Countries hate us? I don't see how.

Rabbi

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Aries said:
Interesting numbers.

Now the fact that the US is a successful capitalist country wouldn't have anything to do with it would it?

Or the fact it has a few hundred million people in a nation bordered by two countries that are most assuredly not going to atack it any time soon.

I wonder how the planet would see the US, if a lot more of that money was spent on free education (yes college for free), free medical coverage (yes seeing a doctor and not paying out a cent), teachers that were better paid, better paid cop, better paid fire fighters.

The best defense, is an example the rest of the world would be incapable of ignoring.

"Want to do it better, do it our way" would make a heck of a selling point for the American way of life.

Sending armed men to the far flung corners of the world, and forcibly making other nations vote in free elections is clearly not working.
If it was, we would have seen more examples.

We already have the best example that the rest of the world aspires to although they often don't admit it. It's why I think the dislike of us is often jealousy of the accomplishments and luxuries we have. I would think we do more than enough to help out countries that can't seem to do it on their own and if it also furthers our agenda, so be it.
 

sickpup

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Jack said:
It’s true you’re not the only one, but you do have huge morale issues to deal with on your foreign policy. No consistency whatsoever. And as you will agree the world economy revolves around your foreign policy.
I disagree - We do whatever is in the best interest of our citizens. Situations change, the needs of our citizens change, so it only follows that our foreign policy would have to change as well. That's what any sovereign nation is expected to do.

As for our policy impacting the world economy, I agree that it's true... but to a lesser and lesser extent each year. With powerhouses like China coming online, and other nations continuing to grow their economies (well, except for western Europe) - I think the impact of US policy isn't nearly as noticeable as it was ten or twenty years ago.
 

Jack Dionne

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sickpup said:
I disagree - We do whatever is in the best interest of our citizens. Situations change, the needs of our citizens change, so it only follows that our foreign policy would have to change as well. That's what any sovereign nation is expected to do.
I agree you’re a sovereign nation and you have that right. The original thread started was “why are we hated”. I just gave my opinion that’s all. If you read some of the other posts on this thread you can understand why the US (your country) is having the problems it has. I also know for a fact that the American people as a whole are extremely generous and kind hearted.
 

sickpup

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Jack said:
I agree you’re a sovereign nation and you have that right. The original thread started was “why are we hated”. I just gave my opinion that’s all.
Right, but I'm just wondering what the big moral issue is that you referenced. I don't really see us as any different than, say, the UK or the Australians in our "morals" (from a governmental standpoint) and I certainly think we're no worse than the French.
 

Aries

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"We already have the best example that the rest of the world aspires to although they often don't admit it."

Interesting comment Rabbi.

What confuses me though, is why the US never gets chosen as the best this or that on anyone's polls :)

Canada is not always number one, and sometimes we have had to share 2nd place, but it is interesting no one ever puts the US as best place to live.

Recent poll I saw that was amusing, had of the top 5 cities in the world the top 4 being Canadian cities (5th went to Perth Australia).

Your statement doesn't bear up under scrutiny. Well at lest the part where you used the word "aspires".

The US has many great qualities. But it is time the US accepted it doesn't have a monopoly on greatness.

There's a reason I have no interest in leaving Canada eh, it doesn't get any better than here (in my opinion).
 

Ivan Rapkinov

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viridomaros said:
well why the rest of the world begin to be "angry" against USA
in my oppinion a good thing to compare with would be michael schumacher in formula 1 ;)
ooh, good answer :D

- Ivan, the devoted Williams fan ;)
 

Ivan Rapkinov

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Aries said:
Recent poll I saw that was amusing, had of the top 5 cities in the world the top 4 being Canadian cities (5th went to Perth Australia).
last I heard, the UN had Norway, then Australia, Sweden, Canada as the top countries to live when everything was rounded out.

that being said, Australia has a mix of socialist tendenciesand capitalist agendas, so we get the best (and a bit of the worst) of both worlds.

the US's abject fear of socialist ideals is what holds them back imo.
 

Rabbi

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Aries said:
"We already have the best example that the rest of the world aspires to although they often don't admit it."

Interesting comment Rabbi.

What confuses me though, is why the US never gets chosen as the best this or that on anyone's polls :)

Canada is not always number one, and sometimes we have had to share 2nd place, but it is interesting no one ever puts the US as best place to live.

The US has many great qualities. But it is time the US accepted it doesn't have a monopoly on greatness.
Actually we do have a monopoly on greatness. :D
Call me arrogant or call Americans arrogant but quite simply, this is the best country on the planet. And that's not just blind patriotism talking or a strong sense of Nationalism either. I have been to over thirty different countries and can honestly say America is the best. Sure there may be better cities out there but as a whole no country is better, including and especially Canada. :smoke:
 

viridomaros

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Ivan Rapkinov said:
ooh, good answer :D

- Ivan, the devoted Williams fan ;)
which pilot do you prefer there?
i used to watch all the races and used to be a big fan of schumacher but now his car is so good and he's winning so many races that i lost most of my interest in formula 1.
 

