Steve Mini-Interview by ACG About CM Afghanistan

[thewood]

OK, I'll make fun of him for just sounding plain boring.

 

[Jeph]

OK, I'll make fun of him for just sounding plain boring.

I'm not arguing with that bit.

 

[Michael Dorosh]

PS Your continuing insulting of Moon for having an eastern european accent is pretty juvenile btw. "He sounds like Borat LOLOLOL". Sure he might be the weak link at BFC, but he has an accent get over it.

I have no problem with his accent and couldn't care less what he sounds like. My entire family comes from eastern Europe. I just found his attempt at a sales pitch unintentionally hysterical and would still point to his "zey are killing me" video as one of the funniest things I've ever seen online. Black Adder got more mileage out of far less with an equally juvenile German accent when they did their take on the Red Baron. The funny part being not his accent but that he actually thought this was going to be a huge sales pitch for his product.

Marines/1.10 rates around 75% there and I'd give the patched Brits/1.20 around 80%.

We weren't asking about your personal opinion though, we were asking BFC Zonso to back up his comments about public reaction to CM:SF British Forces. Online reviews are most decidedly mixed, despite his claim he's "only" seen "rave" reviews.

 

[Jeph]

I have no problem with his accent and couldn't care less what he sounds like. My entire family comes from eastern Europe. I just found his attempt at a sales pitch unintentionally hysterical and would still point to his "zey are killing me" video as one of the funniest things I've ever seen online.

So you are not making fun of his accent, but you found the video hilarious because of his accent?

We weren't asking about your personal opinion though, we were asking BFC Zonso to back up his comments about public reaction to CM:SF British Forces. Online reviews are most decidedly mixed, despite his claim he's "only" seen "rave" reviews.

Cmon, you've spent a large percentage of your life venturing un-asked-for personal opinions on the internet, can't I have one?

 

[Palantir]

I am thinking it is probably not the "ideal demographic" there. :laugh:

Sadly for BFC it's the EXACT demographic they were shooting for: young players who want a lot of "flash," real time click festing and 1:1 action.
But THEY didn't like it any better than those poor out of touch grognards did.

 

[Michael Dorosh]

Cmon, you've spent a large percentage of your life venturing un-asked-for personal opinions on the internet, can't I have one?

Everyone is entitled to one; just don't see what it has to do with BFC Zonso's claim that only rave reviews exist. In his blinkered world, it's true, but in the wider world, it's demonstrably false. All of which goes back to the very main point he was gibbering about - I think - that criticism about the game is confined to a tiny fraction of those familiar with it.

It should probably go without saying that British Forces is one of those "pyramid" products where you need to be a fan of the base product in order to want to buy it in the first place also, so it stands to reason that it will review higher than the original. And even at that, 'rave' reviews are not easy to find - many of the mainstream sites didn't even bother to write about this one.

 

[Geordie]

Yet you are happy to reference that site and gamespot neither of which have actual reviews and only require the user to click a rating. Looks like the sort of crowd that would have clicked a zero on CMBO too.

It's not often I defend Mr D, however.

I think that site and it's members is exactly the kind of new gamer that BF were after with the Rekease of the game and so their reaction to the game should be interesting to the company.

Who actually is playing CMSF? Outside BF I haven't found one site that gives it any cyberspace or credit.

Bear in mind here that I actually enjoy the game but ply play about once a fortnight now.

 

[dalem]

The level of misinformation and misrepresentation recently displayed here is truly staggering;

Still waiting, Z-man. What specific examples of misinformation staggered you? Trot 'em out so we can discuss 'em.

-dale

 

[Geordie]

Still waiting, Z-man. What specific examples of misinformation staggered you? Trot 'em out so we can discuss 'em.

-dale

Well I for one only use the following information regarding the CM games:

1. Anything solid has to come from the BF site, often the Beta Testers but more specifically one of the game makers.

2. All information I use about the game comes directly from my experience of the game, CM-1 games and where certain aspects are discussed, eg infantry formations, my own military service.

