SS Scenario playtest tonite

[Alan Hume]

Looking forward to tonite as I get to playtest a scenario with John, we were meant to do it last night but he was still down in Newcastle so no go

I say 'SS' scenario but it's not really, it's a Royal Scots scenario that just happens to have the SS in it

I seem to have been working on an awful lot of 'SS scenarios' of late (well, a couple at least anyhow) but it;s not a conscious decision to write about the SS it's just that they were the people the Royals fought against in those particular fights, nothing more to it than that if anyone is wondering (I can't just ignore them and mark them down as 'generic German unit 1 or something)

Anyhow, it's a VERY small Normandy scenario and I am looking forward to seeing how it plays out, John has already pointed out one mistake I made (in the set up conditions) so I'm glad of that

 

[Alan Hume]

John just left after beating me hollow with the SS, good game, I learnt a lot, he broke the scenario so I am making some changes, we are hopefully going to play it again next week

One thing I am wondering though is just what available firepower a British infantry HQ would have to hand, the HQ had to send out everyone available to stop the Germans (so I have a mix of regular infantry 1st line with 2nd line and green to represent, respectfully, the drivers and cooks who were pressed into the line that day, Still, they were soldiers first and they proved it by beating back the Jerries historically)

Anyhow, I would be interested if anyone knows what sort of kit an Infantry Headquarters in Normandy 44 might have to hand, me and john agreed, regretfully, that they probably wouldn't have had access to an MMG or suchlike (but we have given them PIATS) although we would love to find any excuse for adding that to the British ORBAT

 

[witchbottles]

John just left after beating me hollow with the SS, good game, I learnt a lot, he broke the scenario so I am making some changes, we are hopefully going to play it again next week

One thing I am wondering though is just what available firepower a British infantry HQ would have to hand, the HQ had to send out everyone available to stop the Germans (so I have a mix of regular infantry 1st line with 2nd line and green to represent, respectfully, the drivers and cooks who were pressed into the line that day, Still, they were soldiers first and they proved it by beating back the Jerries historically)

Anyhow, I would be interested if anyone knows what sort of kit an Infantry Headquarters in Normandy 44 might have to hand, me and john agreed, regretfully, that they probably wouldn't have had access to an MMG or suchlike (but we have given them PIATS) although we would love to find any excuse for adding that to the British ORBAT

Hi Alan,

Finding a good historical basis and line for a scenario is important. Remember that ASL is a design for feel game, not a historical simulation game.

You can likely find an excellent breakdown in one of the ASL Annuals or the old Generals concerning British units in ASL and their basic composition in counter format. Steve Swann did many of these excellent articles, a few others did the rest, filling in the gaps.

You might start with Charles Markuss " Tommy Atkins at War" in General Vol 25 , no 6 found for free download at View from the Trenches website. ( can't miss the WoA cover).

"...By 1944, each company had 125-127 men...." This is a British 1944 TO count - so it equates to 12 squads and a Half squad more, with 4 SMCs ( more or less). SWs in a company were typically around three light mortars, and 2/3rds of a chance of a medium mortar present.

Here's what Charles had to say about the MMG in British infantry units:

"...British MMGs were not organic below divisional
level until late in the war, being kept in specialist
MG battalions (with 36 or 48 MMGs apiece) which
had little direct contact with ordinary infantry; this
did little to improve tactical efficiency. The MMGs
were doled out to lower formations as "required",
and for defense this usually sufficed-but in fluid
situations or in attack they were rarely in the right
place in meaningful numbers when needed. By
1944, the MG companies were detached to brigades,
but there were never enough of them..."

so there is a possibility one might be with a company in line, but it would be manned by men not assigned to the company. Given that, if it was present, it would definitely be under the direct logistical command of the HQ , specifically the senior officer, who would partition its use out as he saw fit, to whatever outfit he felt could use it best.

