Problem matching DEM/xdm Map to Paper Map

hueglin

Recruit
Joined
Jan 31, 2006
Messages
23
Reaction score
0
Location
Kingston, ON
Country
llCanada
As the title says, I have a DEM and xdm map and a corresponding paper map. I have followed the tutorial as closely as I can and am obviously inputting some of the map data incorrectly, as there is no map generated (and no green rectangle in the preview screen).

I have been able to generate a game map by going with the default data entry and continuing through the map creation process. It generates a map of the bottom left portion of the original xdm map.

So I am assuming that some of the data I am transferring from the paper map is being input incorrectly by me.

The problem seems to be the longitude. The longitude of the bottom left corner of the map I am using (031C_0100_DEME) is 77 degrees West which according to the instructions should equate to 77x3600 or -277200, but the figure you get from the Map Production Information dialogue box is 77200.

I can't figure out how the program is generating the 77200. Simply going (degrees x 3600 - 200,000) does not give an accurate conversion for, say 76 degrees.

Are there any other resources available to assist in getting he data from the map.

Any ideas or suggestions are most welcome.
 

junk2drive

Member
Joined
Feb 18, 2005
Messages
897
Reaction score
7
Location
Arizona West Coast
I've meddled with DEMs and these tools but not for this game. I'll give you some generic answers. When I go to the website to download a DEM, clicking the correct map square gives me a DEM for the next square over. I've had to figure out the incorrect square to click to get the correct DEM.

The other problem that I had with TDRs tools was that I did not have Microsoft Visual installed. I don't remember now which version fixed it.
 

hueglin

Recruit
Joined
Jan 31, 2006
Messages
23
Reaction score
0
Location
Kingston, ON
Country
llCanada
Thanks for the quick reply.

I can tell from looking at the map in the Microdem converter that I have the correct DEM. It just seems like the ATF Power Toolkit is not reading all of the data on the DEM and/or xdm map correctly, or is somehow converting it to some different format. The latitude matches up correctly, but the longitude and the UTM references are off from what they should be.

Therefore, inputting the correct data to "cut out" a portion of the bigger ma,p to make a game ma,p does not work. There does not seem to be an obvious reason for why the ATF Power Toolkit is getting the data it is getting.
 

TDR

Member
Joined
Nov 14, 2005
Messages
263
Reaction score
0
Location
Australia
Country
llAustralia
Are you using a map input that is 1 degree x 1 degree in size?

Junk2Drive the required DLL for the tools I made is msvcp71.dll

Attached is a zip, ( hope of this dll).
 

hueglin

Recruit
Joined
Jan 31, 2006
Messages
23
Reaction score
0
Location
Kingston, ON
Country
llCanada
Yes, it is 1 degree x 1 degree. The map is 031C_0100_DEME.DEM obtained from this site:
http://www.geobase.ca/geobase/en/browse.do?produit=cded&decoupage=250k&map=031

Just to see if it was a problem with the longitude in the western hemisphere, I did download a map from Italy and got the same problem with the longitude reading in the Power Toolkit being mismatched with the original DEM reading.
 
Last edited:

TDR

Member
Joined
Nov 14, 2005
Messages
263
Reaction score
0
Location
Australia
Country
llAustralia
Got the map, I gather you used the 1:250,000 data set.
Just remembered I have not loaded all my mapping software or ATF games up on to the new computer. Give me a day to get sorted.
 

hueglin

Recruit
Joined
Jan 31, 2006
Messages
23
Reaction score
0
Location
Kingston, ON
Country
llCanada
Yes, I used the 1:250,000 after trying the 1:50,000, which would not work (can't remember what the exact problem was).

Once again, thanks for your interest and help!

Dave
 

TDR

Member
Joined
Nov 14, 2005
Messages
263
Reaction score
0
Location
Australia
Country
llAustralia
This seems to give some indication:

The problem seems to be the longitude. The longitude of the bottom left corner of the map I am using (031C_0100_DEME) is 77 degrees West which according to the instructions should equate to 77x3600 or -277200, but the figure you get from the Map Production Information dialogue box is 77200.

The fact you are getting a positive value in the Production Information window.

When you use Demcon make sure that you are saving it with the correct lat and Long.

Demcon will unfortunately give you a long that is positive ie and easting.

check the red box area in attached picture.
If the lat and long are not correct use the button, outlined in green to make the changes.

