Deep snow, at night, in the forest, on skis...

[PabloGS]

We are playing J196, Blood Amongst the Pines, and the following question arose:

Are units on skis exempt from the 1MF penalty of moving in concealment terrain at night?

E4.2 states that units can be on foot, on skis, or transported by other means:

E4.2 SKI MODE: The special rules for ski troops apply only to
those scenarios in which Ground or Deep Snow is present. Ski capable
units (those beginning a scenario with ski counters or
that pass a ski-use dr; 4.21) may be on foot, on skis, or transported
by any other normal means when not in ski mode.

E1.51 is a rule that specifically states ON FOOT, which suggests it only applies to units ON FOOT (hence not on skis per E4.2?), but it does not explicitly include skiers as an exception:

E1.51 ON FOOT: Infantry/Cavalry [EXC: Infantry represented by a
Cloaking counter; 1.41] during a night scenario must pay an additional
MF (after all modifications) per each Concealment Terrain Location
entered [EXC: if crossing a road hexside or using Bypass in an Open
Ground hexside of an Obstacle hex; bocage (B9.5) does not make a Location
Concealment Terrain for this purpose]. In addition, if such a unit’s
NVR is 0, it may not use Double Time, road bonus, or Gallop.

 

[asloser]

To add to this index has the following:

Infantry (all SMC & MMC counters on foot; i.e., not mounted as Cavalry or PRC)

 

[Doug Leslie]

Good question! I would say that the use of "i.e" as opposed to "e.g" in the index definition means that ski troops are considered to be infantry regardless of whether or not they are wearing their skis since they are neither Cavalry or PRC. Therefore, notwithstanding the imprecise header for E1.51, units on skis have to pay the extra MF for entering concealment terrain at night. This does seem to be an oversight when the rules were drafted though and the index would benefit from adding "/skis" after "foot".

 

[PabloGS]

Probably that index entry clears it. Unless one wants to argue that Skiers, that is "Units on skis that are in ski mode, and are referred to as Skiers" are not Infantry. That would be a stretch!

 

[PabloGS]

Another Q, on the same thread to keep it compact. So, what do Russian Skiers in Deep Snow, at night, on a pine wood forest, really want to do? A Human Wave of course!

Here is the question. E4.2 states that Skiers can swith off their skis during the MPh or APh, and in the later either at the start of the end of the APh. So units of a Human Wave of Russian Skiers enter the hex of enemy units, they are now under CC. There will be no ambush. They can leisurely take off their Skis at the start of the APh before doing CC? Or they cannot switch off their skis because they are not spending MFs advancing in that APh?

 

[asloser]

Another Q, on the same thread to keep it compact. So, what do Russian Skiers in Deep Snow, at night, on a pine wood forest, really want to do? A Human Wave of course!

Here is the question. E4.2 states that Skiers can swith off their skis during the MPh or APh, and in the later either at the start of the end of the APh. So units of a Human Wave of Russian Skiers enter the hex of enemy units, they are now under CC. There will be no ambush. They can leisurely take off their Skis at the start of the APh before doing CC? Or they cannot switch off their skis because they are not spending MFs advancing in that APh?

I think is possible to take the skis off: A25.234 states "EXC: ....cannot advance out of that Location....." and E4.2 "Switching mode is considered movement and is NA if pinned/TI". Having CC marker is not mentioned, and there is no requirement to move from location to another to change ski mode.

Any other opinions on this?

 

[EagleIV]

There is Q&A that says units in CC can't Advance and I would take that to mean that they can't do anything in the APh such as take off skies.

 

[Eagle4ty]

Switching to foot mode should be OK in the AFh because it costs no MF per E4.2 "There is no cost for switching from ski to foot mode, but it costs two MF to switch from foot to ski mode [EXC: 1 MF for Finnish Infantry14A].

 

[Eagle4ty]

There is Q&A that says units in CC can't Advance and I would take that to mean that they can't do anything in the APh such as take off skies.

That Q&A has been deleted as superseded or erroneous. A4.7 now reads: "ADVANCE PHASE: Infantry units which are neither broken, pinned, TI, nor marked with a CC counter may use the APh to move one hex horizontally or vertically (to a different ADJACENT building level Location of the same hex) but not both...." and shouldn't pertain to Ski removal as the unit(s) are not conducting any action that entails movement/advance.

 

[PabloGS]

Thanks, on to the HW on skis then lol.