It is interesting that there is a rather high probability that a Normandy 1944 infantry company would have a 76* Mtr in a line company as a TO weapon. With the MMP errata ( J7 I think?) on the mortar size, this is an officially optional rule now it can be a 81* MTR in ASL terms, giving it a higher IFT table.

So your Royal Scots Dragoon Guards company leaving the beach for inland fighting in the Normandy Peninsula in 1944, I might consider as such:

9 x 4-5-8
2 x 2-2-8
3 x 2-4-8
3 x 2-7 LMG
1 x 76* MTR (dismantled)
2 x 51* MTR
1 x 9-1
2 x 8-1
1 x 8-0
3 x PIAT


The noncombatant HQ personnel ( cooks, admin, etc) 1 x 4-4-7, 1 x 7-0
The MMG team if assigned from Brigade HQ 1 x 2-2-8, 1 x MMG

That would be a start point for a company. Now if play tests got you getting chewed up bad every time - then you need to up the Scots while downing the Waffen - SS.

Remember that by mid 1944 most Waffen - ss would be at <-50 % top quality combat veterans. That means about half of the MMCs would be 4-6-8s, 4-6-7s 4-4-7s or 4-3-6s even.

their officer corps was the same by then some sprinkled combat veterans, many new recruits, a few fanatical idiots.

so for a line company you might look like :

1 x 9-2
1 x 8-1
2 x 8-0
1 x 6+1

By mid - 1944 that is.a more well know nunit like LAH might be a

10-2
8-1
2 x 8-0
7-0

instead.
and so on. A SchwerePz unit would have likely a 9-1 AL in it.

Hope all that helps. Read Charles article, it is decent info to begin from for ASL conversions of UK troops.

KRL ,Jon H

 

[Alan Hume]

Hi Alan,

Finding a good historical basis and line for a scenario is important. Remember that ASL is a design for feel game, not a historical simulation game.

You can likely find an excellent breakdown in one of the ASL Annuals or the old Generals concerning British units in ASL and their basic composition in counter format. Steve Swann did many of these excellent articles, a few others did the rest, filling in the gaps.

You might start with Charles Markuss " Tommy Atkins at War" in General Vol 25 , no 6 found for free download at View from the Trenches website. ( can't miss the WoA cover).

"...By 1944, each company had 125-127 men...." This is a British 1944 TO count - so it equates to 12 squads and a Half squad more, with 4 SMCs ( more or less). SWs in a company were typically around three light mortars, and 2/3rds of a chance of a medium mortar present.

Here's what Charles had to say about the MMG in British infantry units:

"...British MMGs were not organic below divisional
level until late in the war, being kept in specialist
MG battalions (with 36 or 48 MMGs apiece) which
had little direct contact with ordinary infantry; this
did little to improve tactical efficiency. The MMGs
were doled out to lower formations as "required",
and for defense this usually sufficed-but in fluid
situations or in attack they were rarely in the right
place in meaningful numbers when needed. By
1944, the MG companies were detached to brigades,
but there were never enough of them..."

so there is a possibility one might be with a company in line, but it would be manned by men not assigned to the company. Given that, if it was present, it would definitely be under the direct logistical command of the HQ , specifically the senior officer, who would partition its use out as he saw fit, to whatever outfit he felt could use it best.

It is interesting that there is a rather high probability that a Normandy 1944 infantry company would have a 76* Mtr in a line company as a TO weapon. With the MMP errata ( J7 I think?) on the mortar size, this is an officially optional rule now it can be a 81* MTR in ASL terms, giving it a higher IFT table.

So your Royal Scots Dragoon Guards company leaving the beach for inland fighting in the Normandy Peninsula in 1944, I might consider as such:

9 x 4-5-8
2 x 2-2-8
3 x 2-4-8
3 x 2-7 LMG
1 x 76* MTR (dismantled)
2 x 51* MTR
1 x 9-1
2 x 8-1
1 x 8-0
3 x PIAT


The noncombatant HQ personnel ( cooks, admin, etc) 1 x 4-4-7, 1 x 7-0
The MMG team if assigned from Brigade HQ 1 x 2-2-8, 1 x MMG

That would be a start point for a company. Now if play tests got you getting chewed up bad every time - then you need to up the Scots while downing the Waffen - SS.

