Factory battles?

wrongway149

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Question:

Besides the obvious Stalingrad-- what were some battles that featured fighting for similarly large factories?

Along with one of the top map designers in the game, I am working on a Deluxe ASL project featuring real factory terrain - think interior walls, debris, vehicular entrances, etc. -- all on the big DASL hexes!

While we could certainly re-fight the Battle of the Barrikady in grander style than ever before, it would be great to have some different flavors in the (likely) Action/WO pack as well.

Looking to you guys for some researchable topics.

Welcome to the team!!!
 

Bob Miller

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Question:

Besides the obvious Stalingrad-- what were some battles that featured fighting for similarly large factories?

Along with one of the top map designers in the game, I am working on a Deluxe ASL project featuring real factory terrain - think interior walls, debris, vehicular entrances, etc. -- all on the big DASL hexes!

While we could certainly re-fight the Battle of the Barrikady in grander style than ever before, it would be great to have some different flavors in the (likely) Action/WO pack as well.

Looking to you guys for some researchable topics.

Welcome to the team!!!
Hello Pete You would have to talk to the French ASL guys but do some research into the battle of Lille in May 1040 Lille was the industrial heart of northern France so I'm sure there were factories and other such large buildings. Now how much fighting was there in Lille ? Some but maybe not enough to warrent a HASL map. French holding out there and other places slowed down the advance to Dunkirk. If some fighting did occur here it would be neat to see some French - German urban slugfests.

Rostov in Russia for sure had some industrial building fighting. Same dates as Stalingrad pretty much though.
 

stuh42asl

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MMP'S Festung Budapest gives you a massive city area and several Factories to fight over ;P
 

chris_olden

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Pete, I wanna say there was a factory battle at Kharkov in '43.(I might be mis-remembering...)
 

gorkowskij

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Although not an exact match in terms of “factories,” you could get something similar, yet unique, from Shanghai in 1937 and either Aachen or Brest in 1944. Each of those three saw weeks of crawling urban combat over rubble and debris through large indoor spaces, such as warehouses and a train station in Shanghai, or formidable interior walls, from centuries old architecture in Aachen. Shanghai could even feature an “exterior wall” left over from the old city that separated river front warehouses from the city proper.
 

Actionjick

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Greetings, Follow Grognards!

Question:

Besides the obvious Stalingrad-- what were some battles that featured fighting for similarly large factories?

Along with one of the top map designers in the game, I am working on a Deluxe ASL project featuring real factory terrain - think interior walls, debris, vehicular entrances, etc. -- all on the big DASL hexes!

While we could certainly re-fight the Battle of the Barrikady in grander style than ever before, it would be great to have some different flavors in the (likely) Action/WO pack as well.

Looking to you guys for some researchable topics.

Welcome to the team!!!
Pete this seems very interesting. I always liked DASL. Good luck and keep us posted.
 

Actionjick

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Pete a while back The Battle of Bengtskar was discussed in Scenarios we'd like to see. There's a lighthouse. That could be fun.🤔

Although there were others working on it. Not sure how that works.

" I don't know how they're designed. I just play them ". Oddjick.
 

fenyan

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Pete, I wanna say there was a factory battle at Kharkov in '43.(I might be mis-remembering...)
On All Fronts had a DASL trilogy of scenarios, the second one "Collapse of the Tractor Factory" is set on March 15th, 1943 with an assault on a "large tractor plant" by SS Pz Div LAH, according to the scenario description.
 

chris_olden

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"War In The Ruins" by Longacre, has an account of the Americans and Germans
duking it out in factories.
 

sswann

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Pete a while back The Battle of Bengtskar was discussed in Scenarios we'd like to see. There's a lighthouse. That could be fun.🤔

Although there were others working on it. Not sure how that works.

" I don't know how they're designed. I just play them ". Oddjick.
I have the "Battle of Bengtskar" designed and ready to playtest.
MGB rules and counters (from LFT) are required as it was a very small island.
The historical map can be printed on one regular sheet of paper.
Want to try it?

