Missed Opportunity?

[BattleSchool]

While reorganizing my counters, it struck me that the SS 6-5-8 squads released with Festung Budapest (FB) do have not underscored FP.

Given that the SS have Assault Fire at this time of the war, was any thought given to modifying these counters in order to provide players with more appropriate 6-5-8 squads?

I realize that in some cases there would not be enough of these late-war SS 6-5-8s for a CG. However, there would be enough to play each of the scenarios in FB. More importantly, these modified squads would have been useful for a host of other late-war scenarios.

It turns out that after my recent reorg, I now have a couple of spare compartments for late-war 6-5-8s.

Pity.

P.S. Lest I seem ungrateful, many thanks for the other SS squads (8-3-8 AE, 8-3-8, 5-4-8, and 4-4-7), and the Heer 8-3-8 AE that I lacked.

Perhaps in a future publication we can add 5-4-8 AE (SS and Heer), plus some late-war 6-5-8 for the obsessive organizer in me. :laugh:

 

[Kevin Kenneally]

While reorganizing my counters, it struck me that the SS 6-5-8 squads released with Festung Budapest (FB) do have not underscored FP.

Given that the SS have Assault Fire at this time of the war, was any thought given to modifying these counters in order to provide players with more appropriate 6-5-8 squads?

I realize that in some cases there would not be enough of these late-war SS 6-5-8s for a CG. However, there would be enough to play each of the scenarios in FB. More importantly, these modified squads would have been useful for a host of other late-war scenarios.

It turns out that after my recent reorg, I now have a couple of spare compartments for late-war 6-5-8s.

Pity.

P.S. Lest I seem ungrateful, many thanks for the other SS squads (8-3-8 AE, 8-3-8, 5-4-8, and 4-4-7), and the Heer 8-3-8 AE that I lacked.

Perhaps in a future publication we can add 5-4-8 AE (SS and Heer), plus some late-war 6-5-8 for the obsessive organizer in me. :laugh:

Chris,

I believe a AE in the German Heer color may be added to the Red October HASL, but do not see the SS being included into this module.

 

[Paul M. Weir]

I suppose the idea was allow maximum flexibility (in terms of use elsewhere) in the use of the FB included 658 and avoid any confusion that having 2 658 type counters might trigger. The AF rule in 44+ would still apply normally as part of the core rules

We have 2 flavours of AE Soviet 628 (VotG & FB), Hungarian 537 AE, Heer (VotG & FB) and SS 838 AE (FB). BFP have a few Heer 548 AE in CoS. I have for a long time felt that 548 AE are a better match to historical German AE than the 838 which is, I feel, a carry over of the SL era 838 big bad bogeyman idea.

I would not be surprised if MMP took the opportunity to add more AE in future HASL. Inclusion in the rare vehicles pack might be an idea for those that would be otherwise missed. I agree that it is good to have got the ones that we have. Though I am a complete counter slut, I am not worried about the lack of AF 658 SS, the rule is so simple and unlike 838 (AE and non-AE possibly together) it is not possible to have both AF and non-AF 658 in the same scenario.

 

[BattleSchool]

I suppose the idea was allow maximum flexibility (in terms of use elsewhere) in the use of the FB included 658 and avoid any confusion that having 2 658 type counters might trigger. The AF rule in 44+ would still apply normally as part of the core rules

We have 2 flavours of AE Soviet 628 (VotG & FB), Hungarian 537 AE, Heer (VotG & FB) and SS 838 AE (FB). BFP have a few Heer 548 AE in CoS. I have for a long time felt that 548 AE are a better match to historical German AE than the 838 which is, I feel, a carry over of the SL era 838 big bad bogeyman idea.

I would not be surprised if MMP took the opportunity to add more AE in future HASL. Inclusion in the rare vehicles pack might be an idea for those that would be otherwise missed. I agree that it is good to have got the ones that we have. Though I am a complete counter slut, I am not worried about the lack of AF 658 SS, the rule is so simple and unlike 838 (AE and non-AE possibly together) it is not possible to have both AF and non-AF 658 in the same scenario.

Good point. I had not considered that. In fact, years ago I may have questioned the need for specific AE counters.

H1.22 is not hard to remember. Although during a game, one can occasionally forget the bump on the SMOKE exponent.

But like I said, if MMP was going to print 26 6-5-8 squads anyway, it would have been nice to see the underscore added. I probably forget that a unit has Assault Fire during a game far more often than I forget that my 8-3-8 has a SMOKE exponent of 5. Just sayin'.

FWIW, I agree with your comment on the 5-4-8 AE. I would like to see them made available in the official counter mix. It would encourage their use by scenario designers (and force Olli to buy more Raaco).

 

[olli]

(and force Olli to buy more Raaco).

What are you infering Chris? I do not need any "forcing" lol

 

[witchbottles]

interesting tidbit for VASLrs. Boot up 5.9.3 load the Fb map and a 658, hit the tgoole on the 658 for AF capability, stack a 8-1 ldr on top and save the game. Load it in 5.9.2 and watch what ocurs. You will really see the noticeable effect if you conceal the stakc first, and put a 1st level counter under it. Then take the stack as a whole with the "floating" counters, move it to a new hex, and save in 5.9.2 Then re - boot into 5.9.3 and check it out.


the Disappearing / re appearing in a new location man trick is pretty cool.


