Bullethead
Storm Eagle Studios
That would be the "Concrete Battleship" guarding the entrance to Manilla Bay: Fort Drum. She's still "afloat", although rather the worse for wear. IIRC, she was also the only "battleship" assaulted with siege towers.
Quiet here...
- Thread starter HMSWarspite
- Start date
Saint Istvan
Member
Yes, it's Fort Drum, and if you google "concrete battleship" there is some video footage on Youtube, taken in the last few years. A long time ago I bought a book by Francis J. Allen called "The Concrete Battleship" and there is a photograph in there showing troops going aboard from a siege tower. Over to you for the next question.
Bullethead
Storm Eagle Studios
OK, here's a multi-part question:
1. What is this?
2. Where is it?
3. Where did it come from?
4. How is this commemorated?
1. What is this?
2. Where is it?
3. Where did it come from?
4. How is this commemorated?
Doddleson
Recruit
To quote the following website: http://www.robmilne.com/?q=node/33
"This is a 4.7 inch naval gun, a number of which were taken off British warships in Durban harbor shortly after the outbreak of war. They played a crucial role in the defence of Ladysmith during its siege however, when the sailors ran out of ammunition for their guns during the siege, they were put on temporary latrine duty. They appropriately named their two latrine carts after their ships, "The Powerful" and "The Terrible." "
It is at a gun position at Greylingstad Kopjie from the Second Anglo-Boer War.
No idea how is commemorated though.
It is the 24th and I am patiently waiting for the bloody game!
"This is a 4.7 inch naval gun, a number of which were taken off British warships in Durban harbor shortly after the outbreak of war. They played a crucial role in the defence of Ladysmith during its siege however, when the sailors ran out of ammunition for their guns during the siege, they were put on temporary latrine duty. They appropriately named their two latrine carts after their ships, "The Powerful" and "The Terrible." "
It is at a gun position at Greylingstad Kopjie from the Second Anglo-Boer War.
No idea how is commemorated though.
It is the 24th and I am patiently waiting for the bloody game!
Bullethead
Storm Eagle Studios
Welcome aboard, Doddleson! New guy buys the drinks :toast: OK, you've been lurking for years but it's still your 1st post 
You got the "Where did it come from?" part correct (HMS Powerful or Terrible, nobody's now sure which). And yes, this has something to do with the Siege of Ladysmith. But otherwise incorrect.
Close but no cigar, I'm afraid.
You got the "Where did it come from?" part correct (HMS Powerful or Terrible, nobody's now sure which). And yes, this has something to do with the Siege of Ladysmith. But otherwise incorrect.
Soon, soon
saddletank
Forum Conscript
I'm amazed, for such a puny gun carriage that is one fricking big gun!
Paladin851
Member
I believe that is what was referred to as a long 12 ...QF 12 pounder (12cwt) . As to the rest of the question .....no clue.
Bullethead
Storm Eagle Studios
It is indeed a 12-pdr and "long" in the parlance of the time, so I'll give you the "What is this?" part. It was actually called the 12-pdr 18-cwt QF MK I. It is not to be confused with the 12-pdr 8-cwt, which was a designed-for-the-purpose landing gun. It probably came from HMS Terrible, but perhaps her sister Powerful. It saw action during the Siege of Ladysmith, crewed by RN gunners.
Interestingly, Percy Scott, the skipper of HMS Terrible at the time, was a prophet of improving naval gunnery and his efforts played a part in WW1 fire control. Besides that, he himself designed the gun carriage shown in the photo.
Anyway, we've got the "what" and "where from" parts of the question. We've got Ladysmith as a hint to the "where". The main outstanding issue is, "how is this commemorated?" And the answer to that will answer the "where" part, too.
Bullethead
Storm Eagle Studios
HINT: Various aspects of the Siege of Ladysmith are commemorated annually by several races where teams of insane people perform highly dangerous stunts with artillery pieces. Very entertaining.
