comparison pic of various ASL aircraft counters

thedrake

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Putting away my new SKEP and had a few ofthe A/C counters out to look at and compare so decided to take a pic and post here (see attachment.)

From top row down there is:
-MMP German FB and Stuka
-HoB Orsha mod "tank buster" Stuka and Kreta mod Ju-52
-HoB Orsha mod Sturmovik and HoB Berlin mod FB
-BFP B&J mod British Typhoon and BFP Cobra mod P47
-CH Ponyri mod Stuka and CH Pelelieu mod Corsair

Like how the newer A/C counters from the various third party manufacturers look compared to the MMP "official" ones.Hope to see more of these in future.

Did buy the WBW A/C pack that was on ebay a few days ago on 2nd Chance Offer so will take pics of those to see how they compare and post those here when they arrive.
Did not include the ones from View From the Trenches but they can be found below:
http://vftt.co.uk/vfttpdf/vfttse98co.pdf

What are folks opinions about the various A/C counters?
What would people like to see in addition to the ones available so far? (B-29's and B-52's might be a bit much though....)
Which publisher would you want to do additional A/C?

Thx,
Mark
 

DaveStory

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In regards to this an all other items (mapboards, scenario cards, etc), I'm for any change/design that provides additional functionality to gameplay. Otherwise, eye-candy is not a priority for me. Cluttering the counter with vendor initials (ie, CH, HOB) or a detailed drawing in lieu of a silhouette, is more distracting than anything else.
 

Fred Ingram

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In regards to this an all other items (mapboards, scenario cards, etc), I'm for any change/design that provides additional functionality to gameplay. Otherwise, eye-candy is not a priority for me. Cluttering the counter with vendor initials (ie, CH, HOB) or a detailed drawing in lieu of a silhouette, is more distracting than anything else.
Agreed

especially since air support counters come up once in about every 50 or so games for me - they could be a button from my wife's sewing cabinet and it would work out OK as well
 
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ASRomafan

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What are folks opinions about the various A/C counters?

What would people like to see in addition to the ones available so far? (B-29's and B-52's might be a bit much though....)

Which publisher would you want to do additional A/C?

Thx,
Mark
Not sure about others but one thing that I loved about wargames and kept me into them as computer games became popular and detailed, were the physical components and pushing counters across maps. There is no law that says components have to be anything more than simply functional but given a choice who wouldn't want something that is attractive, detailed and pleasing the eye.

Obviously I'd love to see the Henschel Hs-129 in counter form. :)

any and all as long they bring something new or continue to raise the bar in quality and aesthetics.
 

custardpie

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I do not mind the nice graphics and like to see them. I would not want this to be at the expense of ease of play. Certanly the new a/c's make the originals look old and tired. I thought the ASL A/C counters a step backwards when they chaged from the old SL days.
If it can be played am happy

Ian
 

Blind Sniper

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I don't see nothing wrong if we can have nice counters, looking other games the ASL counters have a pretty old design.
Never played La Bataille Series? Amazing counters and still functional.

I don't think insert some colour or detail would be eye-candy, look the counters in the picture, they are still perfectly functional and simply more nice (no useless distractions).

Said that, I love this game not for his counters.
Would be easy improve this old style concept but I think is intentional and doesn't matter, I think I am in the minority but this is the less important thing that I'd like to see improved about ASL.
 

Michael Dorosh

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Hard to be against aircraft-type specific graphics, but I agree with the Drake about watermarks and publisher's monograms. The watermarks are distracting/unattractive, and the monograms are potentially confusing. "What's CH the abbreviation for again?" "I think it's short for "charge"." "No, seriously - Critical Hit? Is there an increased chance of an Aerial Critical Hit?" "What's an Aerial Critical Hit?" "Look it up in the rulebook." "Shouldn't it say ACH?"
 

trevpr1

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While I can see many love this sort of thing, it is not a draw for me.

I find the expenditure of time and effort making fancy counters with a lot of aircraft/weapon types a bit of a waste. The air support rules are not the most elegant in ASL and I have found them to be a crapshoot at best. I've played a game where two of my opponent's planes rolled high enough for mistaken attack and two of his crucial Shermans were lost, Neither felt it was a good playing experience. Countless times in contrast, the air support hits nothing but dirt.

I always felt that the generic counters were sufficient. Obviolusy a '44 FB will pack more punch than a '39, but the difference between bombs and rockets? Not relevant to a ground combat game in my opinion, any more than the effect of OBA FFE should be different based on whether a mortar, howitzer or regular artillery piece fired the shell.

Having the full colour plane depiction is also a waste. They just look odd compared to the monotone (or dual toned) counters on the ground. For me, colour should stand out and be relevant, e.g. the red for large target modifier, all armament sharing a B11 number, a FT or perhaps even denoting Pz Lehr units. The most recent use of colour is on assault engineers units with the tiny red demo charge symbol. All very subtle and in keeping. As I've said before, more colour on ASL counters makes them harder to read and presents problems for my regular FtF oppo, who is colour blind.

The only thing I miss is the old COI Stuka dive bomber counter, which had a forward profile to denote it being a DB. Otherwise they're fine.

One thing I would give a nod to was the detail and accuracy of the Typhoon counters in B&J. They used the tropical roundels for the RAF and it's colonial sisters. No red roundel in the middle.
 
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JRKrejsa

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I like the idea of aircraft specific counters- why not, it's a game of inches, we're very detailed for everthing else.

The HOB counters- from Kreta, and all the BFP counters are very nice. More stuff like that please.

I don't really notice the watermark, maybe its just me.
 

dlazov

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I like the watermarks, and I like the newer graphics and I like it when the counters show BFP, CH, HOB or whatever from the TPP, since I store them in their own box, no biggy.
 

Paul M. Weir

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While I can see many love this sort of thing, it is not a draw for me.
I always felt that the generic counters were sufficient. Obviolusy a '44 FB will pack more punch than a '39, but the difference between bombs and rockets? Not relevant to a ground combat game in my opinion, any more than the effect of OBA FFE should be different based on whether a mortar, howitzer or regular artillery piece fired the shell.
If you have rockets and bombs then you have at least 2 chances of doing something useful and rockets can be doled out a bit. Overall less of a all or nothing crapshoot. There were also a few aircraft that had more deadly AT weapons than the generic .30", .50" and 20mm guns.

I would liked to have seen a B-25H with 75 and 8 forward MG or B-26J with 12 forward MG (16-24 FP) as well as a bombload.
 

Paul M. Weir

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oh that is GREAT!! As if I needed any more reason to look forward to the next BFP releases!

edit - only a +1 modifier to AA fire??? Wasn't that thing like a tank with wings lol
Slow and stupid with the manoeuvrability of a barge?
 

'Ol Fezziwig

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...but I agree with the Drake about watermarks and publisher's monograms. The watermarks are distracting/unattractive, and the monograms are potentially confusing...

Yet entirely necessary for copyright purposes.
 

hayman

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I've always seen the aircraft rules as similar to those for Off Board Artillery; quite abstracted ways of putting down large amounts of firepower. I don't see the upgrading of the aircraft graphics as adding anything to the game; nice chrome, but not necessary.
 
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