Chess clock in tournament

hongkongwargamer

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I don't go to many tourneys anymore since I got sick 5 years ago BUT from the 30+ years I was at tournaments, my feelings are that slow players are only an occasional problem, very few times (twice in tourneys) that I've actually run into that problem. Most players I have found to have a good enough pace and the real good ones always seem to be a turn or 2 ahead and are never a problem for pace of play. Forget the damn chess clock, you don't need that, just do what Gary Trezza used to do when he ran a tourney, you had 5 to 6 hours to finish a round and all the scenario choices should be easily finished in that time frame so when getting close to the deadline, Gary would come over with his penalty flag and threaten adjudication about 30 minutes before the deadline. That was usually enough to get the slower player moving, if not, Gary, maybe with some help from Steve Pleva would analyze the gameboard and award the win to who they thought was closer to the VC. Simple method and does not drive everyone crazy with a chess clock most don't want or need. Stop staring at the damn board and move a piece for crying out loud!
I remember Paul Sidhu giving tips and suggestions to his opponents during the game even. He's probably not the only one, just the one at the table closest to me.
 

Vic Provost

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I remember Paul Sidhu giving tips and suggestions to his opponents during the game even. He's probably not the only one, just the one at the table closest to me.
Yes Jackson, Paul is often very helpful, he has beaten me twice in tourneys and both losses were not all that close, he is that good a player and such a pleasure to play, nice guy for sure with vast knowledge of the game, he has helped me with playtesting for Dispatches for over a decade now. Any regional tourney up this way will have Paul as one of the favorites if he is there. He Steve Pleva and Ron Duenskie are the cream of the crop for ASL play from the New York metro region.
 

Actionjick

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I don't go to many tourneys anymore since I got sick 5 years ago BUT from the 30+ years I was at tournaments, my feelings are that slow players are only an occasional problem, very few times (twice in tourneys) that I've actually run into that problem. Most players I have found to have a good enough pace and the real good ones always seem to be a turn or 2 ahead and are never a problem for pace of play. Forget the damn chess clock, you don't need that, just do what Gary Trezza used to do when he ran a tourney, you had 5 to 6 hours to finish a round and all the scenario choices should be easily finished in that time frame so when getting close to the deadline, Gary would come over with his penalty flag and threaten adjudication about 30 minutes before the deadline. That was usually enough to get the slower player moving, if not, Gary, maybe with some help from Steve Pleva would analyze the gameboard and award the win to who they thought was closer to the VC. Simple method and does not drive everyone crazy with a chess clock most don't want or need. Stop staring at the damn board and move a piece for crying out loud!
And the choir says Amen!
 

hongkongwargamer

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I don't go to many tourneys anymore since I got sick 5 years ago BUT from the 30+ years I was at tournaments, my feelings are that slow players are only an occasional problem, very few times (twice in tourneys) that I've actually run into that problem. Most players I have found to have a good enough pace and the real good ones always seem to be a turn or 2 ahead and are never a problem for pace of play. Forget the damn chess clock, you don't need that, just do what Gary Trezza used to do when he ran a tourney, you had 5 to 6 hours to finish a round and all the scenario choices should be easily finished in that time frame so when getting close to the deadline, Gary would come over with his penalty flag and threaten adjudication about 30 minutes before the deadline. That was usually enough to get the slower player moving, if not, Gary, maybe with some help from Steve Pleva would analyze the gameboard and award the win to who they thought was closer to the VC. Simple method and does not drive everyone crazy with a chess clock most don't want or need. Stop staring at the damn board and move a piece for crying out loud!
I gotta say. I was hugely inspired by the Albany tourney where we met. That along with "Malaya Madmen" (Singapore) & "Gin Drinker's Revenge" (Hong Kong) really pushed my "attitude" towards what the Asian tournaments should be.