Saint Istvan
Member
That will be the Royal Tournament where teams from Devenport, Portsmouth and the Royal Marines take part in the Gun Race. It is certainly a sight to behold and, in these days of Health and Safety mania, I'm surprised it is still allowed. I believe it was dropped several years ago, but has thankfully been restored to the tournament. It used to be held in Earl's Court in London, but I am not sure if it is now held somewhere else.
Bullethead
Storm Eagle Studios
Close but again no cigar. There are several such things. The Royal Tournament Gun Race isn't the one I'm looking for because it uses the landing gun 12pdr 8-cwt, which was designed for this sort of madness. The event I'm interested in, which will also tell where the photo was taken, uses the 12dpr 18-cwt on its Scott-designed field carriage, an altogether more difficult beast to juggle :smoke:
Bullethead
Storm Eagle Studios
HINT 2: The event commemorating this gun takes place in South Africa, on the actual site of the wartime exploit.
Bullethead
Storm Eagle Studios
HINT 3: The event in question had to do with an unsuccessful attempt to relieve Ladysmith. IOW, the guns weren't part of the garrison.
saddletank
Forum Conscript
Found it. It's a recent event that was first held four years ago and is now an annual event as part of the Ladysmith Siege Weekend that commemorates the 118 day siege during the Boer War.
An event that is part of the weekend is the Swartkop Challenge where military teams challenge each other with artillery guns on Wagon Hill. Each team, physically pushes a 1,500kg artillery piece up a 130 metre hill and the first team to reach the top fires the canon to win.
Only human power is used to push the guns because in the siege the hills were too steep for horses or draft oxen to haul the guns up.
An event that is part of the weekend is the Swartkop Challenge where military teams challenge each other with artillery guns on Wagon Hill. Each team, physically pushes a 1,500kg artillery piece up a 130 metre hill and the first team to reach the top fires the canon to win.
Only human power is used to push the guns because in the siege the hills were too steep for horses or draft oxen to haul the guns up.
Last edited:
Bullethead
Storm Eagle Studios
Correct you are, sir. Over to you.
On a personal note, I'd love to see and perhaps participate in the Swartkop Challenge. The 12pdr 18-cwt is a fine old gun from my favorite naval era, I'm a fan of Percy Scott, and I had to drag a few cannon over mountains in my day, just because the brass wanted to be entertained.
On a personal note, I'd love to see and perhaps participate in the Swartkop Challenge. The 12pdr 18-cwt is a fine old gun from my favorite naval era, I'm a fan of Percy Scott, and I had to drag a few cannon over mountains in my day, just because the brass wanted to be entertained
.saddletank
Forum Conscript
I was surprised and pleased to see that in recent years historians identified the actual track up the hill that the guns were dragged and the event takes place over the exact same ground.
Anyway...
This ought to be ridiculously easy, though you never know...
Two events. They are linked. What are they (and thus what is the link?)
Anyway...
This ought to be ridiculously easy, though you never know...
Two events. They are linked. What are they (and thus what is the link?)
Bullethead
Storm Eagle Studios
I'm asking, "Where is the link?" As in the one to see full-size versions of these thumbnails :laugh:
But you know, I think I can answer the question as-is, because I actually almost asked it myself instead of the one about the Swartkop Challenge. Great minds think alike :smoke: While looking through my collection of photos thinking of a question, I was struck by the similarity of 2 of them.
Last edited:
saddletank
Forum Conscript
You are probably right so maybe you should be excluded from answering! Hehehe. And yes the 'link' works on several levels, not least the photographic record.
BTW, those are not thumbnails, they are the full sized images, I just cropped them severely because more info in the image would make it too easy I think!
BTW, those are not thumbnails, they are the full sized images, I just cropped them severely because more info in the image would make it too easy I think!
rubberboot
Member
sinkings of the sister ships SMS Viribus Unitus and SMS Saint Istivan? both capsized, both sunk by the Italians?
saddletank
Forum Conscript
Nope! Try again.