PDB - suggestions - FFL Amatola SA 05 (ID: 937)

JanMasterson

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hello pooners,

here are some suggestions about the South African Navy's Valour class frigates for PlayersDB 7.4.7:

- it's crew is 92 plus 20 spare;

- "The sea-keeping capabilities of the A-200 allow effective weapon engagement and helicopter operation including sea state 6.";

- "(...)vital and hazardous areas (...)" are protected by "(...)special Kevlar and Ceramic combination system that is bolted to the inner side of the ships shell(...);

- it have a "Dual or Triple Stabilizers";

- it have a very reduced signature in Magnetic, Radar, Acoustic and Infra Red spectres ("A reduction of about 75% on the ship's infrared signature has been achieved by elimination of the funnel" and a "radar signature of a vessel half its size" are claimed by designers along pther Underwater Noise Reduction measure usually more common aboard submarines than surface vessels);

- it's landing deck and hangar is able to accomodate a 10 t (medium) or two 5t (light) helicopter for day and night operation (here's an Oryx aboard SAS Amatola);



- it's different mode ("throttle") are the following:

Mode IV, loitering mode (Gas Turbine and waterjet) allow a max speed of 23 knots;

Mode I , economic mode ("for long distance cruising" with one diesel) allow a max speed of 18 knots;

Mode II, manoeuvre mode (the two diesels are running) allow a max speed of 23 knots;

Mode III, WARP mode (the two diesils and the waterjet are running) allow a max speed of "well above 27 knots" (some sources are reporting ">29" and "30 knots" is often seen in the SAN news);


- it's max endurance is about 7,700 nm (seen more often than 7500 or 8000nm) at 16 knots (45 day unreplenished endurance);

- it have two MM-40 block 2 Exocet quad launchers;

- the VLS have 32 cells. It's said that it's filled with only 16 Umkhonto and that the 16 others can be fitted in two hours (below is the SAS Mendi at Kiel with the VLS well visible) ;



- as far as i know, it's unsure that the torpedo tubes are not actually fitted, what is sure is that torpedoes are not yet in the inventory and will be build "on teh shelf" when needed

Sources:
http://navy.org.za/pages/valour
http://navy.org.za/files/BV-SAN-Corvette-Yachts.pdf
http://navy.org.za/files/BV-MEKO-Flyer.pdf
http://navy.org.za/articles/tag/mekoa200
http://united-states-navy.com/specials/baltops/2004/south-africa.htm
http://www.navy.mil.za/equipment/valour.htm
http://www.naval-technology.com/projects/meko/
http://navalpowercb.blogspot.com/2006/06/meko-200-san-uma-fragata-alem-servio.html
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Valour_class_frigate
http://www.harpoonhq.com/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?p=8175#8175

JFS 16-Aug-2004 *South Africa/FRIGATES/VALOUR CLASS (MEKO A-200 TYPE) (FFGHM)

cheers,

Jan
 
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Herman Hum

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Interesting stuff. Thanks for putting it up. Adjustments have been made to the PlayersDB.

That's a great photo. What are you suggesting about the 32-cell VLS system? Are you saying that the ship normally sails with only 16 Umkhonto SAMs and only loads the other 16 in wartime conditions?

Are you suggesting that something else might be carried in the other 16 cells? Or would they get an additional 16 Umkhonto?
 

JanMasterson

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hey Herman,

you are welcome, the adjustments won't be done for nothing ;)

about the VLS, what admiral Retief said is suggesting that if something serious is planned, it could be filled fast so my interpretation is that the system is only at half of it's capacity to allow the crew to train efficiently at controlled costs.

from Janes NI (quoted by Danrhayes where-you-know):
There is significant further growth potential designed into the vessels and,
according to Adm Retief, there are space and weight considerations built in
for land attack missiles, torpedoes and a passive towed array. The SAM
battery can also be boosted and there is space for longer-range SAMs, he
adds. Adm Kamerman explains that the number of Umkhonto SAMs can be doubled from 16 to 32 missiles in two hours, (...)
now what i myself suggesting is to have in the DB a "peacetime" version without topedoes and half filled VLS, and a fully armed "wartime" version.

It would allow scen creator to easily have both configuration at disposal.

PS: about the torpedo, i don't know wich one will be used even if i guess that it will be the Mk46Mod5 or the MU90

cheers,

Jan
 

Herman Hum

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Okay, the VLS will be enlarged to carry 32 weapons, but only loaded with 16. This way, a designer can add the additional 16 at his discretion.

The ship in the PlayersDB doesn't currently have any torpedo tubes. Are you suggesting that we add a pair of mounts that are normally empty? (One firing to port and one firing to starboard?) Then the designer can do the same thing and just load them with either Mk46 or MU-90?

Is this what you want/need? or do you just want to select them to be loaded with a designated loadout of Mk46/MU-90?

Would the mounts be single, dual, triple, or quad tubes?
 

JanMasterson

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the torpedo tubes are 2x twin tubes (four tubes in total, a pair directed to port, a pair directed to starboard).

about the torpedo, i don't understand the differences between your two propositions but if you can, it would be better to let the designer decide wich type to be used.

cheers,

Jan
 
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Herman Hum

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Allow me to clarify about the torpedo tubes. We could put in a pair of empty twin mounts (one firing in each of the arcs you described).

These tubes would have spaces allocated that allow the scenario designer to load them with either Mk46 or MU-90 torpedoes, but the default loadout would be "empty". Therefore, if the designer does nothing, they start unloaded/empty.

Unless that is exactly what you want, I would prefer that we not do it that way.

Normally, mounts are pre-loaded with a specific weapon. I think that this is generally more prudent so that a designer doesn't accidentally send a ship off to war without any weapons. If possible, could you please specify which weapon you would like to have in the mount. This way, the onus is on the scenario designer to remove weapons if he wants to simulate a peacetime loadout.
 

JanMasterson

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thanks for the clarifications Herman,

the second solution sounds not that bad, for exemple the mount "324mm Mk32 Twin|MU-90" (id.1011) would be perfect.

(by the way, the "Sachsen Type 124 DE 06", id.1236, have no spare torpedos in her mags, the "Sachsen Type 124 DE 05", id. 587, have "Mk46 NEARTIP Magazine (12) v0")

for her text, there lot of material on the pages linked in the first post.

cheers,

Jan
 

JanMasterson

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good morning Herman,

i forgot to mention the hull names:

F145 Amatola (Commissioned: 16 February 2006 )
F146 Isandlwana (Commissioned: 20 July 2006 )
F147 Spionkop (Commissioned: 16 February 2007 )
F148 Mendi (Commissioned: 20 March 2007 )

if you don't mind i would like to have it's engine and fuel load as following :

propulsion Amatola v0 (1323):

Creep: 8 knots
Cruise: 16 knots
Full: 23 knots
Flank: 33 knots

and about her fuel load:

Diesel Fuel x 87 v0 (id 628)

it result to have a range at 16 knots of 7700 nm rather than 7177 nm.


did you changed something in the cross section ?

PS: found this morning that it also have a RTS 6400 (id 1607) FC radar and an U/W Telephone v0 (id 41)

cheers,

Jan
 
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Herman Hum

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This platform has been built as requested to these specifications and added to the PlayersDB released July 7, 2007.
 
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