Jack Dionne

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sickpup said:
Right, but I'm just wondering what the big moral issue is that you referenced. I don't really see us as any different than, say, the UK or the Australians in our "morals" (from a governmental standpoint) and I certainly think we're no worse than the French.
The UK and Australia don’t support occupation of territories by other countries; example US supports Israel in Palestinian territories. The UK and Australia don’t support dictators in South America, Central America or the Middle East. The UK and Australia don’t supply chemical weapons to countries for short-term gain. I think you have my point. Get you head out of the sand and have a good look around. Don’t forget I am a neutral party on this thread, I didn’t start the thread Rabbi did and BTW what does he have to say?

Let’s not start this into who lives in the best country thread. There is nothing wrong with thinking that, but it sidetracks the issue. In some ways I wish Canadians where more like Americans.
 

Aries

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"Call me arrogant or call Americans arrogant but quite simply, this is the best country on the planet."

Ok you're arrogant :)

Hey he said to call him arrogant hehe :)

I would wonder about a guy though, if they didn't think their country was the best.

Well I suppose it depends on where you live hehe.

I don't recall anyone being overly glad to be Sudanese :)

But Canada is still great.

Although I often wonder about what they ask on the polls eh.
I mean think about it, what does Canada have to offer.

Lots and lots of space.
Trees man we got lots of trees.
Water, so much fresh water we don't know what to do with it.
Mineral wealth, I think we have some of the larger sums of most of the good ones to have.
Oil, we got yer oil.
High tech ya our hi tech is as good as it gets in most sectors.
Industry, we ain't lacking in industry.
Education, we have some of the best places of advanced learning in the world.
Health care, in spite of our bitching, it's some of the best in the world.

Our military is puny to the point of frustrating, but our forces are respected. But as we only have one neighbour, and its the ultra powerful US, and they don't consider us a threat (like we actually could be mistaken as one :) ), it is not like we have a lot of ease justifying a lot of hardware.

I think if the US actually wants Canadian committment in their world endeavours, they should just hire us like any other form of sub contracted help eh.

I bet if you hired Canadian personel, and equipped them with those neat US toys, you would actually be better off :)
 

Stage

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Aries said:
"Call me arrogant or call Americans arrogant but quite simply, this is the best country on the planet."

Ok you're arrogant :)

Hey he said to call him arrogant hehe :)

I would wonder about a guy though, if they didn't think their country was the best.

Well I suppose it depends on where you live hehe.

I don't recall anyone being overly glad to be Sudanese :)

But Canada is still great.

Although I often wonder about what they ask on the polls eh.
I mean think about it, what does Canada have to offer.

Lots and lots of space.
Trees man we got lots of trees.
Water, so much fresh water we don't know what to do with it.
Mineral wealth, I think we have some of the larger sums of most of the good ones to have.
Oil, we got yer oil.
High tech ya our hi tech is as good as it gets in most sectors.
Industry, we ain't lacking in industry.
Education, we have some of the best places of advanced learning in the world.
Health care, in spite of our bitching, it's some of the best in the world.

Our military is puny to the point of frustrating, but our forces are respected. But as we only have one neighbour, and its the ultra powerful US, and they don't consider us a threat (like we actually could be mistaken as one :) ), it is not like we have a lot of ease justifying a lot of hardware.

I think if the US actually wants Canadian committment in their world endeavours, they should just hire us like any other form of sub contracted help eh.

I bet if you hired Canadian personel, and equipped them with those neat US toys, you would actually be better off :)

You guys have good beer too. Then again, compared to American beer, ANY beer is pretty good.
 

Deltapooh

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I think an equally important question is why America seems to hate or at least not trust the world?

In recent years, the United States has increasingly relied more on her physical power rather than seeking moral power through persuation. We seem reluctant to evolve beyond our Cold War "superpower" idealogy, which in many ways mitigated the voice of the world in global affairs. Changes in global conditions has resulted in the expansion of national powers among previously silent allies. With this new-found power comes the greater insistence of respect by America.

The US still insist on treating the world as subordinates not equals at the human level. We are less committed to the very ideals of cooperation and support our fathers and grandfathers established. Though we have not abandoned internationalism by any degree (one can argue we continue to expand it), America is not as committed (at heart) as we once were.

America must evolve beyond the us vs. them argument. Despite what some analysts have said in recent days, Europe combined does not equal the United States. Germany, and the rest of the EU can stand behind France (this was the case used). Yet, it would do little to diminish the severe consequences a deterioration in bi-lateral relations with America might have.