I have loaded the map data and got the necessary map. Though I will admit the powertool kit is a bit sensitive.
 

TDR

Member
Joined
Nov 14, 2005
Messages
263
Reaction score
0
Location
Australia
Country
llAustralia
I have managed to make the necessary xdm file but it is too big to upload here.

I can split it into 2 pieces so long as you are able to rebuild the initial zip file from the 2 parts..
 

hueglin

Recruit
Joined
Jan 31, 2006
Messages
23
Reaction score
0
Location
Kingston, ON
Country
llCanada
Thanks for your solutions. It never occurred to me that it would be Demcon that was making the mistake! I have been using Microdem, which I gather is pretty much the same program. For the xdm files, would I be able merge them using Microdem, or would I need a different program?
 

TDR

Member
Joined
Nov 14, 2005
Messages
263
Reaction score
0
Location
Australia
Country
llAustralia
Thanks for your solutions. It never occurred to me that it would be Demcon that was making the mistake! I have been using Microdem, which I gather is pretty much the same program. For the xdm files, would I be able merge them using Microdem, or would I need a different program?
The theory is that Microdem and Demcon are the same in this area. Unfortunately I have found that it just aint so. For the ATF/AATF mapping Demcon is the better of the two.

In the document Creating a map from SRTM data it uses Demcon not Microdem.

So see how it goes. Also follow that outline by Black Russian.
 

hueglin

Recruit
Joined
Jan 31, 2006
Messages
23
Reaction score
0
Location
Kingston, ON
Country
llCanada
OK. I have it kind of working. I am following Drunk Russian's tutorial and using Demcon. I have only one question (for now). The tutorial asks you to choose: Import/ASCII ArcGrid. Somewhere along my muddling I managed to create a map file saved as .ASC. I can't remember how I got it though!

How do you get the DEM file to an .ASC file, or alternately, what menu item do you choose to directly import the DEM file?
 

TDR

Member
Joined
Nov 14, 2005
Messages
263
Reaction score
0
Location
Australia
Country
llAustralia
The asc file is created in the program VTBuilder assuming you are using this.
This is imported into Demcon via the import menu. At the bottom of that menu is ASCII Arc grid.

Also don't use Microdem to do the conversion from your original dem to the ascii arc dem, i.e. the file .asc.
Microdem is great to display the terrain but not that good for this work.


Loks like Dark Russian's tut need more detail.....

Sorry I am a bit slow here switching from mac to virtual PC and trying to send/view via both at the same time. I am getting a bit tied up with the different keyboard key sets


Ok to make the asc file this is covered in pages 2-5 of the DR tut doc.
 

TDR

Member
Joined
Nov 14, 2005
Messages
263
Reaction score
0
Location
Australia
Country
llAustralia
If you are having a few problems with Dark Russian's Map outline let me know and then give me a week or two to add a bit more to the original document to cover menus etc. Old age and medical are all catching up so I am out of town for a while anyway.

His document does cover it but at some points its a bit sketchy.
 

hueglin

Recruit
Joined
Jan 31, 2006
Messages
23
Reaction score
0
Location
Kingston, ON
Country
llCanada
After much help from TDR, I was able to import the correct map lined up in the correct manner. Here is a summary of what I have learned (I don't think any important steps are missing).

Mini-tutorial on converting DEM map fo use in ATF

1. Open program = VTP - Virtual Terrain Builder (available at vterrain.org)

layer - import data - elevation (choose your .dem file)

elevation - export to - ArcInfo ASCII Grid (save as a .asc file)

2. Open program = Demcon (available with ATF games)

import - ASCII ArcGrid (open your .asc file)

utm data? = no

multiplier? = 1

change E to W or N to S if necessary

feet input = no

click to close new .dem (this is a .dem file that Power Toolkit cannot read properly)

3. Still in Demcon

export - dem - USGS ASCII format (choose .dem file from above, then save with distinguishing name)

4. Open program = Power Toolkit

follow tutorial in Power Toolkit manual to convert dem into map files (another 3+ steps!)
 

TDR

Member
Joined
Nov 14, 2005
Messages
263
Reaction score
0
Location
Australia
Country
llAustralia
And you are just on the bottom of the map making learning curve. There is more to climb yet:laugh:
 
Top