Sticky for reprint/upcoming status????

[Elrohir69]

Hello guys,

I'm wondering if it could be possible to have a sticky post with a schedule for the last update about dates/status of the next (near/far future) issues/reprints so we don't need to ask from time to time for each of thems, and something similar for the new projects. I'm not talking about the existing sticky but something like a sticky with a table that changes according the last news/information from MMP.

In my case, I'm waiting for some preorder and news for the next reprints.

Doomed Battalions/Journal 2/Map bundle: Somebody could tell me something about when it's going to be shiped?

What about a new module with PTO/DTO?

What about new modules for all the out of print modules (British/French/Italians ...)?

I'm in the case of those who started playing ASL not longer than 3 years ago, and we must chose between buying all that staff in the second hand market (paying a lot of many for some staff that is not allways in the best condition) or waiting for it's reprint. It would be great to know, at least, if it's going to be reprinted, or not, modules like Croix de Guerre or For King and Country (for example) and in that case if it's going to be done in one year, two, or ten. Just to know if we must buy it in the second market or we can wait.

Probably it has been asked before something similar, but as we say "The baby who doesn't crie will not suck" (Free translation from Spanish to English)

 

[Jasonofindy]

I'm even more of a newbie than you are, but I honestly don't see such a sticky thread as likely as over the past few years MMP has repeatedly said on CSW that they will no longer attempt to announce firm release date predictions. While dates would be nice, a reading of much older posts on their CSW folder pretty much highlights how attempting to give dates in the past has led to much unrest and hand wringing in the past from both the ASL and the Gamer's folks. I frankly don't envy MMP's position.

What I can pass on is the latest information I have seen/heard about the products in case you haven't seen such information. Again, I am a newbie with absolutely no particular inside information so take everything with a grain of salt. In no particular order here is what I have read:

Beyond Valor 3- Countersheets have arrived back from the printers and they are currently waiting on boxes to be printed.

Journal 2 reprint- According to post 70815 by Brian Youse in the CSW MMP folder the counters were being reprinted with the Beyond Valor counters. I haven't heard anything else about the Journal.

Doomed Battalions- According to post 70815 by Brian Youse the counters for this are being sent to the printers sometime before the WBC convention.

For King & Country- According to the same post the counters for this are being sent to the printers along with Doomed Battalions. However, the same post indicates that FK&C could be a 2010 reprint. My own guess is that while the counters are being lumped with Doomed Battalions to fill out a large print run, that the rest of the components and the actual module might be for next year because of other projects. (Like actually getting Doomed Battalions, the BV3 reprint, the Starter Kit #1 reprint and other MMP products out the door)

Map Pack- Last I heard, (which was a long time ago now) was that this was indefinitely on hold because of the huge storage expense.

PTO module- Both in multiple CSW posts by MMP guys and in the interview of Keith Dalton on "The Two Half Squads" podcasts the counters, etc. were in the process of being recreated and laid out. I've read no estimates of when that process would be completed. Because of the way the Doomed Battalions preorder worked out (or didn't) my understanding is that our first indication that it is ready to be printed will be when it pops up for preorder. They've now stated multiple times that won't happen until the product is ready to be sent to the printers.

Desert module- my understanding is that it is pretty much in the same spot as the PTO module but not as far along in being recreated. Although there seems to less to lay out/redo here so who knows?

Croix de Guerre- I'm not sure why this is in your list as it is still in stock from MMP. Even if it were to sell out, I'm pretty sure it is another old AH module they inherited that would need to be rebuilt. Since the combined PTO rebuild, the Desert/Italian rebuild, and the Yanks rebuild would all be ahead of it, I wouldn't hold your breath on a new version of this anytime soon. (Although stranger things have happened as Last Hurrah is still in stock from MMP and it is being reprinted as part of Doomed Battalions)

Hakkaa Paalle- The Finnish module is in playtesting. The Two Half Squads podcast episode with the interview of Lars Thuring seems to indicate that there is a goal to finish playtesting in time for an end of the year release. However, I have read nothing from the MMP guys on CSW about it. They have mentioned a "surprise" later this year which one might guess is the Hakkaa Paale release or possibly the rumored Deluxe Action Pack, but who really knows?

