HtoH CC (J2.31 and ABtF#10)

Legion

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A question for you all... i advanced a HS into CC against a PINned unit. The advancing HS was ambushed, does this mean that the PINned Defender can claim HtoH as per ABtF#10?

I ask this sinc a pre-requisite for a Defender claiming HtoH is that the Attacker be PINned - so how can a PINned Defender do what an attacker cannot?
 

Legion

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I would clarify my question somewhat by pointing out to that a PINned unit is essentially cowering and it is difficult to believe that it would suddenly pull up the pluck to charge into HtoH CC when it is too scared to even shoot straight!

This seems to be reinforced by the stateement in G1.64 about the Japanese; that they may declare HtoH "unless... Ambushed in that phase and/or withdrawing/pinned."

Thus is do not see that ANY PINned unit can declare HtoH.
 
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The Purist

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As long as the units involved follow the normal rules (A11.4) and restrictions on who may declare HtH CC I don't see why not.

Rules to check:

G1.64 Japanese ATTACKER
J2.31 (only ATTACKER may declare HtH)
RB SSR10
A25.43 Gurka (has option to declare HtH)
ABtF SSR10
BRT SSR3
G18.62 Dare Death

I think that about covers it. The pinned unit needs to add +1 to its ambush dr. If it succeeds in ambushing the ATTACKER and is otherwise permitted to declare HtH, I can see no reason why it should not be able to do so. Its only restriction appears to be that it cannot use ambush withdrawal (A11.41).
 

Chris Milne

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Only possible problem I can see is that this is a DEFENDER ambush. But I'm not familiar with the ABtF SSR in question, which may change the situation.

From a reality pov I don't have any great problem with a pinned unit declaring HtH if it's ambushed someone. I can see a unit making the most of cover and not returning too much fire being quite happy to get up close and personal if someone is silly enough to stumble into their position.
 

The Purist

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ABtF SSR 10

"Hand-to-Hand CC (J2.31) may be declared by both sides. Additionally, the DEFENDER may declare Hand-to-Hand CC provided all ATTACKER units were Ambushed or are Withdrawing/pinned. Hand-to-Hand CC by/vs PRC/Vehicle(s)/pillbox occupants is NA."

This being the case and G1.64 being non-applicable I see the ambush as being legal. The only rules that appear to apply are A11.4, A11.41, J2.31 and ABtF10.

One could look at the pinned squad and say that while half the blokes are unwilling to attack (1/2 FP) the other half are perfectly willing to toss a few grenades and use the bayonet.
 
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Legion

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Hmmm... i think that the ABtF10 rule is as clear as it is going to get then... and i thank you for your viewpoints. I still find it hard to accept that PINned Defenders can HtoH when Attackers cannot, so it might be worthwhile submitting this question for possible clarification in the ASL Q&A...

Are there any other opinions on this?
 

tommyl

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NRBH - but from what has been quoted above as ABtF SSR 10, I don't see where the attacker cannot declare hand-to-hand if pinned. Only that if pinned, it gives the defender the opportunity to declare H-t-H if the attacker declines.

Seems consistent to me.
 
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