J190 Setup question

[Thunderchief]

I have a question about J190 - can the Germans set up real units concealed (by the setup rule and SSR) and then use all the ? as dummies? I am thinking that since the SSR says units in concealment terrain can be concealed means they get it for "free" without having to use OB-given ?, or does the SSR allow use of the OB-given ? to allow concealment when it would not normally be allowed? I think the first makes more sense, since the OB-given ? could be used to conceal units anyway, regardless of where the defender sets up.

 

[klasmalmstrom]

Yes they can.

 

[ScottRomanowski]

I have a question about J190 - can the Germans set up real units concealed (by the setup rule and SSR) and then use all the ? as dummies?

Yes, with the always-applicable-restriction that you can't place a non-OB-designated ? counter above an OB-designated ? in the same Location.

I am thinking that since the SSR says units in concealment terrain can be concealed means they get it for "free" without having to use OB-given ?, or does the SSR allow use of the OB-given ? to allow concealment when it would not normally be allowed? I think the first makes more sense, since the OB-given ? could be used to conceal units anyway, regardless of where the defender sets up.

You're right, the first is the correct interpretation. SSR 2 says that Entrenchments are also considered Concealment Terrain during setup, which lets you place OB-designated ? counters IN Entrenchments and real units IN Entrenchments would be freely concealed. It doesn't let you place OB-designated ? counters in Open Ground (unless IN an Entrenchment) for instance.

 

[Blaze]

Also don't forget that those Entrenchments also set up hidden:

A12.33 FORTIFICATIONS: Fortifications in Concealment Terrain may always set up hidden and remain hidden until use of its protective TEM is claimed, or a unit therein loses its concealment, or a Good Order enemy ground unit gains a LOS to its Location and is within 16 hexes. [EXC to all: Minefields; B28.1.] Fortifications set up in non-Concealment Terrain are treated as if set up in Concealment Terrain [EXC: they also lose their HIP status due to enemy LOS regardless of range].

 

[ScottRomanowski]

But beware, if there are Concealed German units in non-Concealment Terrain (but where there could be an Entrenchment), then obviously a hidden Entrenchment is there. It will make it easier to move in to/out of the Entrenchment as long as it remains hidden though.