Forgotten War Q & A.

charlie

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I am about to play 215 Red Devils and need to check my understanding of a couple of things.
First, following SSR#2 which covers voluntary abandonment of the M41 HMCs, if a crew involuntarily abandons, would you take that to mean a 126 crew? And if it's a voluntary abandonment, spawning a 546 as in the SSR, then they can't reoccupy the vehicle? That seems odd. It's going to be important because the VCs are all about the SP Guns. I can imagine a situation where the crew get out to defend the vehicle (mightn't want to fire it given the last line in the VCs) and then want to reoccupy it.
Secondly, that last line of the VCs: "+1 VP per M41 HMC that fires per player turn". I kind of hope that means in a PT once one howitzer has fired and the Chinese have a VP the others could fire without further cost but I suspect if four of them fire in a PT that's 4VPs. What do you think about that one?
Thanks for thoughts ...
 

BillH

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I am confused on application of the VC in ASL 206 which states that prisoners do not count for CVP. Given that the Amis are being ambushed and rout paths are often closed, there are a number of units that will have to surrender. If these units as prisoners do not count toward the NK CVP total, then it is in the interest of the NK player to invoke massacre. Was there historical precedent for this? If not, it seems somewhat contrived and gamey to force the player to do that. Most scenarios with similar VC state that prisoners don't count double for points. Is that the intent here, or am I missing something?
Bill H
 

Mr Incredible

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Invoking NQ sometimes makes it harder to mission kill the enemy by allowing them to route away through risking interdiction.

By taking prisoners, they will happily run towards you for re-education.
 

klasmalmstrom

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I am about to play 215 Red Devils and need to check my understanding of a couple of things.
First, following SSR#2 which covers voluntary abandonment of the M41 HMCs, if a crew involuntarily abandons, would you take that to mean a 126 crew? And if it's a voluntary abandonment, spawning a 546 as in the SSR, then they can't reoccupy the vehicle?
Correct, involuntary abandonment = a 1-2-6 vehice crew. Correct a 5-4-6 can't -per SSR 2.

That seems odd. It's going to be important because the VCs are all about the SP Guns. I can imagine a situation where the crew get out to defend the vehicle (mightn't want to fire it given the last line in the VCs) and then want to reoccupy it.
The "oddness" I will leave up to the designer to comment on - SSR 2 is in line with what the submitted SSR said.

Secondly, that last line of the VCs: "+1 VP per M41 HMC that fires per player turn". I kind of hope that means in a PT once one howitzer has fired and the Chinese have a VP the others could fire without further cost but I suspect if four of them fire in a PT that's 4VPs. What do you think about that one?
+1 VP for each that fires per Player Turn.
 

charlie

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Correct, involuntary abandonment = a 1-2-6 vehice crew. Correct a 5-4-6 can't -per SSR 2.


The "oddness" I will leave up to the designer to comment on - SSR 2 is in line with what the submitted SSR said.


+1 VP for each that fires per Player Turn.
Thank you, Klas
 

Matt Book

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Just glanced through FW, I didn't see any FW rules for No Quarter provisions assigned to nationalities against other nationalities or situations. Is that correct?
 

Justiciar

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Just glanced through FW, I didn't see any FW rules for No Quarter provisions assigned to nationalities against other nationalities or situations. Is that correct?
Correct. That is a player call at the tactical level not a trait specific to a nation...but note the KPA can massacre.
Just by way of quick example, the USMC in retaking Seoul in 1950 took many surrenders, and this induced others.
The CPVA at the height of their offensive ops. at Chosin also took prisoners, even sought them, and those prisoners in post war debriefs noted that while the CPVA looted their watches etc, they did not otherwise 'beat' prisoners. That they had less rations and limited to no medical care yes. But there was no do not take prisoners order. The CPVA wanted them for "re-education." In fact this is what prisoners complained most of, they knew they were not going to be at the Ritz, but they hated "classes."
 
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jrv

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Prisoners also hated being made to watch the Manchurian Candidate over and over. And that the playing cards provided by the Red Cross only had Queens of Diamonds in the decks. "It was enough to make you want to kill someone."

