So what Starter Kit Scenario have you played recently?

olli

Elder Member
Silver Supporting Member
Joined
Jun 17, 2003
Messages
7,392
Reaction score
871
Location
Scotland
Country
llGermany
Well if I ever get back to the UK from holland (vocano permitting) I have to bring my starter kit stuff back with me as I found out today that one of tha dutch guys wants to learn how to play ASL!!! and i have been here 10 months without knowing!!
 

custardpie

Elder Member
Joined
Oct 18, 2008
Messages
6,331
Reaction score
535
Location
Nottingham
Country
llUnited Kingdom
Well if I ever get back to the UK from holland (vocano permitting) I have to bring my starter kit stuff back with me as I found out today that one of tha dutch guys wants to learn how to play ASL!!! and i have been here 10 months without knowing!!
That would suck if you are only there 12 months!!!!!!

I lived next to a frustraited wargamer for about 18 months before finding out!!! I was walking up my drive and he asked where I had been, told him I had been out to get paint for some figures I was painting, he nearly fell down the ladder in his haste!!!!!!!

I think this is because we often don't like to talk about our hobby, I do so now at most oppertunities!!!!
 

sunoftzu

Senior Member
Joined
Mar 3, 2005
Messages
862
Reaction score
325
Location
Taipei, Taiwan
Country
llTaiwan
Hi,

I've played over 800 ASL games dating back to 1988 (started SL in 1987), but tonight was my first ASLSK game. S1 Retaking Vierville.

So, for me it was a case of un-learning rules (no conc, no dash, no bypass movement, deployment/recombining, etc). The 1 rule that I noticed to be _different_ from ASL is that you may use low crawl into an interdictable OG hex even when starting ADJACENT to an unbroken armed enemy unit (In ASL, you can only do that when No Quarter (A20.3) is in effect).

I played the Germans against Mike Wattie, and I have read nothing at all in the way of AARs and strategies for S1. But it seemed to me that the thing to do as Germans was to use the turn 1 groups to block the entry of the American reinforcements. About three quarters of the Americans enter as reinforcements, so use the 447s (around u3) and 467s (around r7) to interdict / block / slow down their entry into the central village. The turn 2 and 3 548s and their 9-1 leaders meanwhile are the guys to use closer to the centre of the village. The at start Americans do look hard pressed to keep the 548s at bay.

.......... And that's pretty much the way it happened. The American reinforcements (despite some good FP attacks) were not able to break the Germans, and the at start 747s were simply not able to keep the Germans out of the VC hexes. By the end of turn 4, it was clear that the Germans were indeed going to hold on to at least 2 buildings, and most likely more (to his credit, Mike fought hard until it was well beyond apparent that the Germans were set to be permanent residents in L3 and M4). The Germans simply stopped the US reinforcements cold.

Anyway, next week, it'll be my turn with the Americans (against the balance assisted Germans; +1 548 turn 3). We'll see how that goes.

I've owned the SKs for about 2 years now. Its good to finally get a scenario done (and it looks like I'll be playing FtF SK ASL on a regular basis, which is not something to be scoffed at when you live on the outskirts of Taipei).

I'll try to keep you all informed.

John Knowles.
 
Last edited:

ChrisM

Senior Member
Joined
Sep 30, 2004
Messages
1,022
Reaction score
164
Location
Mineola, NY
Country
llUnited States
Yeah - sonoftzu - I have found that to be the case as well. asuming the Germans grab those stone buildings, they can restrict the American reinforcement groups greatly. Thsi amkes an American victory very unlikely, since those three para squads in the village at start realistically will get overwhelmed by the German paras.

From what I have read, the consensus is that this one is somewhat pro german, so it amkes sesne to let the newbies take the Axis if this si their first time out fo teh box. Nontheless, i find it to be a fun little teaching scenario, and the three playings I have had with it have all been exciting - and served to bait the ASL hook.
 

sunoftzu

Senior Member
Joined
Mar 3, 2005
Messages
862
Reaction score
325
Location
Taipei, Taiwan
Country
llTaiwan
ChrisM;1273173Yeah - sonoftzu - I have found that to be the case as well. asuming the Germans grab those stone buildings said:
The real kicker is that the Germans don't _need_ to overwhelm the Americans. They just need to occupy 1 of 4 (1 of 3 if using the American balance) stone buildings, which 3.5 squads are going to be very hard pressed to keep out.

John.
 

Spencer Armstrong

Canard de Guerre
Joined
Mar 7, 2009
Messages
8,336
Reaction score
1,229
Location
Gainesville, FL
First name
Spencer
Country
llUnited States
The real kicker is that the Germans don't _need_ to overwhelm the Americans. They just need to occupy 1 of 4 (1 of 3 if using the American balance) stone buildings, which 3.5 squads are going to be very hard pressed to keep out.

John.
One thing I noted when playing this vs. a newbie is that the VCs do not require the Amis to gain control in the full ASL sense. The onus is on the Germans to have a GO MMC in one of the buildings. That means the Ami paras may need to shoot late, trying for a break or two, rather than try to push in for CC, as would be more common in full ASL. Given the potency of 7FP squads with that 9-2, this can really change the end game.