Remember that by mid 1944 most Waffen - ss would be at <-50 % top quality combat veterans. That means about half of the MMCs would be 4-6-8s, 4-6-7s 4-4-7s or 4-3-6s even.

their officer corps was the same by then some sprinkled combat veterans, many new recruits, a few fanatical idiots.

so for a line company you might look like :

1 x 9-2
1 x 8-1
2 x 8-0
1 x 6+1

By mid - 1944 that is.a more well know nunit like LAH might be a

10-2
8-1
2 x 8-0
7-0

instead.
and so on. A SchwerePz unit would have likely a 9-1 AL in it.

Hope all that helps. Read Charles article, it is decent info to begin from for ASL conversions of UK troops.

KRL ,Jon H

Hey Jon,
yeah, many thanks, I downloaded 'Tommy Atkins at war' a while back I will have to check it out again
I was going by Michael Dorosh's excellent book for the most part for the British ORBAT in ASL terms to be honest

I really like where you are going with this though, lots of options there, though, with only 30 men in the defence (and no real mention of what weapons they had) I am going to have to guess I guess. can't imagine there being many crew served weapons though really if there was only 30 men and two leaders but, as you say, maybe, just maybe they had some

certainly it does sound possible for there to have been an MMG there at that time (glad you confirmed that it would be attached to the HQ if it was anywhere, I wasn't sure)

going to go back to the start and think this over again, heck, I don't even know if the Epson battle was fought in Bocage proper, my books don't really say I'm just assuming it was (though I can't see any on Ian Daglish's Scotland the Brave maps) I need to find out for sure

 

[witchbottles]

Hey Jon,
yeah, many thanks, I downloaded 'Tommy Atkins at war' a while back I will have to check it out again
I was going by Michael Dorosh's excellent book for the most part for the British ORBAT in ASL terms to be honest

I really like where you are going with this though, lots of options there, though, with only 30 men in the defence (and no real mention of what weapons they had) I am going to have to guess I guess. can't imagine there being many crew served weapons though really if there was only 30 men and two leaders but, as you say, maybe, just maybe they had some

certainly it does sound possible for there to have been an MMG there at that time (glad you confirmed that it would be attached to the HQ if it was anywhere, I wasn't sure)

going to go back to the start and think this over again, heck, I don't even know if the Epson battle was fought in Bocage proper, my books don't really say I'm just assuming it was (though I can't see any on Ian Daglish's Scotland the Brave maps) I need to find out for sure

Well, Bocage in both its incarnations (1st and 2nd edition versions ) was clearly around when Ian designed StB I and II. Further Ian was quite well versed in Bocage both to its actual terrain effects as well as it ASL game effects in both versions of the rule book.
( Bocage rules, along with the Walls and Hedges in general, were re-written for 2nd Edition ASL rules).

What to the period maps and what to the current Google Earth show for the area? Google maps is free and will give you a satellite overhead view of any point on Earth you designate, and you can scroll the images in every compass direction, as well as blow them in and out for examining detail. ( Granted the images run from 1-4 months behind on average, but an excellent tool overall.) I'd look to those for examining the terrain. Overall in ASL terms, Bocage favors the defender in most cases, it is brutally channelling to any attack.

In StB I and II- Ian gave ATGs to the Brits, along with an OBA module that is rather powerful, actually. You don't get a lot of SW MGs as the Brits, but you do get some 3 ROF ATGs that will bounce off most Panthers for AP shot, but do quite well at double duty 2 fp AP Equivalency ASL rules against infantry - ersatz 2 FP HMGs if you will.

If there were crew served weapons in the area, they likely would be one of those ATGs ( 57L in ASL terms). Or one of the ubuquitous 51* mtrs.

