End S1 DaE. Is it a wash?

[Abe]

We’ve just finished the end of scenario 1 of the Decision at Elst Campaign game. We’re new to tanks having just played one tank-only scenario beforehand.

Having a passel of fun, but the death tally at the end seems a bit one sided.
British losses (approx):
12 squads, 1 10-2 leader, 1 crew, 3 Sherman’s (incl. firefly)
German losses:
1 squad, 1 panther.

The Brit’s have managed to take the northern ‘Hell’s Highway’ entry hex on the west a couple of buildings on the western margin and the row of buildings in the north.

We’re in this for the fun, not the competition. Given the large numbers of Brits at the start I would have expected more casualties than the Germans, but this seems a bit extreme. If this is a truly terrible start for the Brits, we’d probably like to balance it a bit for Scenario 2. Maybe Brits get 50% of their losses back rather than 25%?

Interested in people’s thoughts, particularly if you have played it before.

 

[jrv]

The British set up on/west of hexrow D. Why did they have to take the northern entry hex? They own all the western entry hexes at start.

I would guess that something went wrong somewhere. The Germans should be spread out and the British set up second, so there should be opportunities for the British to swarm relatively isolated German positions. The British have Smoke from the two mortars at start and get more from the Shermans when they enter. That should provide some opportunities to get in close. The British can't be too strongly concentrated out of respect for the German OBA, but they should be able to apply mass against points of their choosing. Unless the Germans want to lose units, the E & F buildings probably won't be defended. The bunch in the center around H-J will be hard to hold for long too. My first thought as the British would be to pick either north or south and attempt to pick off some buildings there too in the K-L-M rows. The British tanks should avoid the German tanks as much as possible.

JR

 

[Abe]

Thanks for the reply. This is our first campaign game and only second game with tanks so tactical mistakes are being made. As the Germans, I didn’t read the setup properly and thought the British needed to enter the board rather than set up on it, so I set up way too forward which lost me one of my panthers to a PIAT. With my paucity of forces, I elected to abandon the northern half of the board relying only on a HMG and MMG in the steeple and OBA (when I remembered) to slow them down in the grain. This enabled me to strengthen the highway and buildings to the south. The Brits were split north and south and withheld their tanks for the first three turns. It turned into a massacre in the orchard in the SW corner.

I have an AAR on the DaE BGG page. Only the first couple of turns so far as I’ve been busy.

Any thoughts on how to balance the next scenario would be appreciated.

Cheers

 

[Abe]

WRT the entry points, the Germans retook the southern road entry hex. Not sure if that would have any effect as we’re still reading up on refit rules.

 

[jrv]

Thanks for the reply. This is our first campaign game and only second game with tanks so tactical mistakes are being made. As the Germans, I didn’t read the setup properly and thought the British needed to enter the board rather than set up on it, so I set up way too forward which lost me one of my panthers to a PIAT. With my paucity of forces, I elected to abandon the northern half of the board relying only on a HMG and MMG in the steeple and OBA (when I remembered) to slow them down in the grain. This enabled me to strengthen the highway and buildings to the south. The Brits were split north and south and withheld their tanks for the first three turns. It turned into a massacre in the orchard in the SW corner.

I have an AAR on the DaE BGG page. Only the first couple of turns so far as I’ve been busy.

Any thoughts on how to balance the next scenario would be appreciated.

Per 4.1 a MG firing at > 16 hexes is halved again (in addition to any halving for long-range fire), and must be directed by a leader. So the HMG can fire out to hexrow H from the steeple if it is leader-directed, but at ¼ of its normal FP, i.e. at one FP. Now a one FP down two for -2 leader (down three if FFNAM) is nothing to sneeze at, it alone won't stop a serious British push, nor even in conjunction with the OBA. The farthest the MMG can shoot from the steeple (NN8) is hexrow P (twenty-four hexes), and that would be at long range and also beyond sixteen hexes. I wouldn't expect the British getting that far in the first CG date, although given your defense perhaps that is not so unlikely. And the British will try to stay behind orchards (or buildings), which will block LOS from the steeple. Note also that the OBA Observer can't both use OBA and direct the MGs at > 16 hexes. That means you need two leaders in the steeple if you opt to put the MGs up there, at least to fire at range > 16 hexes.

