Should I Buy this Game?

High Krausen

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Hi All,

30 years wargaming experience...I'm considering ATF and DA as potential buys.

I have no background knowledge of either other than believing that ATF is at a more tactical level.

I'ld love to hear opinions on these two games from the community.

Thanks in Advance

HK
 

bongotastic

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I've just played the ATF demo so far, and about 1-2 month of DA. Here is my opinion.

The two are played with a very different scope in mind, in ATF you worry about topography, individual platforms and combined arm tactics. If you are into Tactical engagements, I'd recommend giving a whirl to TacOps 4, a personal favorite (which has a good demo and an awesome umpire interface).

In DA, the challenge lies in careful planning of Intelligence and logistics so hopefully the outcome of an engagement doesn't need to come down to tactical prowess. The interface isn't as sleek as ATF, but the game isn't about the same thing either!

So, ATF or TacOps if you want to worry about how to coordinate strikes and troop movements, manage ammunition levels, etc. The action is limited to the frontline and the airstrikes/artillery models are simplified but great fun. If you prefer a sleeker interface, ATF probably beat TacOps, though.

Go for DA if you want to worry about fighting the battle in both the front AND the rear, plan convoys, manage Intelligence priorities and mess with the Red forces using electronic warfare and Psyops.

I personally think of both as complementary and own both TacOps and DA.

Hope this helps,

Christian
 

Scully

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Christian captures things fairly well. DA is at the operational level, while ATF is at the tactical level. Both are excellent at what they do. In addition, both provide the capability to create your own scenarios and units. DA is a we-go system and is very easy and fun to play pbem, while ATF is a "command real-time" as they say and is very difficult to play online.

TacOps is also we-go and very good for pbem and online play. It's a tactical game like ATF. Personally, I prefer ATF, but TacOps has a lot of fans also.

I'd get both (actually all 3).

Brian
 

Ivan Rapkinov

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tacops isn't as "pretty" as ATF, but ATF isn't as open I guess, as TacOps. DA is a commanders sim, meaning that you will be at a disadvantge if you have no knowledge of the actual military. A big disadvantage. So much so that I would hesitate recommending it because you'll spend a lot of the time just learning what all the acronyms mean. Just what they mean, not what they do or how to do them.

but if you persevere, it's one of the most rewarding sims out there.

my advice - if you want a Battalion level Operational game - try TOAW and the PzC/Modern Campaign series first. If after playing them, you're still hankering for more detail, for more options than what they offer, etc then have another look at DA.

all the developers are good guys though, and Pat, MajorH and Jim generally respond quickly to queries or bug reports.

I guess the main issue is whetehr you want a Milsim (which used to be what they were bunched under here - Military Simulations) or a game. The difference between plotting an attack though a hexbased, area of influence is a bit different than plotting through unit footprints, dedicating SEAD and EW units and using a cav sqn to roll though that loggies train :D
 

High Krausen

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Thanks all

Thanks to all for your fine responses. On your recommendations, I have downloaded the Tacops 4 demo and will hopefully get to kick it around this weekend.

DA sounds like deep water for me and my interests. I have no military background so think I'll steer clear for right now.

Thanks again for all your comments.
 

bongotastic

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I agree with James, TOAW may be a better way to start at the operational level. And TOAW has the nice feel of pushing counters around, something you probably like if you played wargames for 30 years already!

My two strikes against TOAW are that 1) Making a scenario is a serious chore, especially if you want to play at the division - corp level. 2) Neither of TOAW and TOAWII work on XP (I'll wait to see what Matrix Games does with TOAW before throwing more money into it).

Christian
 

bongotastic

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Yeah... I just hate to see two CDs on my shelf, which I can't use, coming from the same company.

christian
 

liuzg150181

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bongotastic said:
My two strikes against TOAW are that 1) Making a scenario is a serious chore, especially if you want to play at the division - corp level. 2) Neither of TOAW and TOAWII work on XP (I'll wait to see what Matrix Games does with TOAW before throwing more money into it).

Christian
Actually I have TOAW2 and it works on my Windows XP PC~~~ :D
 
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