  • I don't believe "slow players" at tournaments are a huge issue or even a common issue. This of course doesn't detract from someone's experience when they do encounter a "slow player". Even when they do, from this thread, it doesn't sound like they are "maliciously" slow, just "naturally" slow.
    • No chess clocks necessary.
  • I don't see players not agreeing to adjudication or generally act to degrade other people (friends) experience at a tournament.
  • I see players there to teach, to learn, to laugh hysterially over the dice, to see how old friends are doing and to line up new opponents for the year ahead. I am lucky enough to have two of the Asia tourney champs to be my regular opponents.
  • We got an upward of 12 company sponsors at our tourneys but no one ever get bent out of shape over placement nor prices. We wanted to win but it's always friendship over everything.
  • Costing vs attendance is a issue that effectively cut down on possibilities for tournaments, as we can also see from another thread.
Personally, I see VASL tournaments as a good thing but it's really NOT a replacement for the experience you get from a good FtF tournament setup. The richness of ASL comes from being in the presence of great people/ players.

I hope FtF tournaments get bigger and bigger as a feature in more ASL'rs lives. I honestly do.

PS Anyway - tired. Can someone please wish me a "Happy Birthday"?
 
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Actionjick

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I gotta say. I was hugely inspired by the Albany tourney where we met. That along with "Malaya Madmen" (Singapore) & "Gin Drinker's Revenge" (Hong Kong) really pushed my "attitude" towards what the Asian tournaments should be.

  • I don't believe "slow players" at tournaments are a huge issue or even a common issue. This of course doesn't detract from someone's experience when they do encounter a "slow player". Even when they do, from this thread, it doesn't sound like they are "maliciously" slow, just "naturally" slow.
    • No chess clocks necessary.
  • I don't see players not agreeing to adjudication or generally act to degrade other people (friends) experience at a tournament.
  • I see players there to teach, to learn, to laugh hysterially over the dice, to see how old friends are doing and to line up new opponents for the year ahead. I am lucky enough to have two of the Asia tourney champs to be my regular opponents.
  • We got an upward of 12 company sponsors at our tourneys but no one ever get bent out of shape over placement nor prices. We wanted to win but it's always friendship over everything.
  • Costing vs attendance is a issue that effectively cut down on possibilities for tournaments, as we can also see from another thread.
Personally, I see VASL tournaments as a good thing but it's really NOT a replacement for the experience you get from a good FtF tournament setup. The richness of ASL comes from being in the presence of great people/ players.

I hope FtF tournaments get bigger and bigger as a feature in more ASL'rs lives. I honestly do.

PS Anyway - tired. Can someone please wish me a "Happy Birthday"?
Happy Birthday from Actiondebbie and me!🤗🤗🥰🥰😘
 

von Marwitz

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There are a quite a number of "new" players who are not exactly new - but folks who used to play decades ago but rejoined ASL. There are a good number of them on Discord (I bet you others are on FB). We talk about the benefits of joining tournaments from time to time especially for newbies but they are positively concerned about what they read on GS (they don't have to sign up to read all this) and "urban legends" of what the tourney scene is like.

Invariably they are worried about not being good enough .. and having to put up the expenses but ending up subjecting themselves to some form of hostility because they are not up to par.
Whether new or coming back to the hobby, I would not be worried about not being good enough.

Back in the days, before I attended my first tournament, I had played exactly one single, very small 4.5 Turn scenario of ASL against an opponent. Besides that, all I had done was playing solitaire and teaching the game to myself - with all that entails.

I believe that even very fast players acknowledge, that under such circumstances nothing else than slow play can be expected. My personal experience regarding my treatment back then and by observation later is, that almost all experienced guys (fast or slow) are willing and open to treat such a game more as a tutorial than a competitive game. Needless to say, I did not win a single scenario during my first tournament but yet I had so much fun, that I am still sticking to ASL 25 years later.