I also feel this is slightly pro-German, but ROAR shows it pro-American. I find this weird, since the Ami has to cross the OG, something I would think would not be a "natural" SK player skill. Maybe the German setup isn't as obvious as it seems. It does reopen the question of "what is balanced?" For a SK scenario, it seems crazy to say "balanced" is "balanced between two top players."

S
 

custardpie

Elder Member
Joined
Oct 18, 2008
Messages
6,331
Reaction score
535
Location
Nottingham
Country
llUnited Kingdom
One thing I noted when playing this vs. a newbie is that the VCs do not require the Amis to gain control in the full ASL sense. The onus is on the Germans to have a GO MMC in one of the buildings. That means the Ami paras may need to shoot late, trying for a break or two, rather than try to push in for CC, as would be more common in full ASL. Given the potency of 7FP squads with that 9-2, this can really change the end game.

I also feel this is slightly pro-German, but ROAR shows it pro-American. I find this weird, since the Ami has to cross the OG, something I would think would not be a "natural" SK player skill. Maybe the German setup isn't as obvious as it seems. It does reopen the question of "what is balanced?" For a SK scenario, it seems crazy to say "balanced" is "balanced between two top players."

S
Just to add 10p's worth (UK funny money).
Remember that the defender in many cases will not also be an experianced ASL'er also. Maybe taking early shots that allow other follow on units to get in close?

Of course this could be played by very experianced SK only guys, but I am tending to edge my bets too the less experianced as it is S1. If it was from ASLSK3 Tanks then I would feel more inclined to beleive it to be the playground of the experianced player. Ifg it was from Opps then I would take it as read that the player has more experiance.

On this subject I know one experianced ASL player in the ASLSK league who has lost his first two rounds. This should underline that Starter Kit does not equal low skill.

A way to get the image of the SK higher is forum threads such as this and more interaction to further dispatch the us and them feel that sometimes comes up. Funny thing though is that this thread gets more comments from the full ASL boys than the SK boys. Though for the most part from guys who don't need the brush removing from certain holes!!! LOL
 

Spencer Armstrong

Canard de Guerre
Joined
Mar 7, 2009
Messages
8,336
Reaction score
1,229
Location
Gainesville, FL
First name
Spencer
Country
llUnited States
On this subject I know one experianced ASL player in the ASLSK league who has lost his first two rounds. This should underline that Starter Kit does not equal low skill.
Oh, you don't have to tell me. Full ASL doesn't equal high skill, either, especially in my case. I'm honing in on Belcher's "losing to newbies" schtick. :laugh:

I really was pointing this out only in light of the fact that this is S1, presumably the very first scenario being played by at least one of the two players, and crossing open ground is a vital skill but one that I think almost everyone has to learn through experience. I meant no slight on all of ASLSKplayerdom. My musings on "balance" especially muddied that, I see, but no slight was intended. I've been fairly regularly playing with a particular SK player lately who has a much better natural tactical sense than I do, in fact, so I am (painfully) aware. :)

S
 

custardpie

Elder Member
Joined
Oct 18, 2008
Messages
6,331
Reaction score
535
Location
Nottingham
Country
llUnited Kingdom
Oh, you don't have to tell me. Full ASL doesn't equal high skill, either, especially in my case. I'm honing in on Belcher's "losing to newbies" schtick. :laugh:

I really was pointing this out only in light of the fact that this is S1, presumably the very first scenario being played by at least one of the two players, and crossing open ground is a vital skill but one that I think almost everyone has to learn through experience. I meant no slight on all of ASLSKplayerdom. My musings on "balance" especially muddied that, I see, but no slight was intended. I've been fairly regularly playing with a particular SK player lately who has a much better natural tactical sense than I do, in fact, so I am (painfully) aware. :)

S
No insult seen to be intended. I was in a way agreeing with you whilst pointing out maybe it was the new guy doing the defence!!!

I WAS refering to you when mentioning the positive ASL boys in town.

Enough loveing?

Cheers
Ian
 

Spencer Armstrong

Canard de Guerre
Joined
Mar 7, 2009
Messages
8,336
Reaction score
1,229
Location
Gainesville, FL
First name
Spencer
Country
llUnited States
No insult seen to be intended. I was in a way agreeing with you whilst pointing out maybe it was the new guy doing the defence!!!

I WAS refering to you when mentioning the positive ASL boys in town.

Enough loveing?