Nothing I have said or will say in the future goes against these 2 points. I dont get where guys are coming from when I or anyone else here is accused of making things up. Its all out there on the BF site for anyone to read. The game delays, the about turns by Steve, the continued untruths about the game perpetuated by others. All, on the BF site.

CMSF is a decent game, but its not the Earth, Sun and Moon, never will be in my opinion. Just a decent game made by a small niche outfit played by a very few wargamers.

 

[Zonso]

I have, and have heard, nothing but rave reviews of the Brit module even sans new Red units(!).

...I don't see a single professional review of the game at that site.

...we were asking BFC Zonso to back up his comments about public reaction to CM:SF British Forces.

...what it has to do with BFC Zonso's claim that only rave reviews exist.

Interesting conclusions you are attempting to emphasize and create. I would confer with herrDoktor, but I am beginning to believe these are clear signs of psychological disorder and logical fallicies. To wit:

a- Thinking of things in absolute terms, like "always", "every", "never", and "there is no alternative".
b- Taking isolated cases and using them to make wide generalizations. Explaining behaviors or events, merely by naming them.
c- Focusing almost exclusively on certain, usually negative or upsetting, aspects of an event while ignoring other positive aspects.
d- Continually reemphasizing or "shooting down" positive experiences for arbitrary, ad hoc reasons.
e- Distorting aspects of a memory or situation through magnifying or minimizing them such that they no longer correspond to objective reality.
f- Patterns of thought which imply the way things "should" or "ought to be" rather than the actual situation.


For clarification, a definition of 'Rave Review': a report that praises something in a very enthusiastic way. I guess I really am a glass half full, it's a beautiful day out kind of guy. I have nothing but praise for the team that put together the Brit module, like the following people:

"So to sum it up it proves for me the game engine works well. There is a difference in tactics needed between fighting with the Americans and fighting with the British which I expect is true in reality. I haven't played as the Sryians but I imagine it also feels different fighting either of these two. I am now going to buy the NATO module aswell.....an addition I was going to pass up on untill playing the Brit module over the last few days. This game has now reached classic status for me like he first series. Roll on NATO and Normandy."

"Yeah I agree. The Brits module really adds a lot to the game. This game, to me, truly is a classic that I will surely play for years to come."

"CMSF has really come into it's own. I got it right away, shelved it for a couple updates. Picked it back up after the Marines module and then bought the British module right away. Left it again for almost a year and then sat back down with it a couple months ago and it is almost all I play. It has just become an awesome game. Now if PaperTiger, SnakeEye and the Phantom (among others) would crank out a new scenario every couple days....heaven."

"I think that as the game progresses, scenario designers get more experienced, so the overall game experienced improves."

"I have to say the maps in the British module were top notch, and the fact you had to do some pretty hectic defence missions was a nice change. Two maps that really stood out for me was the second blue defender mission, and the mission where you chose to go south or to Damascus. The level of detail/realism in these maps just added a whole new level to the game."

"Just wanted to add to the British module/CMSF lovefest. I never got a chance to play the 1.0 versions of these games, so my opinions of them are not slighted by buggy or inadequate initial releases. When I bought the modules and patched to 1.21 I played a truly amazing strategy game -arguably the best ever made. I was really worried about wasting my money with the expansion modules, how much of a difference could adding marine units make, I thought.

Well I was dead wrong, the quality of the missions reached an apex in the expansion modules, as CMSF was a very experimental and avantgarde game, the mission makers didn't really know what they were doing (i dont mean that in a negative way, i just mean that they had no point of reference). Its obvious that they mastered their art with the expansion modules - the missions are insanely better, everything ranging from terrain, to variety, consistency, to challenge, to briefing. The expansion modules are worth every penny, they add so much to the game and are not just a "unit pack" as I originally thought.

And I love the maneuver warfare experience of the British module - Crossroads anyone?"

 

[Zonso]

Still waiting, Z-man. What specific examples of misinformation staggered you? Trot 'em out so we can discuss 'em.