KRL, Jon H

 

[dlazov]

I got VASL 5.10.0-beta to work (mostly) with VASSAL 3.2.4. The biggest issue I saw is the current boards I have work just fine in 5.9.3, but there are 5 to 8 of them that won't load in 3.2.4 engine. I'll investigate and see if I can't correct it. Then repost.

 

[footsteps]

While reorganizing my counters, it struck me that the SS 6-5-8 squads released with Festung Budapest (FB) do have not underscored FP.

Given that the SS have Assault Fire at this time of the war, was any thought given to modifying these counters in order to provide players with more appropriate 6-5-8 squads?

I realize that in some cases there would not be enough of these late-war SS 6-5-8s for a CG. However, there would be enough to play each of the scenarios in FB. More importantly, these modified squads would have been useful for a host of other late-war scenarios.

It turns out that after my recent reorg, I now have a couple of spare compartments for late-war 6-5-8s.

Pity.

P.S. Lest I seem ungrateful, many thanks for the other SS squads (8-3-8 AE, 8-3-8, 5-4-8, and 4-4-7), and the Heer 8-3-8 AE that I lacked.

Perhaps in a future publication we can add 5-4-8 AE (SS and Heer), plus some late-war 6-5-8 for the obsessive organizer in me. :laugh:

The National Capabilities Chart lists only the 6-5-8 and 4-6-8 as SS units. Are all German counters potentially SS counters? What's the reduction schedule for official SS counters?

 

[BattleSchool]

What are you infering Chris? I do not need any "forcing" lol

My bad, clearly intended to say "encourage."

 

[BattleSchool]

The National Capabilities Chart lists only the 6-5-8 and 4-6-8 as SS units. Are all German counters potentially SS counters? What's the reduction schedule for official SS counters?

For Festung Budapest it is:
6-5-8
5-4-8
4-4-7
4-3-6 (no longer SS)

and...
4-6-8
4-4-7
4-3-6 (no longer SS)

Note, ABTF also introduced "alternate" SS counters:
6-5-8
5-4-8
4-4-7
4-3-6 (no longer SS)

As I understand it, the National Capabilities Chart is being revamped. Expect to see an expanded chart with/following release of HP. I would be surprised if the chart did not follow the scheme used in FB for SS.

 

[klasmalmstrom]

As I understand it, the National Capabilities Chart is being revamped. Expect to see an expanded chart with/following release of HP. I would be surprised if the chart did not follow the scheme used in FB for SS.

I would only expect only counters found in core modules to be present on a NCC.

 

[witchbottles]

For Festung Budapest it is:
6-5-8
5-4-8
4-4-7
4-3-6 (no longer SS)

and...
4-6-8
4-4-7
4-3-6 (no longer SS)

Note, ABTF also introduced "alternate" SS counters:
6-5-8
5-4-8
4-4-7
4-3-6 (no longer SS)

As I understand it, the National Capabilities Chart is being revamped. Expect to see an expanded chart with/following release of HP. I would be surprised if the chart did not follow the scheme used in FB for SS.

This is important for scen designers as the ABtF does not have unit substitution for the 4-6-8 SS.

remember to choose the correct ref rule if you are including it in a design

KRL, jon H

 

[Bill Cirillo]

That would be my guess too.

I would only expect only counters found in core modules to be present on a NCC.

 

[Bill Cirillo]

Chris,

From my perspective this was more of a "road not taken" as opposed to a "missed opportunity". My desire was to make sure that everybody had enough "standard" quality counters to play the Fb scenarios and CGs without introducing a million new counters. One could reasonably argue that this seems kind of far-fetched given all of the other new types of counters that FB comes with, but I didn't even broach the idea of SS counters with an Assault Fire designation to MMP for not wanting to create "time-specific" versions of "standard" MMC counters.

I should also point out that it is a MMP policy not to use HASL specific counters in scenarios that are not specific to that HASL. So, for example, it is my understanding that you will never see a FB Arrowcross or 13th Panzer counter graphic in a non-FB designated scneario as a matter of MMP practice.

So, if a non-FB or Non-ABtF MMP scenario has 5-4-8 SS units, the scenario graphic for this particular MMC will be the standard 5-4-8 non-SS with the circled E and an SSR designating them as SS.

At least that is my understanding from having gone through the FB development activity.

Bill

While reorganizing my counters, it struck me that the SS 6-5-8 squads released with Festung Budapest (FB) do have not underscored FP.

Given that the SS have Assault Fire at this time of the war, was any thought given to modifying these counters in order to provide players with more appropriate 6-5-8 squads?

I realize that in some cases there would not be enough of these late-war SS 6-5-8s for a CG. However, there would be enough to play each of the scenarios in FB. More importantly, these modified squads would have been useful for a host of other late-war scenarios.

It turns out that after my recent reorg, I now have a couple of spare compartments for late-war 6-5-8s.

Pity.

P.S. Lest I seem ungrateful, many thanks for the other SS squads (8-3-8 AE, 8-3-8, 5-4-8, and 4-4-7), and the Heer 8-3-8 AE that I lacked.

Perhaps in a future publication we can add 5-4-8 AE (SS and Heer), plus some late-war 6-5-8 for the obsessive organizer in me. :laugh: