Creating new scenarios and converting old ones

[BlitzCanuck]

Can anyone comment on the difficulty level of creating new scenarios relative to doing so in CMx1?

Years ago I converted a few CMBO scenarios to CMAK and i'm hoping it won't be a huge PITA to convert CMx1 scenarios to CMN.
I recall using a handy little map converter program that someone made. It automatically converted any scenario map from CMBO to CMBB or CMAK. Was a huge time saver as you can imagine because it saved you from having to alt-tab back and forth a million times to get the elevation and terrain tiles to match.
That would be sweet if there is a similar program for CMN.

 

[junk2drive]

That was discussed at BFC forum. It was said that it won't work because CMx1 was 20m tiles and CMx2 is 8m tiles.

 

[Michael Dorosh]

That was discussed at BFC forum. It was said that it won't work because CMx1 was 20m tiles and CMx2 is 8m tiles.

The building sizes and layouts are also different.

Of course, it can be done, but it will need to be done by hand. There are also an infinite number of contour levels now compared to the 20 of CMX1, and a much different terrain palette. Even if you got a map that was "close" to an old one, I think you would find forces balanced for one map would be acting differently on the new one.

Then there is the problem of having to write AI routines for the "new" map whereas scenarios in the old engine were written for the old Tac AI. There is a lot more to a scenario than just a map file and an order of battle - that was the fun part. The tough part was finding testers, and then getting reinforcement levels, timing, balance etc. correct, which was hard work and usually a stumbling block that set apart the good designers from the poor ones.

 

[BlitzCanuck]

as i suspected, it sounds like it's going to take some real dedication to create good conversions.....so that excludes me.

 

[Elvis]

as i suspected, it sounds like it's going to take some real dedication to create good conversions.....so that excludes me.

Don't sweat it BC. You can be a "taker" like me. I believe there will be multible versions made of some old scenarios. With CMSF I think there were half a dozen versions made of Chance Encounter and that wasn't even the same units and terrain. I doubt it will take long before you start seeing them pop up.

 

[Michael Dorosh]

as i suspected, it sounds like it's going to take some real dedication to create good conversions.....so that excludes me.

I wouldn't be too dissuaded - but having said that, I think CM:BN will be sufficiently unlike CM:BO that "conversions" will be probably not worth the effort. But that's just a guess.

The reason I say that is that despite the fact both games are squad-based, company level games, they will be very distinct in look and feel. There were a number of people trying to "convert" ASL and SL scenarios for CM. But the terrain grid in Squad Leader/Advanced Squad Leader, the unique leadership, command/control and support weapon distribution modelling, and other factors, all conspired to make such "conversions" not really worthwhile. The material rarely translated well. Not having seen CM:BN yet, I can't say if that will be the case. Could go either way.

But I would definitely be interested in seeing some of the "original" scenarios revisited in some form, as long as the new ones were done well, and tailor made with the new engine's features, capabilities and limitations in mind.

 

[British Tommy]

If the game turns out ok and if I can work with the editors, then I will try to convert at least one of my CMAK scenario's. Lucky most of mine are for H2H so it should be easier to do (I hope!).

 

[Elvis]

EDIT: Rethought my post

 

[BlitzCanuck]

anyone know exactly how many scenarios we'll be starting with?
And will it be obvious which ones are meant to be played H2H?

 

[wengart]

I actually recall playing a very intense CM:SF version of Last Defense, I played the Americans vs. the Syrians (Germans). T-62s stood in for the German armor and Stryker MGSs were the M10s.

 

[Elvis]

I actually recall playing a very intense CM:SF version of Last Defense, I played the Americans vs. the Syrians (Germans). T-62s stood in for the German armor and Stryker MGSs were the M10s.

REALLY!?!?!?!? I missed that one!! I played a coupla/few Chance Encounters with the CMx2 engine. That seems to be the one that people usually go to. Was it any good? I'm having a hard time picturing it without grass.

 

[wengart]

I quite liked it. It was very intense and surprising playing blue.

Veteran Syrian troops and green/regular US troops really threw me for a loop at first and I ended up barely holding onto the town before the MGSs showed up, and iirc I lost 1 MGS destroyed and another one was heavily damaged to the point where it could no longer acquire targets on its own.

 

[Redwolf]

While buildings and streets wouldn't quite fit it would still be a huge improvement if we could get terrain tiles (natural terrain) and height out of a CMx1 map.

And roads that are a little off are better than none. Think of it as an overlay for doing the manual work.

I'm pretty sure that if CMBN is a hit that'll happen pretty quickly.

 

[Mad Russian]

Are the scenarios and campaigns set for CMBN yet Elvis? It was a good question as to how many $60+ will get you.

Good Hunting.

MR

 

[Elvis]

Are the scenarios and campaigns set for CMBN yet Elvis? It was a good question as to how many $60+ will get you.

Good Hunting.

MR

The number of campaigns has been announced but I don't think the number of stand alone scenarios has been. Historically BFC list that stuff on release day so I would not expect to hear how many stand alone scenarios there are until then. A campaign can take a while to test and work out the kinks. A good scenario can be fine tuned much more quickly so late entries are common.