If one could verify the prevalence of 76* mtrs in the area - one could add that to the Brit OOB if looking to balance and needing to offer the Brits a large boost. Certainly, I'd take a 12 FP mtr over a 4 FP MMG any day of the week.

All 3 seem to have been equally likely in the general vicinity - its just a matter of discovering if one or more of them were actually in the specific action being investigated.

Have you considered looking at any German sources??

Vast quantities of action reports , esp by units of the Waffen - SS are stored in the BundesArchiv. If you know what you are looking for, ( and you do), consider petitioning on the forum and on CSW and BGG for german resident ASL afficianados who might consider a day trip to the Archiv. For payment of nominal travel expenses, copying fees, and a decent lunch per diem fee for the volunteer willing to help you out, and armed with specifics about what to look for - the BundesArchiv can present a photostatic copy of a specific Action Report if one is available and stored. These are slowly being digitized anyway, enough DEEP digging might find it already completed for you and out there on the interweb - but I would HIGHLY recommend that you use an academic search engine set to find those, if they are available, and may take input of 20-100 search variables to find it if it is done yet.

Another nominal fee for the volunteer after they have the photostat, and they may consider scanning it and emailing it to you.

consider looking at what 2SS PzKorps has out there already on their action reports - and you might find what you are looking for. It will take a lot of digging online , however, if it is out there already.

KRL, Jon H

 

[Alan Hume]

Well, Bocage in both its incarnations (1st and 2nd edition versions ) was clearly around when Ian designed StB I and II. Further Ian was quite well versed in Bocage both to its actual terrain effects as well as it ASL game effects in both versions of the rule book.
( Bocage rules, along with the Walls and Hedges in general, were re-written for 2nd Edition ASL rules).

What to the period maps and what to the current Google Earth show for the area? Google maps is free and will give you a satellite overhead view of any point on Earth you designate, and you can scroll the images in every compass direction, as well as blow them in and out for examining detail. ( Granted the images run from 1-4 months behind on average, but an excellent tool overall.) I'd look to those for examining the terrain. Overall in ASL terms, Bocage favors the defender in most cases, it is brutally channelling to any attack.

In StB I and II- Ian gave ATGs to the Brits, along with an OBA module that is rather powerful, actually. You don't get a lot of SW MGs as the Brits, but you do get some 3 ROF ATGs that will bounce off most Panthers for AP shot, but do quite well at double duty 2 fp AP Equivalency ASL rules against infantry - ersatz 2 FP HMGs if you will.

If there were crew served weapons in the area, they likely would be one of those ATGs ( 57L in ASL terms). Or one of the ubuquitous 51* mtrs.

If one could verify the prevalence of 76* mtrs in the area - one could add that to the Brit OOB if looking to balance and needing to offer the Brits a large boost. Certainly, I'd take a 12 FP mtr over a 4 FP MMG any day of the week.

All 3 seem to have been equally likely in the general vicinity - its just a matter of discovering if one or more of them were actually in the specific action being investigated.

Have you considered looking at any German sources??

Vast quantities of action reports , esp by units of the Waffen - SS are stored in the BundesArchiv. If you know what you are looking for, ( and you do), consider petitioning on the forum and on CSW and BGG for german resident ASL afficianados who might consider a day trip to the Archiv. For payment of nominal travel expenses, copying fees, and a decent lunch per diem fee for the volunteer willing to help you out, and armed with specifics about what to look for - the BundesArchiv can present a photostatic copy of a specific Action Report if one is available and stored. These are slowly being digitized anyway, enough DEEP digging might find it already completed for you and out there on the interweb - but I would HIGHLY recommend that you use an academic search engine set to find those, if they are available, and may take input of 20-100 search variables to find it if it is done yet.

Another nominal fee for the volunteer after they have the photostat, and they may consider scanning it and emailing it to you.

consider looking at what 2SS PzKorps has out there already on their action reports - and you might find what you are looking for. It will take a lot of digging online , however, if it is out there already.

