PROBLEM - Units appearing behind enemy lines...

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Russian units often pop up behind German lines - not good. The Russian player needs them where he can deploy AND it's not realistic - army groups popping up in conquered territory.

To compensate, the Russian player has had to disband all such units which he can sorely afford...

ALSO - After Yugoslavia is conquered, regular Yugoslav army units pop up there as well. Only Partisans should be appearing after surrender.

Same here - those regular army units have to be disbanded.

Would love to see these glitches fixed!
 

Dan Neely

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Killorbekilled said:
Russian units often pop up behind German lines - not good. The Russian player needs them where he can deploy AND it's not realistic - army groups popping up in conquered territory.

To compensate, the Russian player has had to disband all such units which he can sorely afford...
The german player needs to secure and garrison his rear. Regular (non guerilla) units will only enter in friendly held territory, so if you keep the geruillas down and occupy the entry sites none of the units will enter. Units without a fixed entry location will enter at one of thier formation objectives. IF available they'll always pick a friendly held one, so unless the germans are ignoring their rear the only units stuck will be ones overran while in the process of reconstituting.

ALSO - After Yugoslavia is conquered, regular Yugoslav army units pop up there as well. Only Partisans should be appearing after surrender.

Same here - those regular army units have to be disbanded.

Would love to see these glitches fixed!
Regular units of all countries may appear after the main army is surrendered. This is a bug in the game engine and not something that can be fixed by scenario designers. Units in the middle of the reconstitution process are sometimes passed over by withdraw orders.
 
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Ok fair enough for Russia - German must occupy each and every hex... And then must mop up after Partisans take hexes behind lines.

But what to do then in Yugoslavia where you have regular army popping up on German hexes (I believe) as well as enemy territory?

Anyone?
 

Mantis

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Killorbekilled said:
Ok fair enough for Russia - German must occupy each and every hex... And then must mop up after Partisans take hexes behind lines.

But what to do then in Yugoslavia where you have regular army popping up on German hexes (I believe) as well as enemy territory?

Anyone?
I have a very similar situation in an EA game with Viri. I had 2 Yugo corps and two Greek corps reconstitute. My problem was he was wiping them out over and over again, which can drain you beyond belief in rifle squads. (Free kills). His problem was that there are constantly 4 corps coming back. What we did was Viri agree to let me have safe passage to a port, and I left the country, but in return, I can only use those troops for garrison duty. A fair trade, I think.

IF you can get the troops out by yourself, however, you're free to do whatever you'd like with them. This was just an agreement. On a similar note, some players I've heard of get sick of messing around in Yugo all the time, and agree to simply 'guard' each other. All that partisans go sit somewhere out of the way, and are guarded by a certain amount of Axis troops. These forces are considered to be balancing each other - so they just sit there, side by side, not attacking, and everyone's happy. The Allied player is not losing hundreds and hundreds of squads, and the German play doesn't have to endlessly chase the little buggers all over the countryside.
 

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It may be possible elminate most behind the line replacement popups - the second time around after the trigger is pulled - but the trigger should be in Russia - after Axis/Russia war. With Russia it would consume 4 (max) events and would be global for all countries desired. OR just one.

Axis occuppy Minsk
Set objective track 2
Axis occupy Vyazma
Set objective track 3
KEY is to have a new and safe objective 1 in your friendly territory

Poland, Russia and maybe Yugo are probably the practical limits.

If for individual countries, 3 additional events per country is not practical.

--

An alternative using the Set Track events in a loop could make Guerilla war in Yugo (with some more units) interesting.

--

Understand it would be one or the other above - not both.

Need to specifically test this, but some previouse game testing on other subjects appears to indicate the theory is solid.

Since I do NOT have the time - anyone want to run the tests and let us know if the above works.
 

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I can only second Chris´wish to make russian regular forces reconstitute behind friendly lines!
I´m the Allies in our game and at first i enjoyed seeing those units, because for some time i could disrupt his supply and force him to withdraw units to hunt me down, but after a short while he had the "pop-up"places surrounded and fresh units came up there totally encircled and out of supply. I either lost them in suicide attacks to break out or he was able to wipe them out fast.
Up to now ( spring ´41) i´ve lost well over 20 Corps this way, and was forced to keep the flanks of my main defence uncovered. Most likely, that has cost me the game as well. :dead:
 

Mark Stevens

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Maybe the initial Russian forces - the ones that are set to reconstitute in the large western cities, not the masses of reinforcements that appear following 'Barbarossa' - should be reset to appear in the cities further east? Or perhaps recoloured and not be set to reconstitute at all?

+ you wouldn't get them popping up in Kiev & etc due to guerilla action
+ the more of them the Germans kill the weaker the Red Army will be for the future

- if their reconstitution points are moved further east what does the Axis player gain by advancing into the western USSR - he'll still eventually face the entire initial army plus the hordes of reinforcements?* At present, the further east the Germans advance the more of the reconstitution cities will be overrun and the Red Army units set to reappear there, won't (unless those guerillas convert the hexes back to Allies control)
- making the initial army non-reconstituting will greatly weaken the Red Army for the rest of the war: if the general opinion is that it is already too easy for the Germans to win in Russia, this just makes things worst.

*Except for the initial mechanised corps which aren't set to reconstitute, but see the famous 'reconstitution loop'

:confused:
 

Karri

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I have a greek Corps popping up in Greece, althought Greece has already surrendered...
 

Mantis

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Reconstitution loop.

The unit in question was destroyed, and in the process of reconstituting, when the Greek surrendered. When a nation surrenders, there is an event that withdraws all their forces. However, units in the Greek (or any) OOB that are in the process of reconstituting when this event is triggered are not affected, and still show up as reinforcements afterwards.
 

Bdr.Mallette

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hey,

KillorbeKilled,

we had made an agreement, that if units persisted on appearing behind German lines, that you would disband them and I would do the same. It's getting close to the point of not meaning anything, hopefully...heh, but still... you never know, this could happen to the Russkies... maybe not though.
It's just hard to imagine a full russian division popping up beside Kharkov, then me chasing it all around a 500 sq/km area till it disbands or evaporates.
sorry man to be such a stickler but it should be alright now, i've moved reinforcements to cover any gains your new units may make.

no probs mon!

bdr
 

Mantis

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IIRC, there's a problem with that as well. If he appears out of supply, and disbands the unit, doesn't he permanently lose all those squads? This is worse than you just killing him all the time, as at least that way you lose something too.
 

Bdr.Mallette

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hmmm,
true enough.

Killorbekilled,

you decide and reply next turn sent.

turn 158.
Moscow surrounded and German units in Holland pushing Allies out, hopefully?!


bdr.
 

Mantis

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If you ensure that there are no hexes behind your front line that are still in enemy hands, these situations will also crop up far less frequently.
 
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