could this be a viable scenario

[Alan Hume]

I like small scenarios like this to play solitaire. Gives me a chance to increase my rules knowledge and experiment with different tactics. I'm preparing for that day when I will finally have more time to devote to live play either FtF or online w/Skype. Going to a tournament or 10 is definitely on my bucket list. I'd playtest this one Alan.

thanks, I might just take you up on that when I have done a little more work on it and got it straight

of course, saying that it might still be a dud, I just dunno

 

[Alan Hume]

you cannot take the blame for a thread getting derailed - unfortunately this occurs often on these forums.

your premise was straight forward and a good topic to discuss.

thanks, appreciated

 

[Alan Hume]

Definitely not your fault. Look past it. I’d be interested in seeing your design for reasons I mentioned up post.

Al

thanks, okay, I guess I can message it to you here, I just need to finish a couple of things in it yet is all, many thanks

 

[Alan Hume]

Definitely not your fault. Look past it. I’d be interested in seeing your design for reasons I mentioned up post.

Al

thanks, have to say though I hope I didn't piss off Gunner Scott as I think he is a good scenario designer, I loved his Le Franc Tireur Black SS pack, me and my buddy Rod had a lot of fun playing through that

Anyhow, I started a conversation with you and added the scenario there for you, thanks again

 

[Carln0130]

thanks, have to say though I hope I didn't piss off Gunner Scott as I think he is a good scenario designer, I loved his Le Franc Tireur Black SS pack, me and my buddy Rod had a lot of fun playing through that

Anyhow, I started a conversation with you and added the scenario there for you, thanks again

Alan, question for you. Is this an ambush situation, where the Amercians drove up, say as in column in the ASL rules, got punched in the nose and then responded, or did they come in deployed, knowing they were entering the enemy MLR?

 

[Alan Hume]

Alan, question for you. Is this an ambush situation, where the Amercians drove up, say as in column in the ASL rules, got punched in the nose and then responded, or did they come in deployed, knowing they were entering the enemy MLR?

good question, from my reading of the book I take it to have been an ambush, they were barreling along in pursuit of fleeing Germans when they were suddenly fired upon

 

[Eagle4ty]

good question, from my reading of the book I take it to have been an ambush, they were barreling along in pursuit of fleeing Germans when they were suddenly fired upon

Sounds more like a React To Contact situation than a React To Ambush one. In the former you would want to give the surprised side a chance to deploy outside the kill zone and maneuver to engage the attacking force once contact was initiated; In the latter the ambushed force would have to immediately react and either gain fire superiority within the Kill Zone or assault thru the Kill Zone and establish a base of fire & maneuver to break the ambush and reduce the ambush site.

The best approach is to establish a mission/scenario objective (maybe even write it down), of what you wish to achieve with the scenario. This may or may not include your VC objectives as they will be determined later. You should be precise on what type of engagement you are trying to portray: Movement to Contact; React To Contact; React To Ambush; Probe an Enemy Position; Assault; etc. for each side, then attempt to produce a scenario predicated upon your understanding of the given situation. A lot of this I'm sure you do without even taking time to think about it, but it always helps to slow down and put your thoughts in order first. I have done this countless times (though unlike yourself, I have yet to submit a scenario for publication) in setting up training programs/situations for various Armor & Infantry units in training exercises. Just food for thought. (BTW, have you seen the "Opponents Page"? There is a guy in Scotland looking for opponents.)

 

[Paul M. Weir]

A lot of this I'm sure you do without even taking time to think about it, but it always helps to slow down and put your thoughts in order first

This!

 

[Mr Incredible]

good question, from my reading of the book I take it to have been an ambush, they were barreling along in pursuit of fleeing Germans when they were suddenly fired upon

Make the US come on in Convoy with all foot units as PRC with HIP for the Germans.

Might be the leveller you need.

 

[BigAl737]

Make the US come on in Convoy with all foot units as PRC with HIP for the Germans.

Might be the leveller you need.

I was thinking the same thing and will playtest it both ways. With the convoy version, I think it'd be alot like DASL 15 Barkmann's Corner. Interesting thing about convoys though,
E11.3 reduces all passenger capacity to 0. You'd have to have an SSR to carry passengers on your jeep. That rule surprised me.

 

[Carln0130]

I was thinking the same thing and will playtest it both ways. With the convoy version, I think it'd be alot like DASL 15 Barkmann's Corner. Interesting thing about convoys though,
E11.3 reduces all passenger capacity to 0. You'd have to have an SSR to carry passengers on your jeep. That rule surprised me.

I was thinking the same, although I misspoke by saying column, that is for Infantry only. Convoy is correct. However, be VERY cognizant of the last sentence of A9.222. That is a huge detriment for anyone using Impulse movement and and has to be considered when picking your OB's for the scenario design. One HMG Fire Lane chewing its way through a row of trucks in Convoy, could end a scenario with a hot streak, before it begins.