-dale

Waiting for what? Someone to hold your hand!? Read and search(current!) the BFC forum. You're old enough to put two and two together. For better or worse, you are on your own. There is nothing to discuss re your statements and pronouncements of personal opinion except to point out the incorrectness.

Hint: Today is not like yesterday.

 

[Zonso]

http://www.gametrailers.com/game/combat-mission-shock-force/11202

Gametrailers.com - this is the second google hit for COMBAT MISSION SHOCK FORCE BRITISH FORCES REVIEW - has an average user score of 5.2 - again, one of these is not mine, never even knew of this site before.

Actually it appears to be the third now. The Armchair General one being more popular for some reason.

Anyways reading through some of the comments at the different review sites, pretty funny at times , I see you persist in making a point of 'expressing' yourself repeatedly. I got to ask you, really, if you don't like apples why would you spend your time and effort slagging them?

 

[Michael Dorosh]

It's amazing the way BFC Zonso can come on here, respond with vague generalities to direct questions put to him, then whine about all the substantive discussion that goes on around him.

Anyone can cherry-pick good comments about British Forces off the internet; that wasn't the point in the least. BFC Zonso suggested that the game is a hit because all he is able to find are "rave reviews." But this is an idiotic proposition for two reasons:

a) British Forces is a pyramid product - you only buy it if you have and (one would presume) enjoy the base game for which it is a module, and
b) even at that, there are plenty of dissenting opinions of British Forces to be found online - that BFC Zonso hasn't read them is simply not proof that they don't exist.

So I'm not understanding what his point is. Given his lack of effort in backing up his own point, I don't think even he does. "Go prove my point yourself" has always been the weakest form of argument...

 

[Michael Dorosh]

Waiting for what? Someone to hold your hand!? Read and search(current!) the BFC forum. You're old enough to put two and two together. For better or worse, you are on your own. There is nothing to discuss re your statements and pronouncements of personal opinion except to point out the incorrectness.

In other words, we can ignore your purposeless whining for what it is. And if you really consider our discussions to be the same, well, you're free to ignore them just as hard.

 

[Zonso]

So I'm not understanding what his point is. Given his lack of effort in backing up his own point, I don't think even he does. "Go prove my point yourself" has always been the weakest form of argument...

I would read that logical fallacy bit again, you are continuing to build strawmen.

 

[thewood]

So other than ACG, where are the rave reviews for Brits.

 

[dalem]

Waiting for what? Someone to hold your hand!? Read and search(current!) the BFC forum. You're old enough to put two and two together. For better or worse, you are on your own. There is nothing to discuss re your statements and pronouncements of personal opinion except to point out the incorrectness.

Hint: Today is not like yesterday.

You claimed that you are "staggered" by the misinformation here, and you listed a few broad topics, and I asked you to list specifics so we could discuss them. You've refused. One of your broad topics was about release dates, I believe. What has staggered you here on this forum about our discussions of proposed release dates? It's nothing that need be looked up on BFC's forum - what staggered you HERE?

-dale

 

[Palantir]

For clarification, a definition of 'Rave Review': a report that praises something in a very enthusiastic way. ... I have nothing but praise for the team that put together the Brit module, like the following people:

Your only example of a "Rave Review" is one from a guy who WORKED on it? :crosseye:
Well done sir, well done.

Btw- when a person makes a publicly bold statement it is HIS responsibility to back it up with facts not run for cover :sneak: crying: "you people look up the supposedly true facts I'm not going to supply any..." aperbag:

 

[thewood]

Well, he can make those statements and not back them up. But at that point he is most likely a troll and instigator. At that point I hope moderators step in. Maybe he is just too embarrassed to bring anything to the table except smoke and mirrors. Looking at some of the spilled secrets coming out of BFC forums, its no surprise to me.

 

[dalem]

Maybe the Gazoombulator Elvis dropped when he left has other features besides Dust-throwing. Maybe it's got an exoskeleton for dancing away from statements.

-dale