Riders and Case A

Larry

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Passengers are clear on bounding fire -- they pay the case B and case C DRM, in the example:

a NT Gun Type or any Passenger must add a +5 DRM (2 + 3).
What isn't clear are riders. D6.22:

Riders may not use SW, must use halved FP as Mounted Fire when firing their inherent FP on the IFT (quartered if the vehicle has moved or is in Motion, inclusive of OVR attacks), and must add one to their CC DR.
Tank rolls up and comes to a stop. Cases B and C do not apply to non-ordnance shots of PRC, just halved for moving.

In the next player turn, the tank spins the VCA to fire B and CMG at a target. The roll pays the +5 DRM for the spinning shot. Riders have stayed on the tank the whole time. Now they want to fire. Is the shot free of DRM for the VCA change? It is clear the C in PRC pay the case A. Don't see where PR in PRC would pay. Have I missed something?
 

jrv

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Are we talking IFT attacks or TH attacks? The Case B & C DRM only apply to TH attacks. A Passenger/Rider using inherent FP (and/or SW LMGs for Passengers) firing on the IFT are halved for mounted fire (EXC: halftrack) and halved if using BFF/AFPh. There are no DRM for IFT attacks, only FP reduction.

The EX you are quoting is part of C5.3, where the rule says that Case C applies "when firing ordnance." A Passenger firing ordnance would indeed have a +5 DRM added to its TH DRM. Per D3.52 the case A DRM also applies to BMG/CMG/IFE when a CA change occurs, but it does not apply case A to Passengers or Riders.

JR
 
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Eagle4ty

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Correct, and since Riders cannot fire a SW, it really makes the +5 DRM rather academic or superfluous as a concern.
 

bendizoid

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assault fire means it will probably be 2 FP because no matter how many times it is halved,(motion, riders, concealment, advancing fire) after you add one it still rounds up to the two table.
 
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Larry

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assault fire means it will probably be 2 FP because no matter how many times it is halved,(motion, riders, concealment, advancing fire) after you add one it rounds up to the two table.
Ask one question and learn two things. I would have never thought that assault fire applied to passengers or riders, but the rules apply the bonus to squads. Crazy game.
 

jrv

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Don't forget spray fire also, still 2 FP.
For riders this is not that great because they can't firegroup (unless you find your targets in open ground or perhaps woods/hedge), but for infantry, three 6-6-6es firing at a concealed target in the advance phase using spray fire would fire at six FP against two Locations (vs. nine FP against one Location). That could be interesting.

JR
 

bendizoid

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Ever play Smertniki ? Assault rider spray fire can be awesome. If there is a -1 or -2 leader also then it really looks good.
 

von Marwitz

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For riders this is not that great because they can't firegroup (unless you find your targets in open ground or perhaps woods/hedge), but for infantry, three 6-6-6es firing at a concealed target in the advance phase using spray fire would fire at six FP against two Locations (vs. nine FP against one Location). That could be interesting.

JR
Especially with a good leader directing. His leadership would apply to both hexes attacked by (assault) Spraying Fire.

von Marwitz
 

jrv

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Especially with a good leader directing. His leadership would apply to both hexes attacked by (assault) Spraying Fire.
While what you say is true, I don't think I would have a stack of three squads (or leaders for all three units) when firing in the AFPh often, especially with American 6-6-6es. It might happen if my opponent fired all his DFF at other units or if I had 8 ML units (e.g. Suicide Creek), but it will be a specialty situation rather than every day. It would be a good day when it happened.

JR
 

von Marwitz

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While what you say is true, I don't think I would have a stack of three squads (or leaders for all three units) when firing in the AFPh often, especially with American 6-6-6es. It might happen if my opponent fired all his DFF at other units or if I had 8 ML units (e.g. Suicide Creek), but it will be a specialty situation rather than every day. It would be a good day when it happened.

JR
It is indeed rather rare. The good thing with Assault Fire by US units is that it usually has quite some reach (6 hexes). If the stack assembles during the MPh in good TEM and the enemy maybe only has a regular range of 4 or less, then the risk can be worthwhile.

von Marwitz
 

GeorgeBates

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For riders this is not that great because they can't firegroup (unless you find your targets in open ground or perhaps woods/hedge), but for infantry, three 6-6-6es firing at a concealed target in the advance phase using spray fire would fire at six FP against two Locations (vs. nine FP against one Location). That could be interesting.JR
I think you meant something else here, since US 6-6-6s only have assault fire, not spray fire. Soviet 6-2-8s, or 1944+ SS 6-5-8s, perhaps?
 
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