Prisoners AGAIN
- Thread starter Stewart
- Start date
Sparafucil3
Forum Guru
In the captor's Location. -- jim
klasmalmstrom
Forum Guru
Old (official) 1st Edition Q&A:
A20.21 If the only possible guarding unit is too small to guard all of a surrendering stack (e.g., 2
broken squads surrendering to a SMC), what happens to the "excess" surrendering units?
A. Once all surrendering units in the Location have been accepted, the guarding player decides
which units (within his means) he will guard. The remaining unarmed units are under the control of
the opposing player. See A20.5. [J1]
A20.21 If the only possible guarding unit is too small to guard all of a surrendering stack (e.g., 2
broken squads surrendering to a SMC), what happens to the "excess" surrendering units?
A. Once all surrendering units in the Location have been accepted, the guarding player decides
which units (within his means) he will guard. The remaining unarmed units are under the control of
the opposing player. See A20.5. [J1]
But where are they? In the hex originally or?
IF they can't take the units, do the units move into the hex with the NON Capturing Guard?
Seems silly if they are freed why wouldn't they just run from their original location?
Sort of DROP their guns and flee!! makes sense, Not sure why the surrendering player would benefit from units giving up as the rules suggest. There wouldn't ever be a reason for the UNARMED units EVER to leave that location...In essence it forces the guard to leave or be punished.
Would seem really dumb if the guard would have to leave a fortified location to "run away " from unarmed units. The unarmed unit may not ENTER an enemy location, ONLY upon not being guarded. Seems contradictory to the rule....
Prisoner rules need some work and not sure why these little bits aren't cleaned up.
Heard some REALLY good players came up with resolutions...but I'm not aware of their details.
IF they can't take the units, do the units move into the hex with the NON Capturing Guard?
Seems silly if they are freed why wouldn't they just run from their original location?
Sort of DROP their guns and flee!! makes sense, Not sure why the surrendering player would benefit from units giving up as the rules suggest. There wouldn't ever be a reason for the UNARMED units EVER to leave that location...In essence it forces the guard to leave or be punished.
Would seem really dumb if the guard would have to leave a fortified location to "run away " from unarmed units. The unarmed unit may not ENTER an enemy location, ONLY upon not being guarded. Seems contradictory to the rule....
Prisoner rules need some work and not sure why these little bits aren't cleaned up.
Heard some REALLY good players came up with resolutions...but I'm not aware of their details.
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Sparafucil3
Forum Guru
So what do the rules say? The say the units rout as a group to their captor. So they are in the Location with their captor. That's what it means when the Q&A says "Once all surrendering units in the Location have been accepted, the guarding player decides which units (within his means) he will guard." And thanks for calling me "Good".
-- jim
Doug Leslie
Elder Member
Surely the unarmed units don't affect the guard at all? If they don't leave, how does their presence in the hex "punish" the guard?
Sparafucil3
Forum Guru
To understand the question, you have to pull together several threads from different on-line Locations. The guards are "punished" because the newly freed Prisoners inflict Target Selection Limits.
IMO, this boils down to one of two things:
- Poor planning on the part of the captor, Why is he putting himself in this position? It's a tough lesson to learn but life teaches best.
- Something which while possible, is so unlikely to happen that this is all just an exercise in "what-if"
-- jim
klasmalmstrom
Forum Guru
Of course the Guards would most likely not be able to shoot anyway - since if take as many Prisoners as they can and there are some that are "Freed", A20.52 will kick in anyway....so that "penalty" is sort of a non-issue right after the surrender.
20.52 GUARD FP: A Guard whose US# is < the total US# of its prisoners may not attack any unit other than its prisoners except in CC and may not use a SW, Interdict, or Kindle. A Guard’s FP is halved for attack (but not defense) purposes when attacking non-prisoners in CC.
Sparafucil3
Forum Guru
I know that. I don't want to confuse the issue further.
-- jimKinda weird how unarmed units can't ENTER an enemy units location, but can stay in the location if set free.
Do you see an issue with the rules here?
Why would they surrender and just "stick around"? They'd toss their weapons down and run...
But yeah guard has no fp anyway.
Sparafucil3
Forum Guru
There is a difference between Unarmed Units and Prisoners. This has been discussed with you before. They ENTER the location as Prisoners. Once there, the capturing unit elected to not Guard them, returning the unit to the control of the other side where they transitioned to Unarmed Units again. This distinction is a hard one to get through but is key to understanding the whole section. -- jim
Doug Leslie
Elder Member
They wouldn't stick around if they had any sense. Once the guard declined to keep or shoot them, the sensible thing to do would be to leave the vicinity before the guard's colleagues arrived. It doesn't affect the guard one way or the other what they do however.