Foxholes and Infantry Smoke

[johnl]

B27.13 says (paraphrasing) that units inside and outside of foxholes in the same hex are in the same location for all purposes except recovery and TEM. A24.7 says "It costs one additional MF/MP to enter a SMOKE (including Dispersed SMOKE) Location during the MPh/RtPh".

An infantry unit in a foxhole declares assault movement and successfully places infantry smoke in its own hex. Does it pay the 1MF smoke penalty to exit the foxhole?

 

[jrv]

B27.13 says (paraphrasing) that units inside and outside of foxholes in the same hex are in the same location for all purposes except recovery and TEM. A24.7 says "It costs one additional MF/MP to enter a SMOKE (including Dispersed SMOKE) Location during the MPh/RtPh".

An infantry unit in a foxhole declares assault movement and successfully places infantry smoke in its own hex. Does it pay the 1MF smoke penalty to exit the foxhole?

No, it is not entering the location. It is already in the location. Similarly, unloading from or loading into a vehicle will not pay one extra MF.

JR

 

[hongkongwargamer]

So .. if the unit's exiting a pillbox it will have to pay one extra MF yes?

 

[jrv]

So .. if the unit's exiting a pillbox it will have to pay one extra MF yes?

Per the B30.4 EX, the cost of SMOKE does not add to the cost for exiting a pillbox. A24.7 was changed from hex to location with the version 2 ASLRB, and it looks as though pillbox exit was overlooked in A24.7 as an EXC. Since B30.4 still has the EXC, I would say the extra +1 MF is n/a barring an erratum.

JR

 

[hongkongwargamer]

Per the B30.4 EX, the cost of SMOKE does not add to the cost for exiting a pillbox. A24.7 was changed from hex to location with the version 2 ASLRB, and it looks as though pillbox exit was overlooked in A24.7 as an EXC. Since B30.4 still has the EXC, I would say the extra +1 MF is n/a barring an erratum.

JR

JR .. the last sentence in the EXample under B30.4 actually has the extra +1 MF (I just read that myself)

 

[Binchois]

Per the B30.4 EX, the cost of SMOKE does not add to the cost for exiting a pillbox. A24.7 was changed from hex to location with the version 2 ASLRB, and it looks as though pillbox exit was overlooked in A24.7 as an EXC. Since B30.4 still has the EXC, I would say the extra +1 MF is n/a barring an erratum.

JR

Do I have a bad reading of B30.4? A pillbox is in a separate Location than the rest of its hex (B30.1). A24.7 says that entry into a SMOKE Location costs an additional 1MF/MP. My reading of B30.4 (and its EXample) suggests that entering the pillbox from the SMOKE-filled, pillbox hex would cost just 1MF (no additional cost for SMOKE). However, leaving the pillbox into the same hex would cost 2MF due to SMOKE:

B30.4 Infantry enter a pillbox Location in their hex at a cost of one MF. Infantry exit a pillbox Location by paying one MF to enter the pillbox hex [EXC: tunnel (8.6); bunker (30.8)].​

EX: A squad moving into a pillbox hex in Open Ground must expend one MF to enter the hex and is placed on top of the pillbox. After pausing to undergo any Defensive First Fire, it may then expend one MF to enter the pillbox Location. Similarly, a unit inside a pillbox must pay one MF to move Out of that pillbox Location and into the pillbox hex, where it could be subject to Defensive First Fire. Any SMOKE at ground-level in the pillbox hex would add one MF to the squad's cost to enter the hex.​

 

[jrv]

Any SMOKE at ground-level in the pillbox hex would add one MF to the squad's cost to enter the hex.

Looking at it again, this sentence is a bit confusing. Since a unit leaving the pillbox is not entering the hex, this would indicate that the cost for leaving does not incur the one MF cost. But the way it is placed in the EX perhaps it meant location instead of hex. As written I am a bit confused about the EX's meaning.

JR

 

[Binchois]

Looking at it again, this sentence is a bit confusing. Since a unit leaving the pillbox is not entering the hex, this would indicate that the cost for leaving does not incur the one MF cost. But the way it is placed in the EX perhaps it meant location instead of hex. As written I am a bit confused about the EX's meaning.

JR

My guess is that this is to cover two possibilities: a unit in a pillbox exits in order to enter "the [pillbox's] hex", while a unit in an adjacent hex can move into the pillbox's hex. This probably should have been stated more clearly... the rules do sometimes refer to the "pillbox hex", but it may have seemed redundant to specify here when the unit is leaving the pillbox itself.

 

[zgrose]

I think, based on the italics, that the EX is meant to reinforce that you only pay the +1 MF entering the hex if there is SMOKE and not another +1MF for entering the pillbox from the hex. YMMV.

 

[Vinnie]

Also to cover where you go from pillbo x to adjacent trench maybe?

 

[Eagle4ty]

Not too sure it would always apply. I'm fairly sure it would apply to moving into an adjacent trench in the same hex but not so sure it would apply if moving from the bunker to a trench in an adjacent hex as there is no additional MF that must be expended in the bunker's hex [EXC: of course if the adjacent hex containing the trench was also affected by SMOKE]. (or is that what your saying Vinnie?)

 

[A_T_Great]

A 24.7 It costs one additional MF/MP to enter a SMOKE (including dispersed SMOKE) location. B 30.34 a pillbox location may never contain SMOKE. Based on the two rules, it cost and additional MF to exit the pillbox into a smoke filled hex, and no additional to enter the pillbox, as the pillbox location cannot have SMOKE.

 

[Robin Reeve]

A 24.7 It costs one additional MF/MP to enter a SMOKE (including dispersed SMOKE) location. B 30.34 a pillbox location may never contain SMOKE. Based on the two rules, it cost and additional MF to exit the pillbox into a smoke filled hex, and no additional to enter the pillbox, as the pillbox location cannot have SMOKE.

Good catch!