KRL, Jon H

Thanks Jon,
yes, as my friend John pointed out last night to me, Ian Daglish would have walked the actual battlefields themselves (in his role as both a historian and a tour guide) so he would know intimately what the ground was actually like for sure

thanks for the idea, not sure I have google earth (or maps) on my computer to be honest but I will check

Yeah, by rights, I guess you're only really looking at 1 LMG to every 5 men in game terms but, I think I will fudge it
and give them more (I already gave them 2 but I am tempted to increase it to 3 AND an MMG, maybe that't too much I don't know I'm probably better just sticking with 2 AND an MMG) and a 2" mortar. You're right though a 76* mortar would really make a difference (if I can just find provenance for it)

I must admit, I have never actually used the BundesArchiv. I thought it was purely a photographic resource to be honest, (shows what I know:laugh It's worth thinking about for the future for sure (at the moment my funds really won't stretch to covering anyone's expenses unfortunately so it's probably a no go, I am pretty darn skint, and the cat doesn't help by constantly breaking things, AND my vacuum cleaner just went on fire yesterday so there's another bill to pay)

I will definetely try to find what I can on the internet though. Thanks for the heads up re the academic search engine
been a long time since I did any studying so that's kind of new to me.

BASE from Bielefeld University Library looks promising

thanks Jon, I think it's moving forward anyhow

 

[Alan Hume]

hmm, okay, guess I'll give them just the 1 LMG and allow them the MMG, it seems more historically correct with the British ORBAT AND, with only a few British squad counters I just don't think there's enough men to give them much more

saying that I think I can stretch to 2 PIATS (was going to give them 3 but that would probably be a bit too much) and a 2" mortar
(they would surely have had a 2" mortar)

 

[Paul M. Weir]

Just be careful when allocating extra LMG. Nearly all squads (EXC: Soviet 628/527) contain an inherent LMG. Some could be read to have 2 inherent LMG, I'm thinking of the SS 658, possibly the SS/non-SS 548, though the later's extra FP could be down to a higher percentage of SMG, AR or semi-AR. Ditto the 6 FP USA/USMC should be treated as having 2 BAR (and 3 for the USMC 768).

The LMG counters represent something above and beyond the squad TO&E, it could be a platoon extra reserve LMG (moderately common) or just simply extra ammo allowing freer use of existing LMG or the platoon crack LMG team who had their coffee this morning.

So, for example, when reading that a 30 man British platoon had 4 LMG in total, deduct 1 for each of the 3 squads, leaving 1 extra LMG.

 

[Alan Hume]

Just be careful when allocating extra LMG. Nearly all squads (EXC: Soviet 628/527) contain an inherent LMG. Some could be read to have 2 inherent LMG, I'm thinking of the SS 658, possibly the SS/non-SS 548, though the later's extra FP could be down to a higher percentage of SMG, AR or semi-AR. Ditto the 6 FP USA/USMC should be treated as having 2 BAR (and 3 for the USMC 768).

The LMG counters represent something above and beyond the squad TO&E, it could be a platoon extra reserve LMG (moderately common) or just simply extra ammo allowing freer use of existing LMG or the platoon crack LMG team who had their coffee this morning.

So, for example, when reading that a 30 man British platoon had 4 LMG in total, deduct 1 for each of the 3 squads, leaving 1 extra LMG.

Thanks, I didn't realise that, I just assumed it was only the American counters that had the LMG's (BARS) factored in
as they didn't have any seperate counters

still reckon I'll keep it as 1 LMG and an MMG though, it could well change after playing it though

 

[Paul M. Weir]

Thanks, I didn't realise that, I just assumed it was only the American counters that had the LMG's (BARS) factored in
as they didn't have any seperate counters

still reckon I'll keep it as 1 LMG and an MMG though, it could well change after playing it though

That sounds sensible to me. Playtesting is the real acid test and should determine any weapon allocation tweaking. ASL scenarios rarely are both strictly historical and balanced at the same time, it's just something to live with. No real life commander will go into a 'fair fight' if he can avoid that, it's war not the Olympics.