I looked over your AAR. Is it possible that you are misunderstanding what the units in the steeple can see? They cannot see immediately behind an obstacle (orchard or building) so J3 for instance can't be seen from the steeple. I see you have OBA placed there, which would be tricky to do given how the LOS from the steeple works.

I don't have a suggestion for how to re-balance. Give the Brits a packet of extra CPP would be one way. Bring more back from the dead is fine too.

Another point to note is that although the ASLSK charts only show TH numbers up to range 24, ordnance such as tank MA may fire at any range. The British might set their 75mm tanks up to fire at the steeple. At really long range Area Target Type is probably the better choice, but one good hit could leave the steeple in shambles.

JR

 

[jrv]

WRT the entry points, the Germans retook the southern road entry hex. Not sure if that would have any effect as we’re still reading up on refit rules.

I don't think that has any effect other than removing that area from the British on-map setup areas. The British can still enter the entire west edge. If the British create a setup area that includes German entry hexes, the Germans can't enter on those hexes.

JR

 

[jrv]

A previous discussion on firing ordnance at range > 24 in ASLSK: http://www.gamesquad.com/forums/index.php?threads/dae-newbie-tactics-question.121919/

For the Area Target Type the TH# at ranges 25-36 is 7. Assume the Sherman is BU because of the threat of OBA, so the TH# starts at a six and goes to an eight with acquisition. Any hit results in a six FP add three attack, which is not the scariest attack ever, but every so often it will land a blow.

JR

 

[Abe]

Thanks for the response. I’m sure we made a few mistakes. I wasn’t aware that a leader couldn’t direct both long range MG fire and OBA. They were really just there as a bit of a deterrent to running straight into town. We may have made some errors with LOS from the steeple as well for OBA. Although I *think* any that fell into that category were corrected from an original SR.

The scenario ended on turn 6 as well, just after I’d pulled back which denied the Brits a chance to gain some ground.

Thanks again for the input. I’ll propose a 50% increase in CVP and resurrected casualties.

 

[jrv]

The rule for radio: DaE2.1: "Only an Observer (i.e., a Good Order leader possessing a functioning radio) may attempt Radio Contact or Maintenance, and may do so only at the start (but after all Ordnance Smoke has been attempted) of the PFPh/DFPh as his sole action for that phase aside from other allowed OBA activities."

JR

 

[jrv]

For those interested, the AAR on boardgamegeek is here: https://boardgamegeek.com/thread/2009764/aac-campaign-game-session-report

JR

 

[Vinnie]

It's often a good idea to play the first date of a CG twice. If you make big errors (which might be the case here) it can mean one side has too much to try and recover from. Besides, it's supposed to be fun!

 

[Abe]

It's often a good idea to play the first date of a CG twice. If you make big errors (which might be the case here) it can mean one side has too much to try and recover from. Besides, it's supposed to be fun!

We are having fun. There are some tactical errors but I don’t think we made big rules errors. I did just have one leader in the steeple, but forgot to do OBA at all for the first couple of turns and was red-carded at least once. Neither the OBA or the MGs were really that effective. We’d rather rebalance for the next scenario. For us it’s the journey and the classic ASL situations. Playing it again would be a drag.

 

[zgrose]

Some might say the CG skews British anyway. You may just want to play it straight up to give the Germans a better shot at holding out.

 

[jrv]

Most ASL players would probably play control of buildings at CG start correctly, but I saw some posts on boardgamegeek that suggested some players were playing that the buildings are uncontrolled until occupied. This is the PerrySez: http://www.gamesquad.com/forums/index.php?threads/decision-at-elst-strategic-location-control-at-cg-start.148016/

JR

 

[Abe]

Thanks JR, that’s most helpful. I’d imagine playing buildings as uncontrolled at scenario start would change the game a fair bit.