Deliberate Immobilization & multiple TK DRs

jrv

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A weapon with multiple TK DRs (e.g. the MA on a Wirbelwind) fires for Deliberate Immobilization [C5.7]. Does it get only one shot to hit the hull?

JR
 

Robin Reeve

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I would say yes, as TK DR are not involved.
 

von Marwitz

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By gut feeling, I would give it multiple shots. After all the gun is supposed to fire fast, which is the reason for Multiple Hits to apply under normal circumstances in the first place.

Probably, there is no explicit rule to support this view.

Good question though, and worthy of a Perry Sez IMHO.

von Marwitz
 

Eagle4ty

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It seems as if the ROF of the weapon system used is the only factor for additional shots as C3.8 certainly doesn't lend itself to indicate additional hits other than in an ancillary fashion but simply additional TK DRs and as Robin said, a TK DR is not necessary.
 

Philippe D.

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If the note on the gun/vehicle doesn't specify an alternate way to determine hit locations, all normal TK DRs use the same hit location - so since Deliberate Immobilization only cares about a hull hit, there should not be additional rolls.

It would be different with Multiple Hits, but then, Multiple Hits occur on Doubles, which (normally) are Hull Hits; and the exception is Improbable Hits, which are explicitly pro
 

jrv

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If the note on the gun/vehicle doesn't specify an alternate way to determine hit locations, all normal TK DRs use the same hit location - so since Deliberate Immobilization only cares about a hull hit, there should not be additional rolls.

It would be different with Multiple Hits, but then, Multiple Hits occur on Doubles, which (normally) are Hull Hits; and the exception is Improbable Hits, which are explicitly pro
You're right. Multiple Hits can switch between turret and hull. Multiple TK don't. So I guess the question was about multiple hit weapons, not multiple TK weapons.

JR
 

Eagle4ty

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You're right. Multiple Hits can switch between turret and hull. Multiple TK don't. So I guess the question was about multiple hit weapons, not multiple TK weapons.

JR
Philippe and you are kind of incorrect, as the first TK DR also serves as the TH location (e.g. target location hit) for the second TK DR. Multiple hits do NOT necessarily hit the same location (hull or turret/upper structure) of the target vehicle (C3.8 ...The first To Kill DR of a Multiple Hit vs a vehicle is also used to determine the location of the second hit as per 3.9.)
 

jrv

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Philippe and you are kind of incorrect, as the first TK DR also serves as the TH location (e.g. target location hit) for the second TK DR. Multiple hits do NOT necessarily hit the same location (hull or turret/upper structure) of the target vehicle (C3.8 ...The first To Kill DR of a Multiple Hit vs a vehicle is also used to determine the location of the second hit as per 3.9.)
Philippe is correct. A weapon with multiple TK DRs is not eligible for multiple hits [C3.8]. I was thinking that multiple TK weapons work the same as multiple hit weapons, but that is wrong. In the case of a Wirbelwind all four TK DRs are rolled against the same vehicle aspect. Only a weapon that is eligible for multiple hits can switch between aspects.

JR
 

Eagle4ty

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Philippe is correct. A weapon with multiple TK DRs is not eligible for multiple hits [C3.8]. I was thinking that multiple TK weapons work the same as multiple hit weapons, but that is wrong. In the case of a Wirbelwind all four TK DRs are rolled against the same vehicle aspect. Only a weapon that is eligible for multiple hits can switch between aspects.

JR
Ah yes, see the difference now. The MAVN for the FlaKPz IV/20 denotes multiple TK DRs like the U.S. M16 but not Multiple Hits (C3.8), unlike the U.S. M4 with vehicle note R that references that rule.
 

jrv

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If you get a hit that is multiple hits it is--by virtue of being a double--a hull hit, and you have your deliberate immobilization. So there's no point in rolling another hit.

JR
 

Vinnie

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Multiple To Kill weapons do not get extra to hit rolls so, since the DI is determined by the to hit roll, they receive no advantage
If your to hit roll indicates a turret hit, since no to kill roll is made you are stuffed..
 
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