As to your first point, it does odd that, as an inherent LMG, that a BAR should equal a MG-42, but that's the way ASL does it. I suppose the main justification for that is ammo limitations. While a dedicated M/HMG team might have a wagon/handcart or small truck to port the rounds that they would go through, a squad will have to distribute their load amongst the squad. Even with a practical limit of 2 cans (250 each) per squad member, a 12 man squad has only 3000 rounds which is equal to 5 (600 r/m) to 2.5 (1200 r/m) minutes firing. That might have to last them hours or even a couple of days, so can't afford to casually blaze away, so overall an inherent BAR might not be so much worse than a MG-42 as their raw stats might suggest. A BAR SW counter might only rate a 1-6 B11 1 PP, as if we assume that a SW LMG comes with a ship load of ammo, then the raw differences will become apparent.

 

[Alan Hume]

That sounds sensible to me. Playtesting is the real acid test and should determine any weapon allocation tweaking. ASL scenarios rarely are both strictly historical and balanced at the same time, it's just something to live with. No real life commander will go into a 'fair fight' if he can avoid that, it's war not the Olympics.

As to your first point, it does odd that, as an inherent LMG, that a BAR should equal a MG-42, but that's the way ASL does it. I suppose the main justification for that is ammo limitations. While a dedicated M/HMG team might have a wagon/handcart or small truck to port the rounds that they would go through, a squad will have to distribute their load amongst the squad. Even with a practical limit of 2 cans (250 each) per squad member, a 12 man squad has only 3000 rounds which is equal to 5 (600 r/m) to 2.5 (1200 r/m) minutes firing. That might have to last them hours or even a couple of days, so can't afford to casually blaze away, so overall an inherent BAR might not be so much worse than a MG-42 as their raw stats might suggest. A BAR SW counter might only rate a 1-6 B11 1 PP, as if we assume that a SW LMG comes with a ship load of ammo, then the raw differences will become apparent.

thanks, yeah, the playtest should determine the number I need I guess, certainly, the British didn't have enough firepower in the last game (although being overrun by a PZIV didn't help)

that's true what you are saying about the support weapons right enough, makes sense I'm guessing the difference in firepower is purely down to the amount of ammo available then and not so much the actual weapon itself?

 

[Alan Hume]

Yet another game of the Royals vs the SS in Normandy tonite (down the local wargames club for change, SESWC, so there was beer on tap)

Good game, John ambushed my tanks and this led to me changing the set up parameters for the Brits to prevent it happening again, neato, I missed that possibility

It was a British victory but the Germans had a good chance of winning despite the tanks being ambushed (one was immobilised and the other bogged itself down trying to cross bocage)

 

[Alan Hume]

got more playtesting done and hope to get more today
phew' hard work all this you know:laugh:

 

[Alan Hume]

well, just got back from Dundee, Martin, Rod and Dave ran through the Normandy game and I think it went well, hopefully I can put it to bed now and move onto other ones, got it pinned at 4 1/2 turns now instead of the 6 it originally was

 

[MrP]

Great reality argument, but in GAME terms, sometimes adding an lmg is just a way of giving an OB the means to lay a firelane or kill a tin can, rather than being historically accurate. Design for effect

Just be careful when allocating extra LMG. Nearly all squads (EXC: Soviet 628/527) contain an inherent LMG. Some could be read to have 2 inherent LMG, I'm thinking of the SS 658, possibly the SS/non-SS 548, though the later's extra FP could be down to a higher percentage of SMG, AR or semi-AR. Ditto the 6 FP USA/USMC should be treated as having 2 BAR (and 3 for the USMC 768).