 

[Joao Lima]

That is, if you're a new player, you're nowhere near to have the complete set, or be able to play desert scenarios, or scenarios including Brits, or PTO scenarios, unless you're willing to pay an extortionate amount of money... And you have to be quick , otherwise you will not even be able to have Beyond Valor before it is out of print again.

Does anyone know anything about a SASL re-print?

 

[dlazov]

SASL according to MMP will not be reprinted, this may be subject to change after 2020 but it is highly unlikely.

it's only available via ebay.

 

[Joao Lima]

SASL according to MMP will not be reprinted, this may be subject to change after 2020 but it is highly unlikely.

it's only available via ebay.

Is this tied to any copyright issue, or is it MMP's view that SASL is totally irrelevant to ASL, hence putting it not to be re-printed?

 

[dlazov]

From my readings it's not that MMP views it as irrelevant, more like it's not worth their efforts to make any money on it.

They have stated that they will not reprint any HASL or SASL modules.

Which does not surprise me since they have too many irons in the fire anyway. As a part time company they don't solely produce ASL it's not one of their driving production lines (it used to be, and they care about ASL but its not their sole function), they have the Gamers line, the International line and other game systems to produce.

My interpetation is that even though Curt Schilling has put in the capital they have no full time staff for the main company and hence no full time staff for ASL in general.

When AH produced SL/ASL (1977-1996) they were a full time company and did have a full time staff (probably did other projects as well) devoted to ASL.

Mark Nixon posted some excellent insights to the inner workings of AH in another thread.

Anyway I digress. MMP has done a lot for ASL, but they (in my opinion) don't have any full time staff nor resources to devote solely to ASL and I think it shows.

We have what we have and get what we can get but its not like how it was in the 1982-2000 era, in some ways it's better and in others not so much, but this is all my opinion on the state of things.

Middle of the road, Middle aged, half way from here to there, 50 / 50, neither hot nor cold, alive not dead, older but not any younger, fatter then skinny, ...

 

[Joao Lima]

...

Which does not surprise me since they have too many irons in the fire anyway. As a part time company they don't solely produce ASL it's not one of their driving production lines (it used to be, and they care about ASL but its not their sole function), they have the Gamers line, the International line and other game systems to produce.
...

It's just that I (personally) find it bloody bizarre that even though there is one company allegedly in charge of ASL, if I want to buy something from what should be the core of the game my best bet is still the after-market... :crosseye:

It's like if I wanted to buy a car , I would be better not going to an official dealer, but instead going to a used car salesman that will just rip me off on the price.

Ah well, it's not going to change , but it's always useful to know. Thanks.

 

[Chas Argent]

Is this tied to any copyright issue, or is it MMP's view that SASL is totally irrelevant to ASL, hence putting it not to be re-printed?

SASL was not a big seller. It took quite awhile for the 2nd edition print run to move.

 

[Joao Lima]

SASL was not a big seller. It took quite awhile for the 2nd edition print run to move.

Which makes it even more amazing the prices in the second-hand market.

People are really only trying to milk the cow.

 

[JG53_Jaguar]

SASL according to MMP will not be reprinted, this may be subject to change after 2020 but it is highly unlikely.

it's only available via ebay.

That's kind of sad, really for me... SASL is very important...I guess I'm the only one.

 

[Elrohir69]

I'm even more of a newbie than you are, but I honestly don't see such a sticky thread as likely as over the past few years MMP has repeatedly said on CSW that they will no longer attempt to announce firm release date predictions. While dates would be nice, a reading of much older posts on their CSW folder pretty much highlights how attempting to give dates in the past has led to much unrest and hand wringing in the past from both the ASL and the Gamer's folks. I frankly don't envy MMP's position.