The United States must seek respect, not approval. Respect is an invaluable quality that would permit us to execute those policies that are more controversial. Obtaining it demands a better approach to the international community than has been seen in recent years. I don't advocate abandoning our national interest to serve the world. That would be inhuman. However, our power allows greater latitude and we should exercise more to build alliances of necessity and respect, which are the best form of security.

Foriegn aid is an instrument of foriegn policy. It is probably our most powerful tool. We should not allow this period of arguing to undermine the future. I don't think anyone wants to see what would happen if America simply pulls back into a shell.

I'm not suggesting the US is the only problem. The international community must accept America as the dominant global power and seek to engage it. An unilateral US is not good for anyone, not just because of the damage America might do. It also exposes the vulnerabilities of the international community to respond to such issues, which encourage challenges.

In short, the problem with the world today is we allow selfishness, arrogance, etc to degrade our respect and support for our neighbor and the other man.

(Hope I'm making sense. Sleepy.)
 

Temujin

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Deltapooh said:
I think an equally important question is why America seems to hate or at least not trust the world?

In recent years, the United States has increasingly relied more on her physical power rather than seeking moral power through persuation. We seem reluctant to evolve beyond our Cold War "superpower" idealogy, which in many ways mitigated the voice of the world in global affairs. Changes in global conditions has resulted in the expansion of national powers among previously silent allies. With this new-found power comes the greater insistence of respect by America.

The US still insist on treating the world as subordinates not equals at the human level. We are less committed to the very ideals of cooperation and support our fathers and grandfathers established. Though we have not abandoned internationalism by any degree (one can argue we continue to expand it), America is not as committed (at heart) as we once were.

America must evolve beyond the us vs. them argument. Despite what some analysts have said in recent days, Europe combined does not equal the United States. Germany, and the rest of the EU can stand behind France (this was the case used). Yet, it would do little to diminish the severe consequences a deterioration in bi-lateral relations with America might have.

The United States must seek respect, not approval. Respect is an invaluable quality that would permit us to execute those policies that are more controversial. Obtaining it demands a better approach to the international community than has been seen in recent years. I don't advocate abandoning our national interest to serve the world. That would be inhuman. However, our power allows greater latitude and we should exercise more to build alliances of necessity and respect, which are the best form of security.

Foriegn aid is an instrument of foriegn policy. It is probably our most powerful tool. We should not allow this period of arguing to undermine the future. I don't think anyone wants to see what would happen if America simply pulls back into a shell.

I'm not suggesting the US is the only problem. The international community must accept America as the dominant global power and seek to engage it. An unilateral US is not good for anyone, not just because of the damage America might do. It also exposes the vulnerabilities of the international community to respond to such issues, which encourage challenges.

In short, the problem with the world today is we allow selfishness, arrogance, etc to degrade our respect and support for our neighbor and the other man.

(Hope I'm making sense. Sleepy.)

Testing, testing 1,2,3. Well it seems i'm still here. Your analysis, for the most part, is as accurate as it usually is DP (for the most part).

Although, for me it brings to mind a couple of questions. The relavence of these questions come at a time where we (the world) need answers.

What is Freedom?

and

What is democracy?

If anyone could answer that, without the current neo-con rhetoric, i think the world could actualy start moving in a positive direction.
 

Ivan Rapkinov

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viridomaros said:
which pilot do you prefer there?
i used to watch all the races and used to be a big fan of schumacher but now his car is so good and he's winning so many races that i lost most of my interest in formula 1.
well, personally, both Ralf and Juan Pablo were never really likable imo.

pity we missed out on Button, but as an Aussie, have to say I'm ecstatic Webber is going there :D

back on topic: Perth is definately the place to live :D
 

Deltapooh

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Temujin said:
What is Freedom?
In college, I did a report on defining peace. I quickly discovered the images most identified with peace (absense of war, equilibrium, somekind of social or spiritual utopian state, etc) are really the least help in developing a practical and realistic understanding of the concept.

In many ways, freedom is similar to peace. When we think of the ideal of freedom, we usually imagine the ability to act as one believes. Shortly thereafter we realize this is impossible and begin to establish exceptions, which in the end, contradict the original vision.

Freedom is an ideal best defined individually, based on culture, idealogy, and perception. It should be applied collectively through compromise and consistent re-examination. Its a process of evolution that never stops.

Temujin said:
What is democracy?
Democracy is the political orientation of those who favor government by the people or by their elected representatives.

Again, I believe applying the concept of democracy requires an unique evaluation that can only be achieved by those who will have to live with the results.

Okay, I know you are probably thinking, "you didn't really answer both questions." The reason is it might not be my place. (That and I really haven't figured it out completely myself. :D)
 
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