 

[Brian W]

I designed a scenario, Manila John, based on the exact situation--an entire Japanese company in column gets hit with a HMG firelane on turn one, if the Marine player sets up the ambush correctly. As the squad ratio is something like 13 Japanese squads to 3 marine squads, a lot rides on setting up the opening ambush correctly.

 

[Alan Hume]

Sounds more like a React To Contact situation than a React To Ambush one. In the former you would want to give the surprised side a chance to deploy outside the kill zone and maneuver to engage the attacking force once contact was initiated; In the latter the ambushed force would have to immediately react and either gain fire superiority within the Kill Zone or assault thru the Kill Zone and establish a base of fire & maneuver to break the ambush and reduce the ambush site.

The best approach is to establish a mission/scenario objective (maybe even write it down), of what you wish to achieve with the scenario. This may or may not include your VC objectives as they will be determined later. You should be precise on what type of engagement you are trying to portray: Movement to Contact; React To Contact; React To Ambush; Probe an Enemy Position; Assault; etc. for each side, then attempt to produce a scenario predicated upon your understanding of the given situation. A lot of this I'm sure you do without even taking time to think about it, but it always helps to slow down and put your thoughts in order first. I have done this countless times (though unlike yourself, I have yet to submit a scenario for publication) in setting up training programs/situations for various Armor & Infantry units in training exercises. Just food for thought. (BTW, have you seen the "Opponents Page"? There is a guy in Scotland looking for opponents.)

Many thanks for taking the time to give me your thoughts, much appreciated
there's a lot to think about there for sure, I think you're right in that it probably is more a react to contact situation than a react to ambush but, playing it like that allows me to let the Germans set up HIP which gives them at least some chance of survival so I'm leaning in that direction at the moment, saying that, one of the guys here on the forum is very kindly going to run through it for me so I guess a lot of it will depend on what he thinks really

I haven't checked the opponents page to be honest, I'll go and have a look, wonder if I know the guy already (I knowmost of the Scottish ASL players but I don't think I know all of them)

thanks again

 

[Alan Hume]

thanks guys for the input, VERY much appreciated, as I say, I guess I'll know more after it's been looked over
hoping it pans out to a viable scenario

 

[Alan Hume]

I designed a scenario, Manila John, based on the exact situation--an entire Japanese company in column gets hit with a HMG firelane on turn one, if the Marine player sets up the ambush correctly. As the squad ratio is something like 13 Japanese squads to 3 marine squads, a lot rides on setting up the opening ambush correctly.

that does sound pretty much like the same scenario idea
how did yours work out then? was it a playable scenario even with the difference in numbers? I'm hoping it was so that mine might work out as well

 

[Brian W]

was it a playable scenario even with the difference in numbers?

It is a night scenario, and has not been played much. In playtesting, it worked, but tended to have extreme results. Sometimes the ambush didn't go well, and then the Japanese were all over the marines, who were still really hard to kill, but had a hard time stopping the Japanese from exiting the board. Sometimes the initial attack did too well and the Japanese got butchered (as they did historically). Having a Heroic 10-3 leader directing the MG can have that effect.

When the scenario worked "right" the Japanese lost a lot of units initially, then deployed and the scenario became more fluid, although working in the jungle at night with one path and wire still tends to bog things down.

 

[Alan Hume]

It sounds like it worked at least some of the time though, I'd be happy with that to be honest, close enough is sometimes good enough

 

[RandyT0001]

Make the US come on in Convoy with all foot units as PRC with HIP for the Germans.

Might be the leveller you need.

I think that using the Convoy rules would be inaccurate to the historical context (as provided by Alan). The American vanguard is pursuing the Germans to find out where they intend to turn and fight, either as an delaying ambush (which this appears to be) or as a set defensive line. I would not see this as an attack on a convoy like those that occurred on the 7th Armored Division's artillery trains during their redeployment to St Vith in BOB.

 

[Alan Hume]

I think that using the Convoy rules would be inaccurate to the historical context (as provided by Alan). The American vanguard is pursuing the Germans to find out where they intend to turn and fight, either as an delaying ambush (which this appears to be) or as a set defensive line. I would not see this as an attack on a convoy like those that occurred on the 7th Armored Division's artillery trains during their redeployment to St Vith in BOB.

Thanks you are spot on, the Americans were sending out what they could to chase the fleeing Germans

 

[Mr Incredible]

If, until contact with the Germans, they were chasing them but still driving down the road like a convoy, that is a multi-hex stack.

They aren't chugging along like an artillery train or fuel convoy but driving along at a fair clip but on the alert for baddies.

Maybe change E11.251 1) from "Known enemy ground unit" to "enemy ground unit", no extra MP for the convoy vehicle per E11.2 and allow the Convoy to disband if it also sees the Roadblock.