the majority of attacks in the session were pretty benign. The Americans are gathering forces on both sides of the Japanese. It'll be an exciting finish.....

 

[sunoftzu]

I just did a PT Double-Header this morning......



Firstly, Euan and I finished off BD-002 "Limited Gains", with Euan's Marines grabbing control (of the required) 6 level 3 or higher locations, and destroying a key cave on Hill 1 during their turn 6. In Japanese turn 6, my Japanese were not able to make any impression on this whatsoever (apart from leaving a lot of bloodstains on the hills), which clinched the game for the Marines in the Japanese turn 6 MPh. This scenario is a great deal of fun to play for both sides.




....... followed by a session with Jon with our game of BD-004 "Thicker Than Flies". In this game, both sides are playing it cautious, with similar losses so far. The Marines have reduced the Japanese control to 9 level 3+ hexes (the Japanese need 6 to win). So far, this game looks like a close range scrap on a hill, or as we say in NZ, a good old fashioned ding-dong.....




Come on MMP, publish this game. It's awesome, and has a CG, too.

 

[Old Noob]

Ya gotta be patient. After all, have to enjoy Manila first.

 

[TopT]

I am not sure that Bitterest Day (Sugar Loaf play test) has even been submitted to MMP yet.

 

[jyoung]

Inspired by this thread, I contacted Chad (cVan) recently, he was kind enough to provide the CG rules, and unfortunately described the project as "dead in the water" for publication anywhere . I'm not sure why, it looks great and pretty complete from what I can see from this thread and looking through the rules. I haven't played the CG yet (still finishing Edson's Ridge).

 

[hongkongwargamer]

Inspired by this thread, I contacted Chad (cVan) recently, he was kind enough to provide the CG rules, and unfortunately described the project as "dead in the water" for publication anywhere . I'm not sure why, it looks great and pretty complete from what I can see from this thread and looking through the rules. I haven't played the CG yet (still finishing Edson's Ridge).

That's what I heard. I playtested all the scenarios here front to back with Dan Dolan.

 

[cVan]

Jyoung's email I received last week requesting the Bitterest Day materials spurred me to come check out the forums.

It's a pleasure to see people interested and hopefully having fun playing ASL
with the Sugar Loaf materials. Everyone's interest and enthusiasm is truly appreciated.
I know I am biased, but I do think that working thru the Bitterest Day scenario progression serves as an excellent
ASL introduction to Caves by starting out with relatively few in the 1st scenario and building up to
to the big scenario BD06.

To give some clarity for everyone on my dead in the water comment to Jyoung...

Blame for lack of follow up with MMP and seeing if this might move forward with them for lays solely on me.

Materials were first shared with MMP around Octoberfest in 2015, but later that same week real life intervened
for me and that was pretty much the last time I was into ASL regularly due to life taking priority.
Outside of a few weeks in late 2018 where I made some revisions to map, rules, and scenarios; ASL was on the
back burner.

I do miss the game, and over the past week have started dusting some stuff off and making purchases of
interesting ASL items I have missed over the past few years.

I am reviewing the LVT ESB immobilization discussion that took place recently and will be going thru the thread
to see if any other issues were raised. If anyone has played the big scenario BD06 I would also be interested in hearing how
that played out or seeing some vasl log files of it, same for the CG. As always, please email or post if
there are any questions or comments on the materials.

For those that have been battling it out on Sugar Loaf via vasl or with cardboard, thank you and keep having fun with it.

 

[jtsjc1]

It would be great to see this published. Having Manila, Sugarloaf Hill and BFP Peleliu all published would be PTO heaven.

 

[sunoftzu]

I could see this being combined with Kakazu Ridge, although that would require the standardizing of some of the rules (you can't have 2 sets of rules for Debris, Spigot Mortars, etc). Add in half a counter sheet to cover the Spigot Mortar Caves, Assault Engineers, and a few extras for the CG.

 

[sunoftzu]

Yesterday, Euan and I took our scenario of BD-003 "Western Anchor" to IJA turn 4. Progress almost seems like a contradiction, but in spite of too many things not going the way of the USMC, they do control 3+ hexes of Hill 1, and if they can continue to crawl towards Sugar Loaf Hill, they will likely be able to manage their modest objectives...