What I can pass on is the latest information I have seen/heard about the products in case you haven't seen such information. Again, I am a newbie with absolutely no particular inside information so take everything with a grain of salt. In no particular order here is what I have read:

First of all, thanks for the information.

What I meant with my post was that it could be great to have a sticky with a thread the way you have posted, so someone (I don't know who) could update according to the last news related about each product, so everyone that visited the forum could know something about them. I thought that was suposed to be the sticky for MMP news, but it's not.
Just having a post, with no answers, where last news about each product (and maybe some notes about who gave such information and how/where was it given). It could be updated by someone from MMP, or from the forum, or anybody else. The question is to have a place for having a quick review, that's it.

 

[Portal]

Nice to see that instead of tightening their ship and becoming more organized, MMP took the easy path and just gave up trying to estimate when they would get something done.

Well, at least they admit their previous calendar estimates have been very lacking in credibility.

 

[Joao Lima]

That's kind of sad, really for me... SASL is very important...I guess I'm the only one.

You're not alone.

Unfortunatelly , with us are also the usual greedy crowd that buys this stuff in rows and then sells them once a year trying to squeeze astonomical prices out of it. I would really like MMP to keep the basics elements of ASL always in stock (or with short spans of out-of-stock) just to drive these vultures out of the scene all together.

 

[pward]

First of all, thanks for the information.

What I meant with my post was that it could be great to have a sticky with a thread the way you have posted, so someone (I don't know who) could update according to the last news related about each product, so everyone that visited the forum could know something about them. I thought that was suposed to be the sticky for MMP news, but it's not.

Just having a post, with no answers, where last news about each product (and maybe some notes about who gave such information and how/where was it given). It could be updated by someone from MMP, or from the forum, or anybody else. The question is to have a place for having a quick review, that's it.

That place is CSW. (more or less.) To have an editable-by-MMP sticky here, someone from MMP would have to have moderator rights. I'm almost certain Don (site owner) didn't want the companies to be able to moderate at will their own sub-forums. Unless I'm misremembering the issues from the last time it was suggested.

For a brief time, that thread was unlocked by a moderator, edited by MMP staff, then relocked. That seems tedious to me, when they have another forum they use already.

 

[pward]

Nice to see that instead of tightening their ship and becoming more organized, MMP took the easy path and just gave up trying to estimate when they would get something done.

Well, at least they admit their previous calendar estimates have been very lacking in credibility.

Make up your mind. Do you want them to tighten their ship and fix their organizational issues, or finish the work on the forthcoming products?

 

[Joao Lima]

Make up your mind. Do you want them to tighten their ship and fix their organizational issues, or finish the work on the forthcoming products?

Judging by the above is neither. To put a map pack for pre-order countless years ago, and scrap because of warehouse space is possibly poor management.

Or something more serious , meaning that MMP is not selling their stock as envisaged, which may put in question, if ASL is not their core business, as someone said above, then potentially they should make it their core business, instead of insisting in lines that do not sell as well as predicted.

Either way, I'm a bit baffled to take any managing lesson out of it.

(mind you, I do not give a d*&^ about new content, I just think the basic items of the game should be always in stock, or out-of-stock for short spans).

 

[pward]

Judging by the above is neither. To put a map pack for pre-order countless years ago, and scrap because of warehouse space is possibly poor management.

Or something more serious , meaning that MMP is not selling their stock as envisaged, which may put in question, if ASL is not their core business, as someone said above, then potentially they should make it their core business, instead of insisting in lines that do not sell as well as predicted.

Either way, I'm a bit baffled to take any managing lesson out of it.

(mind you, I do not give a d*&^ about new content, I just think the basic items of the game should be always in stock, or out-of-stock for short spans).