The LMG counters represent something above and beyond the squad TO&E, it could be a platoon extra reserve LMG (moderately common) or just simply extra ammo allowing freer use of existing LMG or the platoon crack LMG team who had their coffee this morning.

 

[Alan Hume]

Great reality argument, but in GAME terms, sometimes adding an lmg is just a way of giving an OB the means to lay a firelane or kill a tin can, rather than being historically accurate. Design for effect

thanks, that's what my buddy John said as well, still, just trying to be as historical as I can and trying to stick to the ORBATS given in the books as much as I can (well, the Regimental histories really don't say so going by ORBAT books and stuff really, Michael Dorosh's excellent Scenario Designer's book in particular for ASL ORBATS I guess)

 

[Paul M. Weir]

Great reality argument, but in GAME terms, sometimes adding an lmg is just a way of giving an OB the means to lay a firelane or kill a tin can, rather than being historically accurate. Design for effect

I would completely agree, just keep the number down to 1 LMG per roughly 4 to 8 squads or per the SW allocation tables. I even would not have too much of a problem with 1 per platoon (4 squads early war, 3 later), but 1 per squad would be a definite no-no. Some To&Es had an official platoon spare, others would have been the result of the rude and licentious soldiery hoovering up anything that was not set in concrete. In the end, being a game, the exact numbers of everything will depend upon designer intent and play testing, within some rough historical limits.

 

[Alan Hume]

I would completely agree, just keep the number down to 1 LMG per roughly 4 to 8 squads or per the SW allocation tables. I even would not have too much of a problem with 1 per platoon (4 squads early war, 3 later), but 1 per squad would be a definite no-no. Some To&Es had an official platoon spare, others would have been the result of the rude and licentious soldiery hovering up anything that was not set in concrete. In the end, being a game, the exact numbers of everything will depend upon designer intent and play testing, within some rough historical limits.

THanks, yeah, I have been pretty much sticking to the SW allocation tables on the Nationality chart fold out page thingy
and that seems reasonable

sure enough some units would have extra kit that they had scrounged that was officially not on record anywhere
(and maybe even some captured enemy weapons too, not sure how they would get the ammo for that htough unless they were compatible)

Yeah, playtesting seems to mean everything for sure, I wish I could get more done to be honest, maybe I should post up here asking for volunteers:laugh: I am getting those scenarios playtested but it is infrequent at best and slow going

Still, I have a lot more work to do anyhow so no biggie I guess, still working on most of the scenarios (and need to see the KOREA ASL mapboards to, hopefully, get a Mountain spur for a couple of Italian scenarios)

I like the fact you said 'rough' historical limits
because I have been slowly, slowly, coming to terms with the conflict between the demands of 'gameplay' and 'historical accuracy' everyone is telling me now that I have been a slave to historical accuracy and need to lighten up

So I have done, I've only put one AA gun into this scenario instead of 2, there was 2 there but, as I say, I don't know exactly where on the ridge they were (I know roughly the correct area, above the Dortmund Ems canal, but not the exact location or which troops they were with etc) and I think 2 guns could be just tooooooo much firepower on the German side (even with ammo shortage in place)

 

[Paul M. Weir]

I would not worry about being a 'slave' to historical accuracy, indeed that is the best place to start from. Find out what was there, try that out and only then from there work out what works to give a good scenario/CG. I think you are starting from the right angle.

 

[Alan Hume]

I would not worry about being a 'slave' to historical accuracy, indeed that is the best place to start from. Find out what was there, try that out and only then from there work out what works to give a good scenario/CG. I think you are starting from the right angle.

Thanks Paul,
yep, I am finding myself a lot less bothered about being 'strictly' accurate now, I was before but now I can see that the needs of the game kind of outweigh the historicity a bit at times, I mean, all those early Squad Leader scenarios set in Stalingrad weren't totally adhering to history where they? I guess they were just giving you a feel for the battle more than anything else so that's probably the way to look at things, be accurate where you can but change things to fit if need be