SP 110 - Chernichivo Shuffle VC

[KevinG]

Dreaded and/or again;

Russians win if no GO Germans in pillboxs/trenches and/or in buildings X,Y,Z.

Does this mean the Russians have to remove GO Germans from both the pillboxes/trench and the Buildings, or from just one of the 2 groups for the win ??

 

[klasmalmstrom]

See this thread:
http://www.war-forums.com/forums/showthread.php?t=20923

 

[Tompy]

Generaly in a SP scenario "and/or" is equal to "and".

<Insert Princess Bride Quote here.>

I always go to the analysis and design notes for the answer. Usually the designer will be very excited about how the game ends and describe a typical situation and give away the definition of the VC.

Kevin, the same issue came up in "Captain Lambert's Factory" at Winter War.

I didn't know Tennessee and Iowa remained British colonies as your personal info (flag and location and accent) indicate.

Later,
Jeff

 

[Georgii2222]

Generaly in a SP scenario "and/or" is equal to "and".

I don't understand this, though. This is poor VC wording, as "and/or" is NOT equal to "and".

for example:

"The German player wins at game end if he controls buildings A and/or B"

Now extrapolated out:

The German player wins at game end if he controls buildings A and B

The German player wins at game end if he controls buildings A or B

This means that the German wins if
A) He controls building A
B) He controls building B
C) He happens to control both of them

So, why not say "The German wins at game end if he controls buildings A and B", if that's what it's intended to say?

 

[KevinG]

Hi Jeff - I also check the scenario notes when this type of issue comes up. The notes for Captain Lambert's Factory clearly refer to the Canadien having to take all 3 factories but the SP110 notes don't mention it one way or the other.

I really wanted an English flag but the option just isn't there...

 

[Tompy]

Jeff,

You are absolutely correct. This is a question I've brought up in these forums time and time again. Evan has never addressed it directly to my knowledge. I think bringing it up again can't hurt. Evan would have to be real stubborn to continue this error in SP#11.

The answers usually reside in the notes booklet that comes with the scenario (or not).

Later,
Jeff

 

[asloser]

Jeff,

You are absolutely correct. This is a question I've brought up in these forums time and time again. Evan has never addressed it directly to my knowledge. I think bringing it up again can't hurt. Evan would have to be real stubborn to continue this error in SP#11.

The answers usually reside in the notes booklet that comes with the scenario (or not).

Later,
Jeff

This thread contains Evans comments on the subject. However, he does not make complete sense to me and I really hope he'd

a) clarify this for every SP scenario using and/or in VC

b) make sure SP uses this term as everyone else publishing scenarios from this point on.

 

[Larry]

This means that the German wins if
A) He controls building A
B) He controls building B
C) He happens to control both of them

"A and B" means (C) only.
"A or B" means (A) and (B) only, reading "or" as disjunctive. Understanding that "or" can also be conjunctive would include result (C). To avoid the linguistic argument that "or" is disjunctive and that "and" is conjunctive, you get "and/or." To make it clear that results (A) (B) and (C) are all situations where the German wins, the designer uses "and/or."