Cheers
Ian
Oh, indeed. I'm all a-flutter... ;)

S
 

Kala

Member
Joined
Feb 13, 2010
Messages
90
Reaction score
11
Location
Valencia, Spain
Country
llSpain
Played yesterday against Dagalord the scenario S21 Clash at Borisovka, I take the russians, Dagalord the germans, I had 10 T-34, and the germans 2 Tigers and 4 Pz IV, the maps are t and v.
The VC states that win who destroy more tanks, but for the russians, every tank that got out for the other side of the map counts like one german tank destroyed.
The game has been fast and furious, I have exploted one gap in the german line on the left to take away 2 T-34 on turn 2, and on the right I have confronted one tiger and Pz IV, losing one T-34, but then the Tiger has broken MA, in a hurry I have moved all the T-34 by that hole, firing against the Pz IV all I can, special APCR, then AP, finally destroing it. I have parked one T-34 behind the Tiger, in the german turn it has repaired that fearful 88L but I have destroyed it with a critical, wooooo, when it has started the engine, finally I have exit 6 T-34 and destroyed 4 german tanks against 4 mine, not bad. The last tank I have destroyed I have been lucky because I have survived more that I have expected with a SHOCK against my last T-34, but I have recovered it and seeing that I was encircled by 3 german tanks I have prefered to stay and fight, destroing my last Pz IV in Prep Fire, and losing my tank in german Defensive First Fire.
The game has only last 4 turns, but we have played it in only 1 1/2 hour.

Kala
 
Joined
Jul 21, 2009
Messages
482
Reaction score
55
Location
SW Indiana
My brother-in-law and I finally finished the SK#1 scenarios tonight. Unfortunately, I just discovered that we had ignored the official errata from MMP. Oh well...

Believe it or not, we like "Retaking Vierville" the best. For that matter, "The Guards Counterattack" was always my favorite SL scenario. With the really basic scenarios, neither player can ever have a "rules advantage."

EDIT: That's sort of a big deal, since I often taught most of my opponents, rather than having them read the rules themselves.
 
Last edited:

sunoftzu

Senior Member
Joined
Mar 3, 2005
Messages
862
Reaction score
325
Location
Taipei, Taiwan
Country
llTaiwan
Hi,

I just finished playing my 2nd ASLSK game (S1 Retaking Vierville, this time as American, with German balance in effect).

The tactics employed were quite similar to before (see post #25 of this thread), with the German turn 1 groups focusing on blocking the US reinforcements (around the u3 and r7 strongpoints). The US repsonded by attacking through the NE grainfield, using the 337 hs in u6 to keep the 447s at bay.

At first it was reminicent of the earlier game, with the US FP having little overall effect. The turn 2 German group decided to add its weight into blocking the reinforcements as well, by assaulting the under pressure turn 1 American group. They managed to wipe out a 747 through failiure to rout, but the 548 then suffered a similar fate in the next RtPh, and the other 2 squads were a bit isolated around o10.

Sure, they could stop any speedy advances down the east edge of the map, but they were certainly leaving the Turn 3 group with a bit to do, and I was confident enough that my at-start forces could hold them off long enough for someone to make it there to help them. In the end, it took a few more MCs to break up the remenants, and the Turn 3 group was able to also deal with the 447s, which all broke during Ger 4 DFPh. So, on my turn 4, some well placed smoke allowed about 5-6 squads and 2 leaders to enter Vierville (albeit a toehold around p5 and q6, but at least that was close enough to launch a last turn assault).

In the meantime, CCs and FTR in the RtPh had whittled the Germans down to only a few 548s left, and in the end, it took some well thought out and plucky moving to get a 548 and 9-1 into L3. But they had far too many enemy squads to deal with, and ended up breaking on a FPF DR as the green wave engulfed them, handing victory to the US in the last turn of the game. Good game (any ASL game that goes to the last turn is).

I have to say, I like this little learning scenario!!!

On to War of the Rats next week.....

John.
 
Last edited:

Spencer Armstrong

Canard de Guerre
Joined
Mar 7, 2009
Messages
8,336
Reaction score
1,229
Location
Gainesville, FL
First name
Spencer
Country
llUnited States
I have to say, I like this little learning scenario!!!

On to War of the Rats next week.....

John.
I agree about S1. Nice little scenario, but I think S2 adds a touch too much. I'd have added just MGs, not DCs & FTs. Which is why my SK protege and I started S7 Prelude to Festung Brest last night (of course, that does have finicky 6ML Amis)

S
 

custardpie

Elder Member
Joined
Oct 18, 2008
Messages
6,331
Reaction score
535
Location
Nottingham
Country
llUnited Kingdom
Played my second full ASL game with a recent SK convert. He is of the mind now that once we finish the game we are playing at the moment he will just play full ASL as he is ready for the move. We are playing Gorring's men from one of the opperation mags and we are having a blast with that. As has been mentioned in other threads the SK boards have a habit of being more open so LOS are a little easier.

I do feel that many of the starter kit scenario's seem to be better balanced in SK1 than an average module or pack of ASL.

As mentioned any game that goes down to last turn is good.

Cheers
Ian
 

Kala

Member
Joined
Feb 13, 2010
Messages
90
Reaction score
11
Location
Valencia, Spain
Country
llSpain
Played again S21, but this week against Vehrka and as a german. Having played this scenario last week as a russian had helped me a lot to be in the better place to stop the red wave. I have been lucky with ROF so in the turn three all the fish were sold, all the rusian tanks were burning.

Kala
 

kempenfelter

Motivational Speaker
Joined
Dec 8, 2006
Messages
669
Reaction score
93
Location
Van by the river
Country
llCanada
The Russian tanks were burning? Are you playing Starter Kit with the full ASL AFV destruction table? Heresy!
 
Top