So, this goes out to any newbies out here, to those returning to the hobby, and to those who have never attended a tournament:

Don't worry about not being good enough or not fast enough. Take the dive and give attending a tournament a try. Altogether, the vast majority of players (of all playing styles) I have met, are a jolly bunch and welcoming.

von Marwitz
 
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von Marwitz

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Wow! That's all I got. Calm down people. It's just a frickin game and most players don't even attend events.
You are right.
I am sorry I reacted as I did.
This is why I really respect @Robin Reeve :

Sometimes he feels irked about some remark and nobody has seen it coming or really understands why. But almost always he calms down after a little while and is willing to apologize - even in cases where no apology would be necessary. There is only a very few who act like this.

von Marwitz
 

von Marwitz

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Personally, I see VASL tournaments as a good thing but it's really NOT a replacement for the experience you get from a good FtF tournament setup. The richness of ASL comes from being in the presence of great people/ players.
Well said! 👍

And herzlichen Glückwunsch zum Geburtstag.

von Marwitz
 

Vic Provost

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I gotta say. I was hugely inspired by the Albany tourney where we met. That along with "Malaya Madmen" (Singapore) & "Gin Drinker's Revenge" (Hong Kong) really pushed my "attitude" towards what the Asian tournaments should be.

  • I don't believe "slow players" at tournaments are a huge issue or even a common issue. This of course doesn't detract from someone's experience when they do encounter a "slow player". Even when they do, from this thread, it doesn't sound like they are "maliciously" slow, just "naturally" slow.
    • No chess clocks necessary.
  • I don't see players not agreeing to adjudication or generally act to degrade other people (friends) experience at a tournament.
  • I see players there to teach, to learn, to laugh hysterially over the dice, to see how old friends are doing and to line up new opponents for the year ahead. I am lucky enough to have two of the Asia tourney champs to be my regular opponents.
  • We got an upward of 12 company sponsors at our tourneys but no one ever get bent out of shape over placement nor prices. We wanted to win but it's always friendship over everything.
  • Costing vs attendance is a issue that effectively cut down on possibilities for tournaments, as we can also see from another thread.
Personally, I see VASL tournaments as a good thing but it's really NOT a replacement for the experience you get from a good FtF tournament setup. The richness of ASL comes from being in the presence of great people/ players.

I hope FtF tournaments get bigger and bigger as a feature in more ASL'rs lives. I honestly do.

PS Anyway - tired. Can someone please wish me a "Happy Birthday"?
Happy Birthday indeed Jackson! Meeting you as well was a highlite for me as well and glad I have an ASL friend in the far east.
We gotta play VASL sometime for sure. Send an e-mail to me in a few weeks after I deal with #55 going out next week and I would love to roll some VASL dice with you sometime. Thanks for all the support and interest you give the newsletter, much appreciated, Vic.
 

daniel zucker

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Slow Players used to get me annoyed. Then I realized a few important things.
first; I wanted ASL to be more than it was. I wanted a "more combat like experience game" [whatever the hell that meant??]
second; that slow player was showing there natural thinking ability to react to a combat situation, and if this were 'ream life' (TM.), he'd be dead.

Conclusions: It's the difference between the quick and the dead? IDK. I'm a lousy player I don't have a full grasp of the basic rules. I want to have 'fun' when playing and feel that a fast, quick game is more fun than the perfect (or even a good?) game IDK.
ASL is a game, and the plays the thing.
 

hongkongwargamer

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Happy Birthday indeed Jackson! Meeting you as well was a highlite for me as well and glad I have an ASL friend in the far east.
We gotta play VASL sometime for sure. Send an e-mail to me in a few weeks after I deal with #55 going out next week and I would love to roll some VASL dice with you sometime. Thanks for all the support and interest you give the newsletter, much appreciated, Vic.
Copy that, wilco
 

von Marwitz

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Slow Players used to get me annoyed. Then I realized a few important things.
first; I wanted ASL to be more than it was. I wanted a "more combat like experience game" [whatever the hell that meant??]
second; that slow player was showing there natural thinking ability to react to a combat situation, and if this were 'ream life' (TM.), he'd be dead.