Steve
 

footsteps

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I have the "Battle of Bengtskar" designed and ready to playtest.
MGB rules and counters (from LFT) are required as it was a very small island.
The historical map can be printed on one regular sheet of paper.
Want to try it?

Steve
A couple of years ago I tried a half-sheet overlay for Bengtskar. The idea was that Levle 0 was treated as Water/Ocean, with only the Level 0 Crags still being in play. Otherwise, it could be used for any appropriate land battle.
22987
 

Actionjick

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I have the "Battle of Bengtskar" designed and ready to playtest.
MGB rules and counters (from LFT) are required as it was a very small island.
The historical map can be printed on one regular sheet of paper.
Want to try it?

Steve
Alas Sir my playing days are things of the last century. I will say that if I was still active that I would be on that like fleas on an alley cat!! Good luck with it, keep us posted. I would love to hear some AARs of the playtest. Do designers do that? Playtest AARs for the general community.
 

Tuomo

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Pete's already set me straight that this product won't be breaking any new ground, rules-wise, but that doesn't stop me from wondering if there's anything that's missing in the normal ch B Factory rules.

It's an odd environment, to be sure. Lots of hard cover, but bullets tend to ricochet, too. Also lots of open LOS and movement has some open areas but is also channelized by the machinery and materials.

I find myself thinking the TEM and LOS Hindrances are actually pretty good, all things considered. What I do wonder about is whether AFVs should get more HD possibilities, based simply on there being more Big Metal Things to hide behind on purpose or that can get in the way by sheer chance. No idea how to game that, though, and it's called Squad Leader, anyway.

I sure wish there were a way to show in-Factory terrain (like Rubble and Debris) without making the Factory Roofless.
 

Actionjick

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Pete's already set me straight that this product won't be breaking any new ground, rules-wise, but that doesn't stop me from wondering if there's anything that's missing in the normal ch B Factory rules.

It's an odd environment, to be sure. Lots of hard cover, but bullets tend to ricochet, too. Also lots of open LOS and movement has some open areas but is also channelized by the machinery and materials.

I find myself thinking the TEM and LOS Hindrances are actually pretty good, all things considered. What I do wonder about is whether AFVs should get more HD possibilities, based simply on there being more Big Metal Things to hide behind on purpose or that can get in the way by sheer chance. No idea how to game that, though, and it's called Squad Leader, anyway.

I sure wish there were a way to show in-Factory terrain (like Rubble and Debris) without making the Factory Roofless.
Interesting about the HD but most factories I worked in would have been very difficult for a tank to maneuver in. Hard enough with a forklift. Very susceptible to Ambush. Smaller factories though so the enormous ones were most likely an entirely different thing.
 

wrongway149

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Pete's already set me straight that this product won't be breaking any new ground, rules-wise, but that doesn't stop me from wondering if there's anything that's missing in the normal ch B Factory rules.
That was after Perry set ME straight.

It's an odd environment, to be sure. Lots of hard cover, but bullets tend to ricochet, too. Also lots of open LOS and movement has some open areas but is also channelized by the machinery and materials.

I find myself thinking the TEM and LOS Hindrances are actually pretty good, all things considered. What I do wonder about is whether AFVs should get more HD possibilities, based simply on there being more Big Metal Things to hide behind on purpose or that can get in the way by sheer chance. No idea how to game that, though, and it's called Squad Leader, anyway.
SSR 3: AFVs may make a HD maneuver attempt while in factory hex per D 4.22 , as if all adjacent non - factory wall hexsides are one- level lower crest lines. The only modifiers to this are +1 if BU and + x for any armor leader modifier (We will let the Russians go bananas)

Very susceptible to Ambush.
SSR4: an AFV is susceptible to ambush as street fighting (A 11.8) if at least one of the hexsides of the AFVs location is a factory-wall hex side.


 
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