 

[sunoftzu]

Yesterday morning, Euan and I took our playing of BD-003 "Western Anchor" to the PFPh of American turn 6. At the start of the session, it was looking like the Marines had only a slim chance of infiltrating Sugar Loaf Hill, but thanks to a run of WPs being landed by the 81*Mtr, and some woeful Japanese shooting (all but 1 MG malfunctioning), the Marines are now looking a real chance to infiltrate Sugar Loaf Hill.....








... followed this morning by a bloody session of BD-004 "Thicker Than Flies" with Jon. Now it was my turn for some woeful shooting, as the Japanese pretty much threw the kitchen sink at us. I'm just hoping that enough can survive to go after the objectives after the Melees die down......




Great fun being had playing these.......

John.

 

[sunoftzu]

Euan and I just finished our 3rd "Bitterest Day" (playtest) scenario BD-003 "Western Anchor". The game was in the balance, with my Marines wobbling at times, but doing just enough to make the VC prospects plausible. But in turn 5, the 81 Mtr dropped 4 WP counters on Japanese positions, which allowed the Marines massive flexibility. The same mortar added 2 more WP hits in turn 6 (killing off the Japanese wounded 9-1 leader in the process) to bring its game total to 7 !!! The Japanese counterattacked in their last turn, but weren't able to make enough of an impression on the Marines to turn the tide, and Euan called it there. It looks to be a good scenario, but too much WP can make it to difficult on the Japanese. Perhaps a SSR that limits the amount of SMOKE that the Americans can fire would not be out of place here.

 

[sunoftzu]

Euan ad I got BD-004 "Thicker Than Flies" started this morning, and got 1.5 turns completed.

The Americans and Japanese are both playing cat and mouse with each other, and in turn 2, the LVT immobilized on the SE face of Sugar Loaf Hill. The Japanese have to wait until turns 3 and 4 for their reinforcements. The Americans pretty much get all of theirs on turn 1, but have a lot more OG to cross.....

 

[sunoftzu]

Last Sunday morning, Euan and I got another 1.5 turns completed of BD-004 "Thicker Than Flies". Both sides are pretty much playing it cautious, as they build up their strength for their final assaults. In most ways, it was quite a good session for my Japanese. After having a 448 squad halved, the remaining HS was attacked in CC by a pair of USMC half-squads, but it was able to survive whilst dispatching both of them. Another 448 squad went Fanatic on a HOB DR. It's not so much the Fanatic status that pleases you - it's more the case that it DIDN'T go Berserk !!!!

However, the man group of marines are starting to get close, thanks to some well placed WP shots......

John.

 

[sunoftzu]

Euan and I got another 1.5 turns of BD-005 "Thicker Than Flies" completed this morning. There was a lot of intense action, and by the end of it, the Japanese had nearly been wiped out on the the west side of Sugar Loaf Hill. However, thanks to a THH burning the abandoned, immobilized LVT4 'hulk' (-3 ATMM, -1 immob, -1 no MGs, -2 OT for CCV5 @ -7), which gave my reinforcement some handy smoke cover to get onboard in the face of MGs and minus leaders without a scratch.




So, on the east side, the Americans are just holding on. The west side looks well and truly gone for the Japanese. Their best hope looks to be overrunning the east side before the western forces can relieve them......

Euan and I both agree that this is an absolute ripsnorter of a scenario !!!!!!!

 

[sunoftzu]

Euan and I finished our playing of BD-004 "Thicker Than Flies" this morning. In the last session, I though that I'd done a decent job of assembling the Japanese into a good position to counterattack Sugar Loaf Hill, only to watch them crumble on the west flank. However, I struck some white hot dice in my 5th, as I broke 3 MG teams, KIAed a 4th squad with a DC Suicide Hero in the MPh, and placed a DC on the only remaining GO unit on the east side of Sugar Loaf Hill for no losses to essentially retake virtually the entire eastern side.




A major reversal of fortune to be sure, but Euan and I still enjoyed the heck out of this one. They've all been great little scenarios, but this one has been the best so far. I really, really want to see this get published !!!!!

John.