The announced delay wasn't necessarily a warehouse space issue. It was "we don't think it will sell fast enough under current conditions". If they pay for the print run, but then pay for storing the maps for longer than the maps are making them money, then they end up as another fireside sale like SASL, Pegasus Bridge, and other modules that collected dust for so long.

Part of the planning is that you won't store them forever unsold, but will eventually sell them before the cost of storage exceeds the income generated.

Take everything said here (especially by non-MMP posters) as just an opinion. Some are more vocal than others, but everyone has a different viewpoint on the subject. Very few of these opinions are likely to change the opinions of the decision makers at MMP.

Forget comparing one line to another, consider each individual product by itself. The recent sale on Gamers items indicates to me that they overstayed their welcome. But it's been done on ASL items before too... If MMP thinks an ASL product will do likewise, it seems to me that they have learned their lesson by delaying the map pack.

Get used to the "core" items being out of stock at different intervals. That ideal world would be nice and convenient for the players, but an absolute pain-in-the-rear for the logistics at MMP.

 

[SamB]

Nice to see that instead of tightening their ship and becoming more organized, MMP took the easy path and just gave up trying to estimate when they would get something done.

Well, at least they admit their previous calendar estimates have been very lacking in credibility.

This is a perfect example regarding the reason they no longer give estimates. How? Becuase any thread - no matter how innoculous - quickly degenerates into bashing them because they haven't lived up to someone's idea of what they "should" be doing.

They don't give estimates because people squeal like a stuck pig when the map (for example, which didn't have an firm estimate of any kind) are delayed.

Give it a rest.

 

[dlazov]

if ASL is not their core business, as someone said above, then potentially they should make it their core business,

Go ask this question in the CSW MMP folder and see how fast all the anti-ASLers shout you down and tell you to take your toys elsewhere and good riddance to ASL, they (the anti-ASL crowd whom rules the roost at CSW) want only the Gamers, ISG and anything other then ASL taking up bandwidth from MMP.

It appears that MMP is listening to them, they don't associate here at all and don't defend ASLers very much over on CSW.

These are my observations of behaviors over on CSW and the main reason I really no longer wish to visit the site much anymore.

Also the notion that the Map Pack would not sell out is ludicrous, it already has 788 pre-orders at $180.00 bucks a pop or if they collected the money right now that would mean $141,840.00 that they could collect, and have to pay for it and ship it out.

That indicates that:

1. They don't have the warehouse space
2. They are not interested in selling/shipping the ASL Map Pack

So in my mind MMP is not that great of stewards for ASL if they are not willing to continue the ASL line by not honoring their Pre-orders for the Map Pack and DB3 (which incidentally has a 1,124 pre-oders or $60,696.00 if collected or combine that with the map bundle and you have $202,536.00 in cash) and keeping the rest of the core modules in stock and same with the SK's.

I really think that if they put their mind to it they could manufacture enough to print up the core modules & the map pack and then work on AP and HASL, but they from my observations they don't have the staff time nor the resources or motivation to do so (although 200K seems like a motivator to me). They have the potential cash due to the pre-orders so that is not the issue.

When MMP produces something for ASL they do it very excellently well, but at the same time they sit on their hands with other things that could move forward, similar to watching oil paint dry.

This is just my opinions and observations.

 

[Jay White]

Non-ASL games don't exactly zip off MMPs preorder list either. I think people have to accept that MMP is not a game company with the same organizational / production capabilities as, say, GMT.

Appreciate their games when they come out, but don't sit around waiting (and complaining) for them to arrive. Also, appreciate the quality of their games, which is pretty consistently top-notch.

I doubt MMP's methods are going to change any time soon, so it's a waste of energy to get pissed off about it. Go play some ASL! (Or start collecting / playing some of the other amazing wargames out there... ) :devious:

And don't give me none of this "I can't play ASL because it's impossible to get any of the core modules!" I bet my third ball that 95% of the complainers on this forum own more ASL than they will ever play in their lifetime.