Conclusions: It's the difference between the quick and the dead? IDK. I'm a lousy player I don't have a full grasp of the basic rules. I want to have 'fun' when playing and feel that a fast, quick game is more fun than the perfect (or even a good?) game IDK.
ASL is a game, and the plays the thing.
You raise an important point.

This is that it is possible to play ASL in completely different styles that might even be mutually exclusive.

Some want the quick and fast moving game or a more "combat like experience game" [whatever the hell you mean by that!! ;)].

Some want the analytical game of optimized moves and for these time is not an issue

Between these, there are endless shades.


It is only in an environment which requires deadlines or if people of mutually exclusive styles of play come together, that issues arise.

von Marwitz
 

PabloGS

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I remember Paul Sidhu giving tips and suggestions to his opponents during the game even. He's probably not the only one, just the one at the table closest to me.
Paul is going to kick your ass anyway, so I guess he just wants to feel less guilty about pushing the knife in. A great guy indeed!
 

bendizoid

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I gotta say. I was hugely inspired by the Albany tourney where we met. That along with "Malaya Madmen" (Singapore) & "Gin Drinker's Revenge" (Hong Kong) really pushed my "attitude" towards what the Asian tournaments should be.

  • I don't believe "slow players" at tournaments are a huge issue or even a common issue. This of course doesn't detract from someone's experience when they do encounter a "slow player". Even when they do, from this thread, it doesn't sound like they are "maliciously" slow, just "naturally" slow.
    • No chess clocks necessary.
  • I don't see players not agreeing to adjudication or generally act to degrade other people (friends) experience at a tournament.
  • I see players there to teach, to learn, to laugh hysterially over the dice, to see how old friends are doing and to line up new opponents for the year ahead. I am lucky enough to have two of the Asia tourney champs to be my regular opponents.
  • We got an upward of 12 company sponsors at our tourneys but no one ever get bent out of shape over placement nor prices. We wanted to win but it's always friendship over everything.
  • Costing vs attendance is a issue that effectively cut down on possibilities for tournaments, as we can also see from another thread.
Personally, I see VASL tournaments as a good thing but it's really NOT a replacement for the experience you get from a good FtF tournament setup. The richness of ASL comes from being in the presence of great people/ players.

I hope FtF tournaments get bigger and bigger as a feature in more ASL'rs lives. I honestly do.

PS Anyway - tired. Can someone please wish me a "Happy Birthday"?
Were me and Stanley there? Happy birthday +2.
 

PresterJohn

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If the organiser is going to put a chess clock on your table then you can use it by attaching a clip-on frame to hold up player name cards. Anybody walking by can see your name and that of your opponent. Sadly you wouldn't have access to the buttons on the chess clock but you would have a simple route to introductions in between games.
 

stuh42asl

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And this is why I almost only play the HASL's , a serious campaign game allows for serious planning, and asset management, and real objectives.. Playing a scenario for 5-6 turns is not a real assessment of a battle. Most times the winning side ends up with a few MMC or vehicles.. and in actual real battle assessments a half platoon of men with a disabled AFV is not going to be able to hold any objective.Especially when the enemy usually counter attack with enough force to blow your guys off of it.. Second you have a bad campaign day .. then you can bounce back. even the best leaders have the " "do not expect your plans to last past the first enemy bullet.." stage..It is enough to manage a plan in a scenario with a lot of random chaos happening per turn that to expect you to also manage a chess clock as well, it is to much for most of us, many of which are veterans who in their career spent too much time playing hot potato with live grenades, diving into foxholes when one of your buddies annoyed the enemy enough to try to shoot your pants full of holes..or for some ,playing dodge the tank when caught in the open..(scary thought , that one). But if I can mange to get enough time to play on line( but with 15 year old twins ) that is not gonna happen for a while.
I would love to return and just play the HASL'S.
 
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