Infiltration question

rdw5150

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SIGH

I can never keep this straight.

Its the Japanese player turn. There is a melee, which not turns to HtH. Japanese rolls a 6, which becomes a 5. Chinese player rolls snakes. Leader creation and infiltration. However the Japanese player had already been attacked and rolled a 5. So, after leader creation are they both still dead? I think that is how it goes.

If it would have been Chinese player's turn there would have been no Japanese attack and a withdraw could have taken place.

Correct?

Thanks!

Roger
 

Binchois

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Your memory is correct regarding the sequence of event. The Japanese attack took place first, so the effects of the final DR 5 must be accounted for before the Chinese attack is applied plus option to withdraw.

Normally, the new leader's CC 1FP might have changed the odds (in addition to any leadership DRM). And an existing Q&A states that you would refigure both attacks even when the attacks are non-sequential. But A18.12 also state that this will not happen if one or both sides withdraw.

A18.12 ...Unless one or both sides Withdraw due to Infiltration (11.22), both attacks are re-figured using both of the originally-rolled Original DRs and the new leader's FP/Leadership just as if he had been there all along.​
And:

Q. (A18.12) Are both attacks re-figured after Leader creation if the CC is non-Sequential?​
A. Yes.​
I think that A18.12 still trumps the Q&A in this case. No refiguring odds or DRM when a withdrawal is chosen. It seems a little weird to me in this case, but I suppose the Chinese could choose not to withdraw if the new odds will spare their lives yet kill the enemy.
 
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klasmalmstrom

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If it would have been Chinese player's turn there would have been no Japanese attack and a withdraw could have taken place.
If the Chinese choose to not Withdraw, then the Japanese would roll their attack - with possible new odds if a Chinese leader was created.
 

rdw5150

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If the Chinese choose to not Withdraw, then the Japanese would roll their attack - with possible new odds if a Chinese leader was created.
But can the Chinese choose to withdraw on the Japanese player's turn when they have been attacked?

Thanks!

Roger
 

Binchois

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If the new leader and leadership DRM will change the odds so that the Chinese aren't killed, then they can do that retroactively. However, they cannot retroactively refigure the odds and withdraw since this is prohibited by A18.12.

A11.22 Provided it has not already been eliminated/captured/pinned, any Infantry/Cavalry unit which rolls an Original 2 CC DR may withdraw from CC/Melee immediately thereafter in the same CCPh without being attacked, even if it did not eliminate the defenders (see also Field Promotions; [cited in post #2 above]).​
 

rdw5150

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OK that is what I thought.

Thanks!
 
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