JR
 
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Perry

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Just glanced through FW, I didn't see any FW rules for No Quarter provisions assigned to nationalities against other nationalities or situations. Is that correct?
W6.3 does allow KPA to massacre. See footnote 28.

In 206 Hey, That Ain't A ROK!, the KPA may want to invoke No Quarter right away, but they _could_ accept prisoners and then massacre them all in their last fire phase, mitigating the ELR increase from massacre.
 

Perry

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I am about to play 215 Red Devils and need to check my understanding of a couple of things.
First, following SSR#2 which covers voluntary abandonment of the M41 HMCs, if a crew involuntarily abandons, would you take that to mean a 126 crew? And if it's a voluntary abandonment, spawning a 546 as in the SSR, then they can't reoccupy the vehicle? That seems odd. It's going to be important because the VCs are all about the SP Guns. I can imagine a situation where the crew get out to defend the vehicle (mightn't want to fire it given the last line in the VCs) and then want to reoccupy it.
Your imagination is better than mine. I cannot imagine when a 126 would ever want to voluntarily abandon an AFV in this scenario, especially since its elimination is worth 4 VP.
At least a 546 has a fighting chance.
 
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I was the designer. The rationale of this rule was to avoid having to track which infantry squads were infantry squads and which were infantry squads convertable to vehicle crews.

The "oddness" I will leave up to the designer to comment on - SSR 2 is in line with what the submitted SSR said.
 

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Hi all
A CPVA unit takes a non-IPM NTC at the beginning of its MPH and a unit moving at night makes a movement DR at the beginning of its MPH. So at night which does it do first? I say Movement DR for two reasons: 1 lowest rule # first, or 2 the EXC in W7.423 lists Straying as a time it may move more than one hex even if it fails its NTC.
What say you?

Alan
 

jrv

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1) there is no rule that says the action required by the lowest rule number is performed first.

2) I would tend to think the non-IPM NTC is performed first, as the unit may decide not to enter a new hex (which is required for straying) if it fails the non-IPM NTC. It might be in a good position where it is compared to any ADJACENT location. But it would be a good question for a Q&A.

JR
 

afgur

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Thanks JR. Makes sense. Upon reading over RB with a different perspective I see were Ch E says a unit wishing to move makes a Movement DR.

Alan
 

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I'm getting ready to play 207 Bullets for Breakfast. Right after the ELR:3 in the US OB it says "set up as noted, with (less than or equal to) one squad/HS per hex".

Does this mean "set up as noted, with (less than or equal to) one MMC per hex" or literally "squad/HS"? The 3 crews are forced to set up in the buildings, so if "MMC" is the right interpretation that means the 3 up-front building hexes will contain only the crews and maybe leaders - and NONE of the squads/HS will be able to set up in buildings.

Tom
 

jrv

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I'm getting ready to play 207 Bullets for Breakfast. Right after the ELR:3 in the US OB it says "set up as noted, with (less than or equal to) one squad/HS per hex".

Does this mean "set up as noted, with (less than or equal to) one MMC per hex" or literally "squad/HS"? The 3 crews are forced to set up in the buildings, so if "MMC" is the right interpretation that means the 3 up-front building hexes will contain only the crews and maybe leaders - and NONE of the squads/HS will be able to set up in buildings.
"squad/HS" does not include "crew", so in addition to the one squad/hs per hex, per that setup instruction any number of SMC, crews, Guns (which are otherwise prevented from setting up in the same hex) & SW may set up in a single hex. A crew may have the stacking equivalence of a halfsquad, but it is not one, and the setup instructions do not use "stacking equivalence."

JR
 
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Hi, also looking at playing Red Devils and want to clarify whether the 666 passenger squad from the M3 (MMG) (UN vehicle note 13) is included in the printed OB or is addition to the six squads listed in the US OB.

cheers

Rich
 
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Justiciar

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JR...all HT sets up abandoned and without Passengers by SSR.
It is my understanding one of the 666s is that Passenger dismounted.
 
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